Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2022 - Off-season

[TheDoldrums]

I don't understand the satisfaction with the third line of this team, or specifically Kampf and Engvall. Compare them to what used to be our third line and there is no comparison. This team is NOT stronger now, it is weaker, and it is caused by adjusting for salary cap issues to make it work. There is a big drop-off between the second and third lines, and it WILL matter down the road. Third line centers are crucial links in the chain. Why do people think Kampf is sufficient?

I honestly don't know how anyone watched the team last year and came to this conclusion. The 3rd line got tough defensive starts against good players and held their own. They were consistently effective, which is why there was very little movement there.

Meanwhile the second line was an enigma all year, not driving play despite getting cushy offensive starts against weaker opponents. It was a constant struggle to find a LW to make Tavares/Nylander work better, which never really happened. They were awful defensively.

I watched every game they played and yeah I'm baffled anyone thinks our 2nd line was good and our 3rd line was the problem.

 

[bbgobie]

There are a number of current NHLers who played on that 2018 team. The eight guilty players deserve to be punished so that it never happens again, but hockey Canada chose to try to keep it hush hush and buy their way out of it.

I'm not an expert on the case or anything, but it sounds like the accuser did not want to name the players to the investigators Hockey Canada hired. So it would be pretty hard for them to punish them as they claim to not know the identity of the 8 people involved. Its possible other players might've given them names, only they and the investigators know.

 

[Fogelhund]

I don't understand the satisfaction with the third line of this team, or specifically Kampf and Engvall. Compare them to what used to be our third line and there is no comparison. This team is NOT stronger now, it is weaker, and it is caused by adjusting for salary cap issues to make it work. There is a big drop-off between the second and third lines, and it WILL matter down the road. Third line centers are crucial links in the chain. Why do people think Kampf is sufficient?

There isn't satisfaction. Kampf is a very good 4th line C. There have been many proposals and discussions to upgrade the 3C. Engvall however is at least a good third line player.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

Other tidbit from 32 thoughts
-Friedman believes the Leafs offered Jack 2.7Mx3 years at some point this season. Believes the Leafs are not comfortable offering Jack high money or term and Jack countered much higher and they simply never revisited the negotiation since and he isn't expected to return

 

[Stephen]

I'd love to see Kessel again in the blue and white, but think that relationship with the front office likely burned at this point

Feels like a lifetime ago. Maybe with his new family with Toronto roots he’ll want to come for a victory lap.

 

[aingefan]

I’d hope Kerfoot for Murray and Pinto with 25% retention, and someone in the middle retaining the other 25%. Not sure who pays the cost on the other 25%?
Murray and Pinto for approximately Kerfoot’s cap hit gets a goalie and a good piece moving forward, preserves the cap space, Kerfoot saves Ottawa some money.

 

[Stand Witness]

Friedman is saying he'll be shocked if Jack isn't an Oiler.

Serious question: How was this not tampering?

Because every team does it and you don’t complain when you are doing it too.

——

Freidman in 32 Thoughts makes it seem like Murray to the Leafs is all but done.

 

[Thornbury]

There isn't satisfaction. Kampf is a very good 4th line C. There have been many proposals and discussions to upgrade the 3C. Engvall however is at least a good third line player.

I would classify Kampf as a very good 4th line centre and a serviceable 3rd liner. One role they do need to fill in free agency is a good option for bottom 6 C. Engvall can play a role on the 3rd line. Fifteen goals and ability to play on the PK is pretty viable in that role.

 

[Fogelhund]

Listening to 32 thoughts
-Ottawa considered buying out Murray, he wasn't healthy enough at the time to be elligble
-Murray vetoed his trade to Buffalo. He desires toronto or edmonton
-In the cancelled trade with Buff - Ottawa would've retained 25%

This is confusing. Murray's health is a serious question mark, and it's bad enough that he couldn't be bought out. But he's vetoed a trade so "he thinks" he's going to heal??? I can see some appeal from the Leafs, if he's permanently on LTIR, and the return is good enough in assets to go along with him.

He's dealing with post-concussion syndrome, which is a pretty grey area to begin with. You'd have to think "if" we pull the trigger, we are confident he will recover (or confident he won't), and that we find a way to significantly reduce the cap hit, and some serious incentive to take him on.

 

[ER89]

Habs fans today on twitter

Guess the new crack infused toothpaste came out in quebec.

 

[Duffman955]

Anyone have a summary on Freidmans latest 32 thoughts?

 

[VanW27]

I don't understand the satisfaction with the third line of this team, or specifically Kampf and Engvall. Compare them to what used to be our third line and there is no comparison. This team is NOT stronger now, it is weaker, and it is caused by adjusting for salary cap issues to make it work. There is a big drop-off between the second and third lines, and it WILL matter down the road. Third line centers are crucial links in the chain. Why do people think Kampf is sufficient?

They're poor 3rd liners, but excellent 4th liners.

With Spezza in the fold (as great as he was for us), it forced us to run a offensive and sheltered 4th line.

With Spezza I'm the FO you can run a prototypical defense and Pk 4th line and Engvall-Kampf can make up 2/3 of a pretty good 4th line like that.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Matt Murray will play with the number 30 on his jersey for the Leafs this season. Källgren at 50 and Woll at 60.

So far...

 

[ER89]

I'm sorry but this whole murray thing to be our goalie is so f***ing dumb. Like these guys would have to give us norris for it to make some sense. Like formenton et al are NOT worth it to have a goalie like matt murray backstop this team. He's worse than jack and freddy. And obiously the sens wouldn't give us josh norris. THis makes absolutely no sense.

 

[Sypher04]

I'm sorry but this whole murray thing to be our goalie is so f***ing dumb. Like these guys would have to give us norris for it to make some sense. Like formenton et al are NOT worth it to have a goalie like matt murray backstop this team. He's worse than jack and freddy. And obiously the sens wouldn't give us josh norris. THis makes absolutely no sense.

He definitely plays on a much much worse team defensively. If Murray is healthy, which admittedly is a huge if, I’m not sure how big that divide really is. Campbell has plenty of his own questions

 

[Fogelhund]

I’d hope Kerfoot for Murray and Pinto with 25% retention, and someone in the middle retaining the other 25%. Not sure who pays the cost on the other 25%?
Murray and Pinto for approximately Kerfoot’s cap hit gets a goalie and a good piece moving forward, preserves the cap space, Kerfoot saves Ottawa some money.

I don't want to trade Kerfoot to Ottawa. I'd like to trade him elsewhere, and have a real return. Something like Kerfoot and Holl, to NJD for Blackwood and McLeod. While it's Murray and Pinto to Toronto (with retention on Murray) for future considerations, or a 6th round pick or something.

 

[ER89]

He definitely plays on a much much worse team defensively. If Murray is healthy, which admittedly is a huge if, I’m not sure how big that divide really is. Campbell have plenty of his own questions

I don't disagree which is why i find it crazy that we're going after a guy who has even more questions than jack. Like dubas shat the bed here and I generally like him. We're now backed into a corner with no fking goalie.

 

[aingefan]

Matt Murray will play with the number 30 on his jersey for the Leafs this season. Källgren at 50 and Woll at 60.

So far...

You’re saying the second tandem goalie target wears #40?
I don’t know who that is.

 

[Sypher04]

I don't disagree which is why i find it crazy that we're going after a guy who has even more questions than jack. Like dubas shat the bed here and I generally like him. We're now backed into a corner with no fking goalie.

My point was really that I think their question marks are different and largely cancel each other out. Murray may have a bit more injury question, not that Campbell didn’t have some of his own, but Campbell probably isn’t signing for less than 5x5 which is very very risky

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

This is confusing. Murray's health is a serious question mark, and it's bad enough that he couldn't be bought out. But he's vetoed a trade so "he thinks" he's going to heal??? I can see some appeal from the Leafs, if he's permanently on LTIR, and the return is good enough in assets to go along with him.

He's dealing with post-concussion syndrome, which is a pretty grey area to begin with. You'd have to think "if" we pull the trigger, we are confident he will recover (or confident he won't), and that we find a way to significantly reduce the cap hit, and some serious incentive to take him on.

EF sounded very unsure if Murray will be healthy enough to play. The Leafs were allowed to review medical records but jeez, it sounds unpredictable to say the least

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Trade 1
Murray @ 40% retained
Pinto
Ottawa 2nd
For
Kerfoot
Holl

Rfa
Engvall 1.6 x 2
sandin 1.4 x 2

Ufa
Marchment 3.5 x 4
Lyubushkin 1.75 x 2
Comrie 1.2 x 2
kubalik 2.25 x 1
zar 1.2 x 2

Bunting Matthews Marner
Marchment Tavares Nylander
Kubalik Pinto Engvall
Robertson Kampf Zar

Reilly Liljegren
Muzzin brodie
Sandin Gio

Murray
Comrie

 

[aingefan]

I don't want to trade Kerfoot to Ottawa. I'd like to trade him elsewhere, and have a real return. Something like Kerfoot and Holl, to NJD for Blackwood and McLeod. While it's Murray and Pinto to Toronto (with retention on Murray) for future considerations, or a 6th round pick or something.

Well, that would be great but the reported Buffalo deal still had Ottawa getting #16.
I’m just not seeing a trade where Ottawa retains and gives up a nice piece without *something* of value going back.
Kerfoot makes sense because his bonus is paid.
I might be off on value overall, but OTT will want something.

 

[DaveMatthew]

You’re saying the second tandem goalie target wears #40?
I don’t know who that is.

 

[Apex Predator]

Nobody knows what Dubas’ orignal plan coming into this off season was for the goalie situation but I can’t imagine Murray was in the mix.

That sweetener really needs to be worth it to gamble with Murray as potentially a starter or 1A/1B.

 

[Cor]

Friedman on the 32 thoughts Podcast:

”once the Leafs and Sens got close on this deal, the Leafs wanted to take a look at him, and i believe the Senators have allowed that to happen, so that’s what I think we are waiting for here - just to make sure there’s no medical issue”

As of 8pm Sunday night, Friedman isn’t sure of the logistics - how much Ottawa will retain, if there’s a sweetener, if there’s a third team, etc

Friedman also says Jack Campbell is “very expected” to sign with Edmonton, while the Washington Capitals are heavily expected to sign Darcy Kuemper