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GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART VIII

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Would you trade Mrazek for Koskinen (pending UFA, retained to equal salary) 1 for 1?

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Nylanderthal said:
They can easily add a long term piece and cross that bridge in the summer. Lots of potential moving parts to move cap around. Kerfoot, mrazek, Holl, dermott are all guys who can be shuffled out to fit other players rather easily.
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Also quite a few raises to fit in plus some really big raises not too far down the road. Going to be really tight
 
Shooter2x said:
How does he get it exactly? Arizona laughs in our face if we tell them we want Jakob but not willing to part with one of Sandin or Lil, who both have inferior skillsets to Jakob overall.

Put it this way, if people enjoy how Sandin looks on the Leafs, just wait until you can see what Jakob can do on a competitive team with skill.
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I've been driving the get Chychrun train. If it takes Sandin to get him then I'm all for it. It won't cost Sandin to get the other 3. So he gets it.

And the other way he gets it is the pairings. Anybody but Chychrun in they are spot on. If it's Chychrun in and Sandin out then Dermott takes his spot. And I'm perfectly fine with that.
 
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Ziggdiezan said:
Also quite a few raises to fit in plus some really big raises not too far down the road. Going to be really tight
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Rielly’s raise is covered by the $1m cap increase and the Phil kessel retention coming off the books. There’s the goaltending and bridging the two young D. Otherwise it’s not a very crazy list for this off-season.
What big raises down the road? Matthews and Nylander expire at the same time as muzzin and Brodie, and that’s not even after next season, but the season after.
They’re set up beautifully and there’s room to adjust the look of the team without sacrificing much up top.
 
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Avilaj07 said:
Maybe read my follow up comment regarding Chychrun and you would see I actually have Sandin in the deal. Maybe read the posts before commenting.
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It's not that serious, but I mean since you brought up previous posts, you should at least be consistent then with your posts so that people don't have to go and read 3-4 of them for the whole picture. The one I saw clearly says we keep sandin and Lil while keeping Jakob an option so.......
 
Leafs mailbag: Enjoying Auston Matthews and talking trade | The Star

QUESTION: Hi, Kevin. Still very much enjoy your columns, although I haven’t weighed in for a while. There hasn’t been much to add, comment wise other than the obvious.

Right now the Buds are in a slump, losing five of their last seven tilts. There has been a certain malaise amongst the goalies lately. Jack Campbell has looked weak and Petr Mrázek’s timing was all wrong against Montreal Monday night.

Now of course, the defence has been spotty too. Jake Muzzin probably came back too soon and the constant shifting from healthy scratches of Rasmus Sandin and Timothy Liljegren haven’t done much positive.

Travis Dermott has really disappointed as well as Justin Holl. Ilya Lyubushkin had a rough third period last night, but we can put that down to being thrown in the deep end. He has promise. So, do the Leafs have any chance now of trading for a top-four defenceman?

With Muzzin looking at LTIR can the Leafs swing for Jakob Chychrun? J.T. Miller?

What do you think it will take to land either or both?

Thanks as always.

Peter C.

Now in Los Angeles

ANSWER: Peter, your comments are always welcome. From anywhere. You identified the two big fish I think the Leafs have the most interest in. Chychrun will cost them a lot in terms of prospects. I’m not sure they have the prospects and the cap space for both, but I do expect one big fish to be added and few depth pieces with the Muzzin LTIR space.
 
I haven't gone through the entire thread so I'm sure a bunch of names have been mentioned, but I read somewhere Cal Clutterbuck could be available, for a mid round pick. Cap hits a little high at 3.5 for a bottom sixer, but would add some snarl...

AssetsExcels at the hitting game. Is also a true shift disturber. Has excellent drive and determination. Plays a sound defensive game. Is versatile, industrious and gritty. Can also produce some offense in a complementary role.
FlawsMust stay out of the penalty box, since he can take very ill-timed penalties. Can also deliver questionable hits on occasion. Lacks consistency when it comes to producing points at the National Hockey League level.
Career potentialHard-hitting energy winger.
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
 
Shooter2x said:
How does he get it exactly? Arizona laughs in our face if we tell them we want Jakob but not willing to part with one of Sandin or Lil, who both have inferior skillsets to Jakob overall.

Put it this way, if people enjoy how Sandin looks on the Leafs, just wait until you can see what Jakob can do on a competitive team with skill.
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Then why have his underlyings basically always looked like dog shit even relative to his dog shit team.

He's young and is getting destroyed on a bad team in the toughest comp/minutes, but can be salvaged in the right system/situation. The Leafs obviously should be in on him, but Sandin's value at this point should be realtively similar. Sandin has absolutely destroyed borderline top-4 comp to a level Chychrun has never seen, and is two years younger.

It honestly feels riskier to be trading for Chychrun than it does keeping Sandin, so why would we do it?
 
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Morgs said:
Then why have his underlyings basically always looked like dog shit even relative to his dog shit team.

He's young and is getting destroyed on a bad team in the toughest comp/minutes, but can be salvaged in the right system/situation. The Leafs obviously should be in on him, but Sandin's value at this point should be realtively similar. Sandin has absolutely destroyed borderline top-4 comp to a level Chychrun has never seen, and is two years younger.

It honestly feels riskier to be trading for Chychrun than it does keeping Sandin, so why would we do it?
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This. So much this.

People get tunnel vision on names. And then build those players up mentally to a point where only the Lindros return will get that player.....Sandin + 1st plus plus plus.....

I almost believe some on here are actively wanting the Leafs to fail so they can reclaim their blown up narratives.
 
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kb said:
This. So much this.

People get tunnel vision on names. And then build those players up mentally to a point where only the Lindros return will get that player.....Sandin + 1st plus plus plus.....

I almost believe some on here are actively wanting the Leafs to fail so they can reclaim their blown up narratives.
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The grass is always greener.... except it's not. Just because someone has a bigger name, more experience, and larger role doesn't mean they're better. Chychrun isn't good enough for his current role irregardless of team, so you can assume that he'd "only" be a top-4 guy with us. We'd be hoping his stats bounce to the level Sandin's are currently, who is basically been a 4/5 for us this season and realistically is only getting better.

Screen-Shot-2022-02-22-at-10.52.31-AM.png


Screen-Shot-2022-02-22-at-12.37.05-PM.png
 
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Punch Drunk Loov said:
I'd like to add from the "secondary tier" of available defensemen, Giordano, Braun, Schenn, Chara? that are older and won't cost as much as Klingberg, Chychrun, etc.
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Gio and Braun are quite a bit above the other two. Gio is the better but the need for big retention will push up the cost. Braun is $1.8M. Maybe he is a throw in to the Giroux deal :)
 
Plenty of defensemen with varying degrees of ability have destroyed soft minutes. Sergachev, Dunn, C. Miller, Dermott etc. TOI is a better predictor of a future star for young defenseman, specifically 1st round picks.
 
Mickey Marner said:
Plenty of defensemen with varying degrees of ability have destroyed soft minutes. Sergachev, Dunn, C. Miller, Dermott etc. TOI is a better predictor of a future star for young defenseman, specifically 1st round picks.
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Not really. Sandin has Rielly ahead of him as well as Muzzin meanwhile Arizona’s entire team is a disaster. Aside from Chychrun, there’s not one defenceman I’d take over a Leaf’s defenceman.
 
Mickey Marner said:
We can whip 'em out and measure them if you'd like. I bet none of you can find a better predictor of future success than a defenseman playing 22 minutes per game by their 22 year old season.
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That's because usually the ones who are playing that much are really good. They're not good because of how much they play, like you're stating. You're also assuming way too much:

A) the coach knows a player deserves those minutes
B) the player is good enough for those minutes
C) the player doesn't have better players blocking them
D) the player doesn't have any players more capable ahead of them

An example is Ristolainen. He was playing 25 minutes at the age of 21. He's always been a brutal player and a massive drag on any team he plays on.

Correlation /=/ causation in this case in any way. There's no study that concludes TOI has any predictive value, and assuming it and passing it off as fact is so strange lol. It's important to note it and accept that a player isn't a top-4/top-pair guy without actually playing the minutes/comp that's required, but just because they play it and struggle doesn't make them more valuable than a guy who crushes 4/5 minutes who is inherently more valuable to a team when they have guys that can actually handle the minutes a guy like Chychrun is struggling in.
 
Mickey Marner said:
We can whip 'em out and measure them if you'd like. I bet none of you can find a better predictor of future success than a defenseman playing 22 minutes per game by their 22 year old season.
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Arizona is also known for rushing their prospects and young players way too early… Turris, Wheeler, Dvorak, Strome, Tikhonov, etc.
 
Morgs said:
That's because usually the ones who are playing that much are really good. They're not good because of how much they play, like you're stating. You're also assuming way too much:

A) the coach knows a player deserves those minutes
B) the player is good enough for those minutes
C) the player doesn't have better players blocking them
D) the player doesn't have any players more capable ahead of them

An example is Ristolainen. He was playing 25 minutes at the age of 21. He's always been a brutal player and a massive drag on any team he plays on.

Correlation /=/ causation in this case in any way. There's no study that concludes TOI has any predictive value, and assuming it and passing it off as fact is so strange lol. It's important to note it and accept that a player isn't a top-4/top-pair guy without actually playing the minutes/comp that's required, but just because they play it and struggle doesn't make them more valuable than a guy who crushes 4/5 minutes who is inherently more valuable to a team when they have guys that can actually handle the minutes a guy like Chychrun is struggling in.
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Funny you mentioned Ristolainen. Eklund says that the Leafs are interested in him. :laugh:
 
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