There are a couple of teams that need right-handed defensemen. More so, Guerin has been working the phones trying to move Dumba for some time now - so either Dumba is damaged goods or Guerin can't swing a deal.
Speculation: Trade and Free Agency Talk - 2022-23 Edition - Postseason Success can't be a Myth!
- Thread starter TaLoN
- Start date
- Status
Which again goes back to my original point...You have people convinced that Guerin is the issue and won't bring down the price, without evidence of that, when it could be, very easily, that teams don't want Dumba.
So should Guerin try and get the best deal he can? Or should be make it "fair?"
- Dec 10, 2012
- 40,708
- 18,998
He should try to get the best deal he can.
Breaking that sentence down further...
get the best deal he can
'he can'
Getting the best deal he can usually means there's a deal.
Holding on to a guy to the point where he might just walk for nothing because he didn't get what he wanted ideally is not him getting the best deal he can. It's just not getting a deal.
Rumors in the past (from a guy like Russo) have stated that he wants a top six center for Dumba. We all know he's not worth that. Getting the best deal he can does not mean waiting for the odd chance someone wants to pay it.
So it's past rumors stating a top six center or a first round pick, and you're convinced he hasn't come down from that based on what?
Getting the best deal he can also should mean not selling for pennies. If all the market wants to give is, hypothetically, a 4th rounder, should he take it as the best he can get?
Minnewildsota
He who laughs last thinks slowest
- Jun 7, 2010
- 8,895
- 3,094
GM speak. If you take everything a GM says for face value. You're going to be disappointed. A LOT.
That isn't GM speak though. The fair value yes, but no GM would be stupid enough to go hey we didn't try to get into a bidding war, because that would be shooting yourself in the foot.
It did come out that Fiala apparently wouldn't sign to any team except LA, so who knows.
What I've seen here is that Guerin didn't even try to keep Fiala. It was a foregone conclusion that Fiala was going to be traded the moment the 21-22 season started.
- Dec 10, 2012
- 40,708
- 18,998
I think this was a foregone conclusion the moment the club elected for arbitration before the 21-22 season even started. The question is why. And the answer is not "we couldn't afford him". That's just the cop out.
There are plenty of answers, an obvious one is that Fiala wanted to move to a different team too, I don’t know why that gets completely overlooked. He was traded here, he was deservedly challenged by the coaches for not playing the right way, and then Kaprizov shows up and steals the spotlight. In LA he gets a warmer climate and can be a “star” for them in a place that caters more to the wealthy and famous. Minnesota is a great place to be for many people, but not everyone is going to like it. None of us were in the room to hear what happened from both sides, so we can only speculate, but at the end of the day he is gone and the team has to move forward while wishing him the best.
- Dec 10, 2012
- 40,708
- 18,998
By all accounts, Fiala was willing to sign a long term deal here. In fact, that's what he wanted before Guerin elected for arbitration.
So if Fiala wanted out by the end of it, it wasn't just because he didn't like Minnesota, or wanted a warmer climate, or wanted to be treated like a celebrity. It was the direct result of the way coaching and management handled him in his time here, especially towards the end.
- Nov 7, 2017
- 5,323
- 2,100
Russo is an actual insider, maybe you should listen to him. He said Evason and Fiala needed a divorce, and Guerin chose Evason. Obviously the coach and Fiala didn't get along.
Dumba, again according to Russo, there's no market for him because it's believed he isn't worth his contract. And Guerin doesn't want to retain, or re-sign him because young D are knocking on the door. So he'll probably walk for nothing after next season.
Dumba, again according to Russo, there's no market for him because it's believed he isn't worth his contract. And Guerin doesn't want to retain, or re-sign him because young D are knocking on the door. So he'll probably walk for nothing after next season.
DANOZ28
Registered User
experienced top 4 RHD don't grow on trees so i would think dumba has some value. the minimum i would take is 2-2nds & 2-4ths. i don't blame guerin trying to get a 1st but i will blame him if dumba walks for nothing. the fiala deal should have been made before arbitration. atleast guerin got something for him. i will be bummed everytime i hear / see he scored.
I can see there not being a market for Dumba that makes sense for MN anymore. Cap friendly has 9 teams with more than $2.4m in cap space: OTT, MN, Jets, DAL (still need to sign J Rob), CHI, AZ, DET, ANA, and BUF. These aren't teams that are a Dumba away from the Playoffs, let alone a long Playoff push.
So any trade for Dumba needs to have a lot of cap coming back. This likely is probably going to be in the form of a cap dump (+ picks), and not a player that makes MN better than it is with Dumba. There is also the 10 team NTC to get around.
Any Dumba trade needed to happen before/at the draft before teams got into FA and spent all their money. Now Dumba will be a TDL candidate if the season goes sideways for MN. If they are in contention they'll just keep him and let him walk/re-sign him after the season.
Really if any Dumba trade was likely to happen Kulikov wouldn't have been traded for nothing (Merrill is out to start the season).
So any trade for Dumba needs to have a lot of cap coming back. This likely is probably going to be in the form of a cap dump (+ picks), and not a player that makes MN better than it is with Dumba. There is also the 10 team NTC to get around.
Any Dumba trade needed to happen before/at the draft before teams got into FA and spent all their money. Now Dumba will be a TDL candidate if the season goes sideways for MN. If they are in contention they'll just keep him and let him walk/re-sign him after the season.
Really if any Dumba trade was likely to happen Kulikov wouldn't have been traded for nothing (Merrill is out to start the season).
- Dec 10, 2012
- 40,708
- 18,998
Yeah and then I guess the rub would be that Guerin waited until there was no market to move a player they've been looking at moving for years.
Russo isn't the end all be all of discussion though either. He has insight we all don't, true... but that doesn't make his opinions infallible.
Guerin has more insight than Russo, and he makes mistakes too. Nobody is perfect, and nobody is infallible.
As someone who hasn't paid enough attention this offseason, I see there are like 10 teams apparently sitting over the cap right now. Are many of them able to make it under by stashing guys in the AHL? Or are we going to get some significant trades still before the season starts?
Combination of things. Some teams will play with reduced rosters. Some will put players on LTIR. Others will waive, or put players in the AHL. Some are probably still looking to dump a contract in a trade. All approaches have their difficulties.
DeagleJenkins
Registered User
I think we have to wait another few weeks to narrow that down but hopefully there are quality options. VAN is over the cap with quality forwards.
MuckOG
Registered User
- May 18, 2012
- 15,866
- 5,846
Another scenario is that we take a contract off another team's hands in return for futures.
I think teams are going to be relying on rookie contracts and short rosters to start the season, the 10 game mark is going to be the cutoff when some hard decisions need to be made for those teams, and the Wild will also have a better idea of what is needed then too. Should be an eventful start of the season for transactions IMO.
MN has their own questions/issues, so I think they'll just sit on cap space before taking any cap dumps.
Horvat is the only player in VAN that interests me. I don't see him being moved until the TDL if their season goes badly.
Poolparty (who I want) or Kerfoot (not much interest) is are my guesses.
DeagleJenkins
Registered User
If VAN isn’t cap compliant they will have to do something. Who knows if we can swing a deal for him if tension is also high on the lack of contract extension.
They have some guys on IR that might (?) be able to be LTIRed to get them the breathing room for a bit. They also have some midrange contract that they could dump somewhere before taking chump change for their "C".on Horvat.
- Status
