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Samuel Culper III
Mr. Woodhull...
Jason Chimera? Hate him, but he's better than a fourth liner (not by much, I guess) and certainly fits the bill.
Steve Downie? Hate him, but you'd love him on your team. Colorado is desperate for D and loaded up front. He could probably be available.
Steve Downie? Hate him, but you'd love him on your team. Colorado is desperate for D and loaded up front. He could probably be available.
Miller Time NYR
Registered User
Brian Boyle, and he's free....he stuck up for nash last night and wanted to fight Stuart but the dirtbag wanted none of it, why trade for someone else to do the exact same thing?
Samuel Culper III
Mr. Woodhull...
Because, Boyle is one guy. This team needs to be harder to play against overall. We're not talking about a goon. A guy who can play hockey, but HITS everything that moves and won't stand for opponents taking liberties. Not a bad thing to have on the third line.
id love Downie, Ott and Chimera to NYR.. dump soft crap like Pyatt Boyle
Chimera would add much needed speed..
Ott would win faceoffs, PK and instigate when needed
Downie is a pure pest with skill.. id love him on this team..
Rangers need alot of emotion personallies.. too much pasive personalities.. if you dont stick up for your teammates, you should not be playing profesional sports.
PlamsUnlimited
Big Church Bells
Samuel Culper III
Mr. Woodhull...
I kind of agree. I'd still keep Boyle. He's good at what he does. He should be on the fourth line but he PKs well, is good in the fourth line spot, wins draws and he tries to stand up for teammates. Good enough for me. Pyatt played really well the other night but he just doesn't use that size to finish checks or stand up for his mates. He can go. Asham is shot. He can go. But yeah, we do need more emotion and less passiveness. Guys like Dubi will always be missed by me, for that reason. He was passionate and aggressive.
Miller Time NYR
Registered User
I agree that this team needs to be harder to play against but i think it starts with the guys we have now, other teams dont respect this teams toughness or tough players, guys have no problem skating with speed up the boards or through the neutral zone, until our own guys start going out of their way to try and hit people and make them think twice about coming thru with speed and carrying the puck, guys will have no problem blowing by ours until we change our indenting and right now that's gotta happen internally because I don't see us making a trade at this point
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
Samuel Culper III
Mr. Woodhull...
Well, our guys aren't doing that. Sometimes you need someone to come in and set that example. A guy like Downie isn't going to stop being a physical player when he comes here. It can be contagious. No one on the roster seems to want to pick up that mantle. Bring in a guy who is guaranteed to play that way and see if it lights a fire for a few guys. If a few guys follow the lead, more will follow them.
yea because that will help protect Nash from dirty hits...
Rangers have a soft i dont care about my teammates mentality that has to go...
i bet if this happened with the Canucks and Sharks i bet the canucks would have done something. i doubt this is a coaching issue...
imagine if this happened on one of the Sedins or Kesler...
PlamsUnlimited
Big Church Bells
haveandare
Registered User
Seriously, nobody out there is going to "protect" stars from dirty hits. Nobody has to fight after a hit of any kind. Even when people come out swinging, they're on ice, people take a few shots and end up fine or they turtle and end up fine. I really don't think that anybody is seriously thinking twice about any play based on what tough guy may or may not be somewhere else in the lineup. A good PP is how you keep the opposition honest IMO. That actually hurts them.
Rangers ftw
Registered User
- May 8, 2007
- 2,389
- 460
I wasn't watching the game last night, but wasn't the 9 goals against and only two goals scored a bigger issue than team toughness? Honest question, since I (fortunately) didn't watch the game. Not saying that the team toughness doesn''t need improvement, but is it really our most urgent need and was the lack of it(?) a major reason why we lost?
Samuel Culper III
Mr. Woodhull...
Well, after Nash got taken out in the first period and the Rangers were manhandled overall, they essentially quit. Early. At 4-1. So the next 5 goals against were not goals you can truly judge the skill of the defense or goaltending on. We don't just need to be tougher in terms of guys who go out and finish checks (although that does translate into other areas of the game) but we need guys who are going to be tougher in their mentality as well. We were a bunch of quitters last night. We need guys who play with a fire and to hope that it catches with some of our guys.
vipernsx
Flatus Expeller
- Sep 4, 2005
- 6,791
- 3
Rangers have a guy like that, he's their Captain.
Guys that hit have a skill:fight ratio. Basically the more skill you have the less you're going to fight. I.E. Callahan doesn't fight and Dorsett does. Both are quick, can play hockey and HIT.
Dubinsky, less skill than Cally and fights more.
Prust, less skill then Dubi and fights more.
Prust we all know would be greatly missed but with Dubinsky, sure I thought I was sad to see him go but with his lack of production the last season he was here I for sure didn't appreciate his game as it was as much as I miss it today.
Samuel Culper III
Mr. Woodhull...
No knock on Callahan. He just can't do it alone. And since he's one guy, and we don't want him in the box too much, and he's not that big, despite playing with the heart of a lion, it still doesn't hurt to add a guy like Chimera who would cost little, plays a similar game, but has less skill and would throw his weight around and make the lineup tougher without being a liability. He'd add speed. And toughness. He can play hockey. But it's okay if he fights and ends up in the box too.
I also don't agree Dubi has "less skill" than Cally, but that's a story for a different day. Same career high's in points. Same pace last season in points. Dubi is younger, has more career points. I would say Dubi actually has more skill but a bit less instinct and, despite being a warrior, is still less a warrior than Cally. Also despite having a good defensive game, has less a defensive game than Cally. So, less valuable? Sure. Less skill? Not so sure.
Of course such a player would be an upgrade oder a guy like Pyatt, but the question is how much does he cost? Guys with these attributes who can also play are pretty valuable. Proposing to acquire someone like this is a bit like suggesting to acquire an elite sniper or a superstar dman. Everybody agrees that a player like that would be great, but getting them isn't that easy. Players that fit the bill are Neil, Ott, Clowe or Prust. But none of them come cheap.
Callahan isnt doing that good of a job of a captain if he does not stick up for his own teammates. even Chris Drury had a few fights as a Ranger for sticking up for teammates.... one reason i wanted Vinny LeCavalier this offseason.... he has size and can play top 6 and fights when needed.
Samuel Culper III
Mr. Woodhull...
I have to imagine a guy like Chimera is quite affordable. A guy like Ott is a waste for us; UFA to be who would take a lot to acquire. A guy like Downie could be expendable in COL due to the abundance of forwards and lack of defense. We could be an okay trade partner there. I'm sure there are other examples. Yes, some guys are pricey. I'm sure there are some decent fits who are not at that pricetag.
NYR Viper
Registered User
Clifford was rumored to be available from LA earlier in the off-season. Downie will be available in UFA most likely.
Nystrom, Hendricks, Prust all were UFA's in the past couple of years.
Dorsett and Clutterbuck were traded.
The players are out there, but the organization needs to make it a priority to find the right ones.
Clarkson and Clowe were UFA's. WAY overpaid.
Nystrom, Hendricks, Prust all were UFA's in the past couple of years.
Dorsett and Clutterbuck were traded.
The players are out there, but the organization needs to make it a priority to find the right ones.
Clarkson and Clowe were UFA's. WAY overpaid.
eco's bones
Registered User
Chimera is 34--forget it. Ott is Buffalo's captain--forget that too.
If I were dreaming somehow we'd have Lucic but--other alternatives who can play off the top of my head.
Matt Martin--love this guy. Big, strong, one of the leagues top 5 hitters--fights well and is a very good penalty killer. Not a great point producer but he will chip in.
Chris Neil--an older version of Martin though not really a pk'er though a better fighter. He's a good skater. You don't rack up the hits like Martin or Neil do unless you're a good skater.
Like Ottawa's Zack Smith as well. Always plays with an edge.
Then there's Vancouver's Zack Kassian---not sure he's developed into the productive player some people thought he might. He's big and mean and very tough.
I'd consider Clifford as well.
Within the organization there is McIlrath who is not really ready. There's Bickel--a kind of Dale Purinton lite--crappy d-man with the potential of going off like a time bomb--who gets killed? and collateral damage is the question. There's Brandon Mashinter and Micheal Haley. Haley's a good skater--a bit on the small side--not a heavyweight--but capable of stirring a lot of turds as the war he started with the Penguins a few years ago can attest--going after Talbot, Adams and the goalie.
If I were dreaming somehow we'd have Lucic but--other alternatives who can play off the top of my head.
Matt Martin--love this guy. Big, strong, one of the leagues top 5 hitters--fights well and is a very good penalty killer. Not a great point producer but he will chip in.
Chris Neil--an older version of Martin though not really a pk'er though a better fighter. He's a good skater. You don't rack up the hits like Martin or Neil do unless you're a good skater.
Like Ottawa's Zack Smith as well. Always plays with an edge.
Then there's Vancouver's Zack Kassian---not sure he's developed into the productive player some people thought he might. He's big and mean and very tough.
I'd consider Clifford as well.
Within the organization there is McIlrath who is not really ready. There's Bickel--a kind of Dale Purinton lite--crappy d-man with the potential of going off like a time bomb--who gets killed? and collateral damage is the question. There's Brandon Mashinter and Micheal Haley. Haley's a good skater--a bit on the small side--not a heavyweight--but capable of stirring a lot of turds as the war he started with the Penguins a few years ago can attest--going after Talbot, Adams and the goalie.
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
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