Top 5 (22 and under): NJD vs MTL vs DET vs OTT vs BUF vs ANA

[bsu]

Dahlin often played late in the game when Buffalo lost by 1 or 2 goals. Buffalo withdrew their goaltender and the opposing Team scores a goal In the empty net. So Dahlin had a record of minus 1.

C'mon seriously lol

 

[GOALOFSSON]

He was a combined -6 in all EN situations, and -16 otherwise.

He also played with some garbage at times, both skaters and goalies.

Also just noticed but not his 21/22yo season. Just 21. This upcoming season is his 22yo season.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Not that I agree that Dahlin is better defensively right now but you could have at least used the most recent season.



But again seriously? Even with what was shown Fox's season wasn't all that better. It still ignores Fox getting to not develop in a shit environment the previous two years and how bad our team was the first half of last season. We were expected to finish last again by some.

The most recent season wasn't available, so I posted the most recent charts I could find.

Fox's season was most definitely better. He essentially produced the same amount of offense with 5 less mins of ice time (including a full minute less on the PP).

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

He also played with some garbage at times, both skaters and goalies.

Also just noticed but not his 21/22yo season. Just 21. This upcoming season is his 22yo season.

Dahlin was 21 for 73 games and was 22 for the last 7 games.

Fox was 21 for 58 games and 22 for 12 games.

It was essentially both of their 21 year old seasons if you don't want to count the last few weeks of the season.

 

[Panthaz89]

Naaah, Fox just won the Norris as a 22/23 year old. Dahlin may approach Fox offensively, but defensively Fox will always be far superior.

Dahlin started in the NHL at 18 and on the talk on who is more talented because Fox won a Norris is silly. If anything he's one of the defenseman that gets by without a whole lot of talent pretty sure his brain is talked about way more than his skating, speed, etc you can easily argue that a ton of D are more talented than him.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Dahlin started in the NHL at 18 and on the talk on who is more talented because Fox won a Norris is silly. If anything he's one of the defenseman that gets by without a whole lot of talent pretty sure his brain is talked about way more than his skating, speed, etc you can easily argue that a ton of D are more talented than him.

You don't think generational IQ is a talent?

 

[Eggtimer]

Some Devil's fans seriously underestimating Stutzle with some of their arguments IMO but I guess we'll just see what happens this upcoming season. Should be interesting to see a full season with Stutzle at C with debrincat and batherson as his wingers.

Clearly not worth arguing if the gap between him and Jack Hughes is being compared to Luke Hughes and Makar.

Look , Stutzle is a damn good player but his production is not going to be linear.
You can tell by watching Hughes that he has game breaking ability and makes everyone on his line better. Yes Stutzle is good but his ceiling is not as high as Hughes’. His wingers to date have been Sharangovich , Kuokkanen , Mercer , (insert rookie or second year player here). Playing at a near 100 point pace with linemates like that and a horrid PP to boot .. I have more faith in Jack becoming a 100 point player before Stutzle (I highly doubt he ever sniffs 100 points ).

 

[Korpse]

You can tell by watching Hughes that he has game breaking ability and makes everyone on his line better.

Are you you suggesting Stutzle doesn't?

I understand having a preference with Jack Huges, I don't fault anyone for that. It's reasonable and I lean that way at this time. I just don't understand the need to limit Stutzle, he absolutely has just as high of a ceiling. Sure with his extra NHL season under his belt Hughes is closer to the top and more of a certainty to get there but nothing Stutzle has shown limits his ceiling. His progression to this point has been very encouraging and hasn't shown signs of slowing down. I look at both players and their talent levels are so high that the sky is their ceiling.

 

[CornerStone61]

Look , Stutzle is a damn good player but his production is not going to be linear.
You can tell by watching Hughes that he has game breaking ability and makes everyone on his line better. Yes Stutzle is good but his ceiling is not as high as Hughes’. His wingers to date have been Sharangovich , Kuokkanen , Mercer , (insert rookie or second year player here). Playing at a near 100 point pace with linemates like that and a horrid PP to boot .. I have more faith in Jack becoming a 100 point player before Stutzle (I highly doubt he ever sniffs 100 points ).

Where did I say his production would be linear? You can also tell by watching Stutzle that he has game breaking ability and makes everyone on his line better.

I understand you like your player just like I like mine, but I'm also not going to sit here and downplay Hughes talent like many Devil's fans have done for Stutzle.

Hughes is most definitely ahead at this point, there's no debate. He's also a full development year ahead.

Let's revisit this after next season.

 

[ninetyeight]

Where did I say his production would be linear? You can also tell by watching Stutzle that he has game breaking ability and makes everyone on his line better.

I understand you like your player just like I like mine, but I'm also not going to sit here and downplay Hughes talent like many Devil's fans have done for Stutzle.

Hughes is most definitely ahead at this point, there's no debate. He's also a full development year ahead.

Let's revisit this after next season.

A lot of it has to do with not watching as much Sens games and relying more on stats. But I don't think anyone is really downplaying Stützle, it's just that they are so high on Hughes.

 

[Pinto Bean]

The thing with this list from an Ottawa perspective is that Pinto showed unreal potential & ability but is also a recent 2nd round pick, a Sens player who most fans don't really pay attention too, and just missed an entire season due to a shoulder injury. His value to other fans, rightfully so, is far lower then the Sens fans who have been able to watch his development closely.

Sanderson is a guy who has a bit more pedigree as a prospect but is also a step behind some of the other guys on this list due to age, injuries, and simply not having the chance to play many games the last few years with the NCAA schedule + injuries.

Stutzle also showed his breakout in the final 30 some odd games of the season.

If Pinto & Sanderson can get a full NHL season under their belt, and if Stutzle can continue his PPG pace he had once he moved to C the Sens will be in a prime position on this poll.

 

[Satanphonehome]

Nobody’s development is linear.

1st big 20-year-old rookie defenceman put up 11 goals, 48 points and +13 while winning the Calder.

2nd big 20-year-old rookie defenceman put up 7 goals, 50 points and -9 while winning the Calder.

1st big 2nd-year defenceman put up 4 goals, 26 points and +3 while winning nothing.

2nd big 2nd-year defenceman put up 10 goals, 23 points and -18 while winning nothing.

Meet Tyler Myers, Moritz Seider, Victor Hedman and Zach Bogosian.

18 months ago, Dylan Cozens 8 goals and 8 assists in 7 games to lead Team Canada at the WJC. Not one of you would have picked Dawson Mercer (pointless in the same tourney) over him. Now, after roughly identical NHL seasons, Mercer is clearly better?

The only thing more embarrassing than the wild swings of popular opinion about still-developing players on this board is the amount of certainty about those same players on this thread.

 

[Matt Ress]

Nobody’s development is linear.

1st big 20-year-old rookie defenceman put up 11 goals, 48 points and +13 while winning the Calder.

2nd big 20-year-old rookie defenceman put up 7 goals, 50 points and -9 while winning the Calder.

1st big 2nd-year defenceman put up 4 goals, 26 points and +3 while winning nothing.

2nd big 2nd-year defenceman put up 10 goals, 23 points and -18 while winning nothing.

Meet Tyler Myers, Moritz Seider, Victor Hedman and Zach Bogosian.

18 months ago, Dylan Cozens 8 goals and 8 assists in 7 games to lead Team Canada at the WJC. Not one of you would have picked Dawson Mercer (pointless in the same tourney) over him. Now, after roughly identical NHL seasons, Mercer is clearly better?

The only thing more embarrassing than the wild swings of popular opinion about still-developing players on this board is the amount of certainty about those same players on this thread.

It's because Sabre fans are not nearly as loud or concerned with this as some others. Lots of great young talent in the East and plenty of time for kids to figure things out.

 

[Diehard Devil]

You don't think generational IQ is a talent?

What about generational size?

Always thought Chara was generational, just not how we usually use the term

 

[lionsDen]

You're shitting me.

I was more impressed in my limited viewings when both teams played Colorado. I remember the fox vs makar debates… should we revisit that as well.

 

[Panthaz89]

Nobody’s development is linear.

1st big 20-year-old rookie defenceman put up 11 goals, 48 points and +13 while winning the Calder.

2nd big 20-year-old rookie defenceman put up 7 goals, 50 points and -9 while winning the Calder.

1st big 2nd-year defenceman put up 4 goals, 26 points and +3 while winning nothing.

2nd big 2nd-year defenceman put up 10 goals, 23 points and -18 while winning nothing.

Meet Tyler Myers, Moritz Seider, Victor Hedman and Zach Bogosian.

18 months ago, Dylan Cozens 8 goals and 8 assists in 7 games to lead Team Canada at the WJC. Not one of you would have picked Dawson Mercer (pointless in the same tourney) over him. Now, after roughly identical NHL seasons, Mercer is clearly better?

The only thing more embarrassing than the wild swings of popular opinion about still-developing players on this board is the amount of certainty about those same players on this thread.

I'm more concerned that people forgot who Quinn is despite incredibly good numbers in the AHL i've seen him ranked in the 20s......several spots under his peers who are the same age as him who produce .5 PPG less than him in the same league.

 

[Mrb1p]

What about generational size?

Always thought Chara was generational, just not how we usually use the term

Chara isnt even the biggest player to play in his era? That makes no sense.

 

[Diehard Devil]

Chara isnt even the biggest player to play in his era? That makes no sense.

I didnt mean for just his size. His size and the fact that he was really good is generational, no?

What other player since he joined the league is anywhere near his size and nearly as good? And before him?

The list if there even is one is extremely short. I think theres definitely an argument for it.

 

[Mrb1p]

I didnt mean for just his size. His size and the fact that he was really good is generational, no?

What other player since he joined the league is anywhere near his size and nearly as good? And before him?

The list if there even is one is extremely short. I think theres definitely an argument for it.

Pronger was better and 6'6
Hedman too

I kinda understand your point, hes a rare/unique player and that makes him a generational talent but its not his "size" that is so.

 

[Bileur]

I didnt mean for just his size. His size and the fact that he was really good is generational, no?

What other player since he joined the league is anywhere near his size and nearly as good? And before him?

The list if there even is one is extremely short. I think theres definitely an argument for it.

Even just for size, he is the tallest in NHL history.

Top 15 all time in weight while being fitter than anyone heavier than him.

Definitely the best player of the physical specimens with only Byfuglien coming close without anywhere near the longevity.

Pretty clearly a unicorn.

 

[Diehard Devil]

Even just for size, he is the tallest in NHL history.

Top 15 all time in weight while being fitter than anyone heavier than him.

Definitely the best player of the physical specimens with only Byfuglien coming close without anywhere near the longevity.

Pretty clearly a unicorn.

Yeah .. I think I actually like this better. Calling him a or even 'the' unicorn

 

[Habs Halifax]

23 and Ottawa adds Norris.

24 and Ottawa adds Batherson and DeBrincat.

Basically their entire top six is 24 and under.

Yup. The point of doing most of these is to determine who has a good young core. Drawing a line with age takes away from the main point IMO.

Habs would add Suzuki if it's age 23. However, we don't have two 24 year olds like DeBrincat and Batherson. We are about 2/3 years behind the Sens rebuild.

 

[Arbsy]

Lol it's NJ, two of them are already NHLers with Jack being on a superstar trajectory. There's no one in Ottawa's group that comes close to that.

No one even close? Hughes is a stud but stutzle is right there with him and has a higher ceiling imo. Currently ppg in his third season.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

with an honourable mention to

Yup. The point of doing most of these is to determine who has a good young core. Drawing a line with age takes away from the main point IMO.

Habs would add Suzuki if it's age 23. However, we don't have two 24 year olds like DeBrincat and Batherson. We are about 2/3 years behind the Sens rebuild.

lol then make your own poll. So silly when people try to change OP's poll so that their team looks better.

 

[Habs Halifax]

with an honourable mention to





lol then make your own poll. So silly when people try to change OP's poll so that their team looks better.

Relax. There is a new thread. I got sucked into this one from someone posting in the other one who linked it.

It's so silly when posters overreact. This is not to make one team look better. You're reaching to belittle something that don't exist. Keep trying with your disinengeous ways... great character