Rumor: Things Not Left Unsaid 3 - Flyers Rumors and Media Mentions: Never Ending Circles

[deadhead]

I’m not sure I can recall an asset’s value ever cratering in half a season’s worth of games as much as Drysdale’s. Objectively, they valued him as equal to a ~top 10 pick. After 39 games, I’d be floored if they could flip Drysdale for more than a 3rd-4th rounder. They won’t because of those optics. They’ll let his value simply evaporate.

As for Jiricek, whom he won’t fetch, I always thought he was more of a modern defensive defenseman, with occasional flash. That’s worth exploring — oh, look, plausible fit at a time after draft day! — but cost dependent. It’s easy to see some other team having an outlier opinion.

Doubt Flyers valued Drysdale as a top 10 pick, Anaheim certainly didn't.

I'd say more like a high 2nd rd pick, which along with the pick included in the deal, would be somewhere around #20-25 in value, about the best they could expect for Gauthier under the circumstances.

And I doubt Gauthier was considered better than #10, coming out of a weak draft, demonstrating he wasn't NHL center material and receiving the kiss of death from Magua.

 

[Magua]

Doubt Flyers valued Drysdale as a top 10 pick, Anaheim certainly didn't.

Anaheim didn’t? That’s not how it works. If a team calls the Flyers willing to trade a 15th overall pick for Frost, the Flyers are supposed to say what, “Sorry, we think he’s worth less”?

The Flyers were asking for a 5th overall pick from Montreal at the draft (to throw away on Reinbacher). That was their negotiating stance, and it’s not crazy. While I believe that’s a tad fanciful given how NHL teams have death grips on those picks, you’d need to believe Gauthier’s value went down significantly during his sophomore year. It did not. McGroarty was traded for a player selected at the same spot one year later (#14), so I think I’m being fair saying Gauthier’s value was ~top 10. You said his value was #20-25. That’s worthy of mockery. The Flyers absurdly overvalued Drysdale. That’s it; that’s the story.

 

[FlyerNutter]

It’s pretty funny we’ve heard nothing from the media sources about the asinine trade that brought in Drysdale.

Curious when that that tone shift happens, or is allowed. Pippin, and Jones love to control that narrative.

 

[deadhead]

Anaheim didn’t? That’s not how it works. If a team calls the Flyers willing to trade a 15th overall pick for Frost, the Flyers are supposed to say what, “Sorry, we think he’s worth less”?

The Flyers were asking for a 5th overall pick from Montreal at the draft (to throw away on Reinbacher). That was their negotiating stance, and it’s not crazy. While I believe that’s a tad fanciful given how NHL teams have death grips on those picks, you’d need to believe Gauthier’s value went down significantly during his sophomore year. It did not. McGroarty was traded for a player selected at the same spot one year later (#14), so I think I’m being fair saying Gauthier’s value was ~top 10. You said his value was #20-25. That’s worthy of mockery. The Flyers absurdly overvalued Drysdale. That’s it; that’s the story.

And Montreal not only wasn't interested, their GM said Gauthier wasn't worth a #5, coming out of a weak draft. Obviously he's going to downrate him, but he also wanted the pick and didn't think Gauthier was close to even value. He didn't even bother to ask for a sweetener, just to see how much Briere really valued him.

McGroaty and the player he was traded for both seem to be discounted.
Why would the Pens make this trade unless they had second thoughts about Yager?
They knew more about their player than McGroaty.
Unless they thought McGroaty could help them win this season, which was very optimistic of them.

 

[Beef Invictus]

We putting stock in Montreal's valuations now?

 

[Magua]

And Montreal not only wasn't interested, their GM said Gauthier wasn't worth a #5, coming out of a weak draft. Obviously he's going to downrate him, but he also wanted the pick and didn't think Gauthier was close to even value. He didn't even bother to ask for a sweetener, just to see how much Briere really valued him.

McGroaty and the player he was traded for both seem to be discounted.
Why would the Pens make this trade unless they had second thoughts about Yager?
They knew more about their player than McGroaty.
Unless they thought McGroaty could help them win this season, which was very optimistic of them.

I don’t even believe you believe what you’re writing. There’s zero logic or consistency or factual evidence. It’s all just an argumentative reflex. I gave the one reply, but I’m not looking to mud wrestle.

 

[VladDrag]

Wait, what? I would have happily tried Tomasino for a 4th.

2027 4th!

 

[JojoTheWhale]

He didn't even bother to ask for a sweetener, just to see how much Briere really valued him.

Just making shit up again.

 

[GKJ]

Frank mentioned Tortorella again today as someone who may not last the season, not necessarily being in danger, but they were buying or selling and over/under of 2.5 more coaching changes, but was kinda thrown out there as other situations to watch. He said how Brink, Frost, and Farabee were talked about last week on the pod, didn’t discuss them as a trade scenario, but included Foerster as ‘all struggling and all miserable’ and at some point that can’t be the on the players.

 

[Adam Warlock]

I think Brink makes most sense to move. Hes never going to get a real chance at a top 6 player with Torts here and the wingers they have.

Adding Jiricek to the mix, youd have to think theyd be able to churn out a decent defense. Jiricek, Andrae, York, Drysdale, Bonk, Grans....decent crop of young dmen.

Frank mentioned Tortorella again today as someone who may not last the season, not necessarily being in danger, but they were buying or selling and over/under of 2.5 more coaching changes, but was kinda thrown out there as other situations to watch. He said how Brink, Frost, and Farabee were talked about last week on the pod, didn’t discuss them as a trade scenario, but included Foerster as ‘all struggling and all miserable’ and at some point that can’t be the on the players.

Which means wed get player friendly coach Ian Lapperiere.

Thats whats so depressing. Even without torts, we all know Lappy is the next coach. Id almost prefer Hakstol again.

 

[Larry44]

I think Brink makes most sense to move. Hes never going to get a real chance at a top 6 player with Torts here and the wingers they have.

Adding Jiricek to the mix, youd have to think theyd be able to churn out a decent defense. Jiricek, Andrae, York, Drysdale, Bonk, Grans....decent crop of young dmen.

Brink is becoming my favorite player. Smartest guy on the ice. Knows where to be, how to get the puck, what to do with it. Great hands. Improved his strength and speed. I want him to stay, which might be a curse...

 

[GKJ]

I think Brink makes most sense to move. Hes never going to get a real chance at a top 6 player with Torts here and the wingers they have.

Adding Jiricek to the mix, youd have to think theyd be able to churn out a decent defense. Jiricek, Andrae, York, Drysdale, Bonk, Grans....decent crop of young dmen.



Which means wed get player friendly coach Ian Lapperiere.

Thats whats so depressing. Even without torts, we all know Lappy is the next coach. Id almost prefer Hakstol again.

It would be Brad Shaw. They didn’t let Torts take games off to not have it be one of the guys who ran the bench in lieu of him.

Call me skeptical, I don’t think Lappy is in line there. Riley Armstrong is the brains down in Lehigh Valley, he is Danny’s guy.

 

[Beef Invictus]

And I know many are high on Shaw, but considering how it's commonly assumed that Tortorella is very checked out and he is doing a lot of the work...does that exactly fill us with confidence, based on what we see?

I do agree that Shaw gets a year or two. But with the way this team has been blatantly trying to groom and develop Lappy, it seems inevitable that he's going to appear again.

 

[Sombastate]

I said it in the off-season and i'll say it now:

Take the risk on Norris. I understand its a massive risk, but Norris could solve A LOT for this team if he's healthy and he appears to be.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

whoever comes next will be a 100% Torts yes man.. Torts from above will still run how the team plays.. he just wont be behind the bench or travelling as much..

your crazy if you think Torts wont have his fingers on his #cultureclub when hes shifted upstairs...

 

[trostol]

 

[Adam Warlock]

It would be Brad Shaw. They didn’t let Torts take games off to not have it be one of the guys who ran the bench in lieu of him.

Call me skeptical, I don’t think Lappy is in line there. Riley Armstrong is the brains down in Lehigh Valley, he is Danny’s guy.

Possibly. Danny and Lappy are close too. Maybe the AHL job is favor enough tho. We can hope.

 

[GKJ]

Possibly. Danny and Lappy are close too. Maybe the AHL job is favor enough tho. We can hope.

Armstrong was with him in Maine though.

 

[ponder719]

And I know many are high on Shaw, but considering how it's commonly assumed that Tortorella is very checked out and he is doing a lot of the work...does that exactly fill us with confidence, based on what we see?

I do agree that Shaw gets a year or two. But with the way this team has been blatantly trying to groom and develop Lappy, it seems inevitable that he's going to appear again.

The part of the work Shaw is presumed to be doing is the part we seem generally happiest with, all things considered, so yeah, I'd prefer that to any of the other mystery boxes within the organization (and I have no expectation the next HC will be an outside hire.)

My highest realistic hope is that Torts' Assumption into the Front Office will coincide with the release of Rocky Thompson to the firing line, Shaw promoted to HC, Lappy moving up into Rocky's old job to get him out of LHV, and hopefully someone Shaw trusts to take Shaw's old spot, then Danny can give the AHL job to his crony.

Obviously, there are a few dozen things I'd prefer, but this at least seems like a plausible path that gives us new HCs that might, if all breaks in our favor, be better than replacement-level.

 

[usahockey22flyers]

It would be Brad Shaw. They didn’t let Torts take games off to not have it be one of the guys who ran the bench in lieu of him.

Call me skeptical, I don’t think Lappy is in line there. Riley Armstrong is the brains down in Lehigh Valley, he is Danny’s guy.

Players are also super tight with Riley Armstrong fwiw. Like super tight. He's also a really nice guy, does a lot with Flyers Youth.

My read on this:

They deal with Torts becasue they have to
They respect Shaw
They love Riley

 

[Cody Webster]

Armstrong was with him in Maine though.

But Maine has no connection to Philadelphia

 

[WolfOfBroadStreet14]

As for Jiricek, whom he won’t fetch, I always thought he was more of a modern defensive defenseman, with occasional flash. That’s worth exploring — oh, look, plausible fit at a time after draft day! — but cost dependent. It’s easy to see some other team having an outlier opinion.

So you’re saying Jiricek is the second coming of Risto?

 

[Kelmitchell2]

What do you think it would take to get him? Foerster +?

Drysdale straight up for him would be amazing

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Frank mentioned Tortorella again today as someone who may not last the season, not necessarily being in danger, but they were buying or selling and over/under of 2.5 more coaching changes, but was kinda thrown out there as other situations to watch. He said how Brink, Frost, and Farabee were talked about last week on the pod, didn’t discuss them as a trade scenario, but included Foerster as ‘all struggling and all miserable’ and at some point that can’t be the on the players.

I look at players like Frost, Tippett, Foerster, Farabee, and Drysdale. 1 or 2 struggling it’s on the players. When that many are struggling it raises eyebrows. They’ve been better in the past so something is rotten

 

[GKJ]