The Sabres GM and Front Office Thread, Eric Staal hired as Special Asst. to the GM; Jarmo Kekäläinen hired as Senior Advisor

[Jeremy2020]

The Sabres have major problems with their image, connections around the league among others. Shanahan would solve several of those. They should, at the very least, be courting him. I just don't think Terry will even think in that direction because of the control that Shanahan would require.

 

[CrazyWayne]

Shanahan kind of the perfect addition for the sabres

Seems to have had more of a hand in the structure and build and overall guidance of the hockey management side

It's 100% what the sabres need

 

[sabresnyper]

Peca gets fired and ends up in Chicago. We are such an unserious organization.

 

[Zman5778]

Peca gets fired and ends up in Chicago. We are such an unserious organization.

Is he actually a good assistant though? I'm not so sure that he is.

 

[Zman5778]

Shanahan kind of the perfect addition for the sabres

Seems to have had more of a hand in the structure and build and overall guidance of the hockey management side

It's 100% what the sabres need

Is he though?

His first year, he retained GM Dave Nonis and extended coach Randy Carlyle (Carlyle got fired THAT January). He did fire two AGMs and hired Dubas and Hunter though.

After his first year, he fired Nonis and allowed the two AGMs to run the draft. After the draft, he hired Lou.....who.....holy christ did Lou mismanage the Leafs' cap situation terribly. Like, awfully. And Shanahan allowed it.

He then allowed Dubas to interview for the vacant Colorado GM position but BLOCKED Dubas from actually taking it........THEN he forced Lou out so he could hire Dubas himself. Then the whole messy divorce between Dubas and Shanny after Dubas dare suggested that the precious core might need to be changed.

Shanny did some very good things in Toronto.......but he didn't win and he didn't really build a great hockey department.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Chad fwiw thinks Dudley is the favorite of the current bigger names (Kekalainen, Blake, Shanahan etc) for the Sabres SA position, but feels the more time that goes by will lessen the impact

 

[sabremike]

This entire organization is a giant insane asylum. In every situation they do the exact opposite of whatever the obvious sane and rational thing to do is.

 

[5 Minute Major]

Is he though?

His first year, he retained GM Dave Nonis and extended coach Randy Carlyle (Carlyle got fired THAT January). He did fire two AGMs and hired Dubas and Hunter though.

After his first year, he fired Nonis and allowed the two AGMs to run the draft. After the draft, he hired Lou.....who.....holy christ did Lou mismanage the Leafs' cap situation terribly. Like, awfully. And Shanahan allowed it.

He then allowed Dubas to interview for the vacant Colorado GM position but BLOCKED Dubas from actually taking it........THEN he forced Lou out so he could hire Dubas himself. Then the whole messy divorce between Dubas and Shanny after Dubas dare suggested that the precious core might need to be changed.

Shanny did some very good things in Toronto.......but he didn't win and he didn't really build a great hockey department.

Let’s put his resume up next to Adams.

 

[Zman5778]

Let’s put his resume up next to Adams.

To be clear -- I'm not saying Shanny isn't better than Adams.

I'm saying he's not as good as some/many believe him to be.

 

[sabremike]

What the team claims it wants to do (hire an experienced exec to help out the guy with no experience) would have made sense if they had done it 3 or so years back and not when KA was a lame duck. A toddler could explain to them why nobody is going to want to work for a lame duck GM or coach

 

[Ace]

What the team claims it wants to do (hire an experienced exec to help out the guy with no experience) would have made sense if they had done it 3 or so years back and not when KA was a lame duck. A toddler could explain to them why nobody is going to want to work for a lame duck GM or coach

Any halfway savvy veteran should see it as a perfect opportunity to take over the entire operation when this clown fails again this year. You get in, he gets fired, you make all the calls.

Thats what would happen in any other organization. But this one…you can’t trust that Adams will be fired no matter what happens and you are pretty certain that the buffoon owner will f*** you at every turn.

The problem is much deeper than Adams being perceived as a lame duck.

 

[Ace]

Is he actually a good assistant though? I'm not so sure that he is.

He hit people in a Goathead jersey in standard definition highlights from a quarter of a century ago.

People don’t care that his coaching resume is genuinely awful.

 

[sabremike]

Any halfway savvy veteran should see it as a perfect opportunity to take over the entire operation when this clown fails again this year. You get in, he gets fired, you make all the calls.

Thats what would happen in any other organization. But this one…you can’t trust that Adams will be fired no matter what happens and you are pretty certain that the buffoon owner will f*** you at every turn.

The problem is much deeper than Adams being perceived as a lame duck.

My post above clarifies my thoughts: You can't fix this organization because the owner is a Dan Snyder level moron and taking a job here would be a suicide mission.

 

[TehDoak]

My post above clarifies my thoughts: You can't fix this organization because the owner is a Dan Snyder level moron and taking a job here would be a suicide mission.

For all Pegula's flaws as a Sabres owner, he's shown the ability to step back and let a GM do his thing with the Bills.

I do think part of the issue here is Terry feels he knows more about hockey than he does about football, so he is more hands on.

Go watch any embedded with the Bills where the Pegulas are at a draft vs when he's at the draft with the Sabres. For the Sabres, he has hand written notes and sit on scouting meetings. For the Bills, he'll ask brandon "who are we taking" when the pick comes up and just sit with a laptop open, probably with access to the bills draft database so he feels keyed in.

A GM COULD do well here, if he had the soft skills to manage the ownership, which Beane has for the Bills. He makes the Pegulas feel informed and involved. He also has always had a strong staff underneath him to help him with the work.

In the end, for this team to be successful, you either need a GM with enough credibility in Terry's eyes that he'll step back and let him work, or you need a team president whose job it is to keep the Pegula family happy while letting the GM work. In a way, Adams really is a reflection of how Terry feels about NHL GMs. He feels that its a job anyone can do, and it doesn't matter who you hire.

The fact that they are now actively seeking a senior advisor does say that there is at least SOME lessons learned here. Will it actually matter with Adams as GM?

Probably not.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

For all Pegula's flaws as a Sabres owner, he's shown the ability to step back and let a GM do his thing with the Bills.

I do think part of the issue here is Terry feels he knows more about hockey than he does about football, so he is more hands on.

Go watch any embedded with the Bills where the Pegulas are at a draft vs when he's at the draft with the Sabres. For the Sabres, he has hand written notes and sit on scouting meetings. For the Bills, he'll ask brandon "who are we taking" when the pick comes up and just sit with a laptop open, probably with access to the bills draft database so he feels keyed in.

A GM COULD do well here, if he had the soft skills to manage the ownership, which Beane has for the Bills. He makes the Pegulas feel informed and involved. He also has always had a strong staff underneath him to help him with the work.

In the end, for this team to be successful, you either need a GM with enough credibility in Terry's eyes that he'll step back and let him work, or you need a team president whose job it is to keep the Pegula family happy while letting the GM work. In a way, Adams really is a reflection of how Terry feels about NHL GMs. He feels that its a job anyone can do, and it doesn't matter who you hire.

The fact that they are now actively seeking a senior advisor does say that there is at least SOME lessons learned here. Will it actually matter with Adams as GM?

Probably not.

I think Terry just wants to feel included and it’s as simple as that. He wants the opportunity to give input on any and all decisions. But I think the amount of actual actionable, significant input that he ends up giving is minimal.

The only reason you notice him more at Sabres meetings a because the organization has like 10% the staff size, so he doesn’t blend in as much with the Sabres. And yeah, Kevyn isn’t as good at managing him because he’s friends with him too and that friendship always comes first.

 

[LamaTabootTaboot]

it’s not even that KA’s hit rate is bad, it’s not. That seems average. It’s his clueless roster construction that is criminally awful

To add on, his worst train might be prospect progression/management. NHL GM's have such a complex job managing teenagers across the world. Deciding who they should play for,when and for how long.

Unlike the NFL and NBA, prospect management/progression is arguably just as important (if not more) than picking the most talented player on draft day.

 

[sabremike]

For all Pegula's flaws as a Sabres owner, he's shown the ability to step back and let a GM do his thing with the Bills.

I do think part of the issue here is Terry feels he knows more about hockey than he does about football, so he is more hands on.

Go watch any embedded with the Bills where the Pegulas are at a draft vs when he's at the draft with the Sabres. For the Sabres, he has hand written notes and sit on scouting meetings. For the Bills, he'll ask brandon "who are we taking" when the pick comes up and just sit with a laptop open, probably with access to the bills draft database so he feels keyed in.

A GM COULD do well here, if he had the soft skills to manage the ownership, which Beane has for the Bills. He makes the Pegulas feel informed and involved. He also has always had a strong staff underneath him to help him with the work.

In the end, for this team to be successful, you either need a GM with enough credibility in Terry's eyes that he'll step back and let him work, or you need a team president whose job it is to keep the Pegula family happy while letting the GM work. In a way, Adams really is a reflection of how Terry feels about NHL GMs. He feels that its a job anyone can do, and it doesn't matter who you hire.

The fact that they are now actively seeking a senior advisor does say that there is at least SOME lessons learned here. Will it actually matter with Adams as GM?

Probably not.

Beane was essentially Leicester City winning the Premier League: a million to one shot that somehow happened. Until Beane he was running the Bills every bit as incompetently as the Sabres (Rex Ryan anyone???). Pegula has the worst judgement when it comes to hiring people I have ever seen: Remember how back to back heads of PSE had to be fired because of sexual misconduct?

 

[LamaTabootTaboot]

For all Pegula's flaws as a Sabres owner, he's shown the ability to step back and let a GM do his thing with the Bills.

I do think part of the issue here is Terry feels he knows more about hockey than he does about football, so he is more hands on.

Go watch any embedded with the Bills where the Pegulas are at a draft vs when he's at the draft with the Sabres. For the Sabres, he has hand written notes and sit on scouting meetings. For the Bills, he'll ask brandon "who are we taking" when the pick comes up and just sit with a laptop open, probably with access to the bills draft database so he feels keyed in.

A GM COULD do well here, if he had the soft skills to manage the ownership, which Beane has for the Bills. He makes the Pegulas feel informed and involved. He also has always had a strong staff underneath him to help him with the work.

In the end, for this team to be successful, you either need a GM with enough credibility in Terry's eyes that he'll step back and let him work, or you need a team president whose job it is to keep the Pegula family happy while letting the GM work. In a way, Adams really is a reflection of how Terry feels about NHL GMs. He feels that its a job anyone can do, and it doesn't matter who you hire.

The fact that they are now actively seeking a senior advisor does say that there is at least SOME lessons learned here. Will it actually matter with Adams as GM?

Probably not.

I think Terry just wants to feel included and it’s as simple as that. He wants the opportunity to give input on any and all decisions. But I think the amount of actual actionable, significant input that he ends up giving is minimal.

The only reason you notice him more at Sabres meetings a because the organization has like 10% the staff size, so he doesn’t blend in as much with the Sabres. And yeah, Kevyn isn’t as good at managing him because he’s friends with him too and that friendship always comes first.

I don't think Pegula is overbearing like Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder. The issue with Terry is when there is a split in consensus, and because he wants to be feel involved he steps in.

So instead of allowing the football/hockey people involved hash it out and/or rely on their internal hirearchy for who has final say, Terry jumps in and sometimes cuts his GMs legs out cause he sides with "the other guy".

Maybe Terry doesn't have notes at the NFL draft. But you can't convince me that Eric Decosta is sitting down right before the draft with Biscotti for a 17 hour film session to go over every snap for one prospect. I don't know, I'm not a pro scout or an executive at a pro sports team, but I don't think teams many (any?) are dedicating 17 hours watching one prospect the day before the draft unless there is some crazy reason to do so.

My uneducated guess is that there wasn't consensus and Pegula was trying to weigh in on the pick rather than enable McBeane to run the ship, so at the final hour they had to spend 17 hours convincing him.

 

[Der Jaeger]

To add on, his worst train might be prospect progression/management. NHL GM's have such a complex job managing teenagers across the world. Deciding who they should play for,when and for how long.

Unlike the NFL and NBA, prospect management/progression is arguably just as important (if not more) than picking the most talented player on draft day.

Another very good reason to have a POHO.

 

[Der Jaeger]

I'd be really happy with Dudley or Shanahan. Yes, everyone on the list of potential "advisors" has flaws, as does the idea of an "advisor to the GM" instead of a POHO. However, there are benefits.

By a lot of accounts, Buffalo is considered a nice place to live by many in the hockey world. The Sabres have long had a reputation for taking care of players, from a very giving owner to a GM who trades players at the deadline to go win Cups. There are very few comments to the contrary.

Where Buffalo has a bad reputation is management decisions. They just can't win. Make a batch of cookies and pour in some vinegar. It doesn't matter about anything else, the cookies are bad now.

I think Buffalo has drafted well, and do a decent job of development in Rochester. I also think they make some good trades. But no one wants to come to Buffalo as a free agent or drop their NTC/NMC for Buffalo. Imagine if it were different. Matt Murray accepts a trade to Buffalo, and the Sabres come out of the draft with Marco Kasper, Ostlund or Savoie, and Kulich. Things like that are happening all the time, based on Adams' reactions at trade deadlines and in the off-season.

Imagine you're Sam Bennett. You're literally exactly what Buffalo needs to win. Adams calls your agent, and you're offered the best contract you're going to get by $1-2M. But you're not interested in Buffalo, so you move on. So you tell your agent to turn Adams down. That's right now.

Now imagine that same scenario, but then your agent says Shanahan or Dudley want to talk to you. You're taking that call. You'll listen, at least.

I'm not saying either of those two guys changes anything. Not saying people start signing in Buffalo or dropping their NMC/NTC. But at a minimum, they'd give the organization a shred of legitimacy which they currently do not have.

 

[sabremike]

I'd be really happy with Dudley or Shanahan. Yes, everyone on the list of potential "advisors" has flaws, as does the idea of an "advisor to the GM" instead of a POHO. However, there are benefits.

By a lot of accounts, Buffalo is considered a nice place to live by many in the hockey world. The Sabres have long had a reputation for taking care of players, from a very giving owner to a GM who trades players at the deadline to go win Cups. There are very few comments to the contrary.

Where Buffalo has a bad reputation is management decisions. They just can't win. Make a batch of cookies and pour in some vinegar. It doesn't matter about anything else, the cookies are bad now.

I think Buffalo has drafted well, and do a decent job of development in Rochester. I also think they make some good trades. But no one wants to come to Buffalo as a free agent or drop their NTC/NMC for Buffalo. Imagine if it were different. Matt Murray accepts a trade to Buffalo, and the Sabres come out of the draft with Marco Kasper, Ostlund or Savoie, and Kulich. Things like that are happening all the time, based on Adams' reactions at trade deadlines and in the off-season.

Imagine you're Sam Bennett. You're literally exactly what Buffalo needs to win. Adams calls your agent, and you're offered the best contract you're going to get by $1-2M. But you're not interested in Buffalo, so you move on. So you tell your agent to turn Adams down. That's right now.

Now imagine that same scenario, but then your agent says Shanahan or Dudley want to talk to you. You're taking that call. You'll listen, at least.

I'm not saying either of those two guys changes anything. Not saying people start signing in Buffalo or dropping their NMC/NTC. But at a minimum, they'd give the organization a shred of legitimacy which they currently do not have.

People forget that Florida was not seen as a glorious place for UFA's to go until they got competent ownership and became a legit contender. Pittsburgh has been a desired place to go for a quarter century despite being, well... Pittsburgh and the reason should be painfully obvious. If by some miracle the Sabres make the playoffs next season and do damage the lack of palm trees would no longer mean shit.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Darche to be named Isles GM (No further front office hires per A. Staples)
Bergevin Special Advisor for Holland in LA

Leaves Shanahan, Blake, Gilman (who could also run the Amerks) and Jarmo, etc still hanging out there if Dudley does not take the SA position for Sabres.

If this was a serious organization we would of had a POH and experienced/competent GM this cycle. Instead it's Adams (year 6), Staal (no experience), there loosing Karmanos, and hopes and prayers hinging on that Dudley wants to work back in his home town, for his origional team, and Adams.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Beane was essentially Leicester City winning the Premier League: a million to one shot that somehow happened. Until Beane he was running the Bills every bit as incompetently as the Sabres (Rex Ryan anyone???). Pegula has the worst judgement when it comes to hiring people I have ever seen: Remember how back to back heads of PSE had to be fired because of sexual misconduct?

Revisionist History Mike.
Beane came on McDermotts recommendation (or perhaps demand).

 

[HaNotsri]

Shanahan kind of the perfect addition for the sabres

Seems to have had more of a hand in the structure and build and overall guidance of the hockey management side

It's 100% what the sabres need

Imagine Peca and Shanahan on the Sabres. Adams would spend whole weeks with his head pushed into the toilet bowl.

 

[toddkaz]

NHL draft in 4 weeks and free agency in 5 weeks

Where is the senior advisor?