The reason why Wayne Gretzky's career point totals don't need to be surpassed to be the greatest... | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League

The reason why Wayne Gretzky's career point totals don't need to be surpassed to be the greatest...

Nightmare1000

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May 1, 2017
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Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Wayne Gretzky is considered by most to be the greatest hockey player of all time because of his high skill level and insane career stats and accomplishments. Most of his records will never be broken because of how the NHL has changed today compared to when he played. The stat that most people hold as his greatest is his regular season career point total of 2857 points which makes up his record 894 goals and 1963 assists. I personally believe him having more assists than any other player has points while having the most goals is the greatest statistical accomplishment in sports history. Anyways the reason why a hockey player doesn't need to surpass his career point totals to be considered greater than him is because in order for a player to pass his regular season point totals they would need to average 143 points per season for 20 straight seasons. No player in the NHL has scored more than 130 points in a season since the 1990's. I don't need to explain why that is basically impossible in today's NHL but yeah since that isn't possible unless the NHL changes drastically than we shouldn't say no player has a chance of becoming the greatest NHL player in history by surpassing Wayne Gretzky. In my opinion in order for a player to surpass Gretzky they will need to win more awards and Stanley Cups than him while being ahead of everyone else in the NHL as far ahead as he was and for consistently as long as he was too. The chances of anyone even accomplishing that is very hard since all it takes is one bad injury and your chances are gone such as Sidney Crosby's was when he started having concussion problems. We will have to wait and see how close Connor McDavid can get to surpassing Wayne Gretzky as the greatest hockey player of all time.
 
Yeah, obviously.

Someone just needs to dominate the scoring race to the same or a very similar extent for a number of years, win a bunch of awards and some Cups.

I mean, it'll be very, very hard to do, but obviously one shouldn't have to score about 3000 points in this era to surpass Wayne.
 
If McDavid can win four or five scoring Titles by the time he's 25, I think he may have a shot, TBH. He'd have to win some of them by wide margins, too - not by 60/70 points but by at least 25/30.
 
It's not about the points. It's about the hardware and domination against their peers. If McDavid strings together 7 or 8 scoring titles and outscores 2nd place by enough of a margin, then the discussions start. That's what Gretzky did.
 
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To pass Gretzky McDavid will need to win 10 more Art Ross trophies, 9 more Hart Memorial trophies and 5 more Ted Lindsay trophies. He should also win 5 Stanley Cups and 3 Conn Smythe trophies to put it beyond doubt.
 
To pass Gretzky McDavid will need to win 10 more Art Ross trophies, 9 more Hart Memorial trophies and 5 more Ted Lindsay trophies. He should also win 5 Stanley Cups and 3 Conn Smythe trophies to put it beyond doubt.


I think the OP is just lowering the bar if you 1/5 of that it makes you better then the great one
 
Wayne Gretzky is considered by most to be the greatest hockey player of all time because of his high skill level and insane career stats and accomplishments. Most of his records will never be broken because of how the NHL has changed today compared to when he played. The stat that most people hold as his greatest is his regular season career point total of 2857 points which makes up his record 894 goals and 1963 assists. I personally believe him having more assists than any other player has points while having the most goals is the greatest statistical accomplishment in sports history. Anyways the reason why a hockey player doesn't need to surpass his career point totals to be considered greater than him is because in order for a player to pass his regular season point totals they would need to average 143 points per season for 20 straight seasons. No player in the NHL has scored more than 130 points in a season since the 1990's. I don't need to explain why that is basically impossible in today's NHL but yeah since that isn't possible unless the NHL changes drastically than we shouldn't say no player has a chance of becoming the greatest NHL player in history by surpassing Wayne Gretzky. In my opinion in order for a player to surpass Gretzky they will need to win more awards and Stanley Cups than him while being ahead of everyone else in the NHL as far ahead as he was and for consistently as long as he was too. The chances of anyone even accomplishing that is very hard since all it takes is one bad injury and your chances are gone such as Sidney Crosby's was when he started having concussion problems. We will have to wait and see how close Connor McDavid can get to surpassing Wayne Gretzky as the greatest hockey player of all time.

So why didn't all the other greats who played in that era post as outrageous numbers on a consistent basis.

For those who haven't seen Gretzky play, I'd think the closest you can do to understand how great Gretzky was is to look at the statistical differences between Gretzky and the 2nd best player in each season.
McDavid is a good player but he hasn't done anything to show he is currently THAT much better than the next greatest player in the league.

Nothing is impossible, and records can be broken, but I don't think we will see it anytime soon. Not by Crosby, and likely not by McDavid
 
Forget point totals!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Simply be THE BEST of your era as dominantly as he was:

Start your career off with eight (8) straight Hart trophies. Then continue to be one of the best of your era for another decade or so.

Points

Assists
 
Gretzky has 900-1000 points more than the next best player in history. Nobody will ever dominate over their peers like that ever again. Ever. Not even looking at points as a raw number, considering Jagr, Messier, Francis, Yzerman, Mario, Sakic, all played in an era similar to Wayne. He had multiple seasons scoring 70+ more than the next guy.

10 Art Ross, 9 Hart, 5 what would be Richard's. He was an animal.
 
So why didn't all the other greats who played in that era post as outrageous numbers on a consistent basis.

For those who haven't seen Gretzky play, I'd think the closest you can do to understand how great Gretzky was is to look at the statistical differences between Gretzky and the 2nd best player in each season.
McDavid is a good player but he hasn't done anything to show he is currently THAT much better than the next greatest player in the league.

Nothing is impossible, and records can be broken, but I don't think we will see it anytime soon. Not by Crosby, and likely not by McDavid
The other players didn't have anywhere near the points because that's how much better he was than everyone else. Someone would have to be that far ahead of others the way he was. Hasn't anyone read what I wrote about what I think it would take to surpass Gretzky.
 
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It's not about points, it's about domination over your peers. There has not been another player who has been close in this regard since Gretzky. Lemieux was certainly close but his first couple of years weren't as dominant as Gretzky.
 
Gretzky has 900-1000 points more than the next best player in history. Nobody will ever dominate over their peers like that ever again. Ever. Not even looking at points as a raw number, considering Jagr, Messier, Francis, Yzerman, Mario, Sakic, all played in an era similar to Wayne. He had multiple seasons scoring 70+ more than the next guy.

10 Art Ross, 9 Hart, 5 what would be Richard's. He was an animal.
Most likely it won't happen but as fans we can only hope someday someone can pass him.
 
It's not about points, it's about domination over your peers. There has not been another player who has been close in this regard since Gretzky. Lemieux was certainly close but his first couple of years weren't as dominant as Gretzky.
Yes I know and that it something that won't be easy considering how dominant he was. I go back and look at his stats and the amount difference in his statistics compared to everyone season by season is unworldly.
 
Forget point totals!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Simply be THE BEST of your era as dominantly as he was:

Start your career off with eight (8) straight Hart trophies. Then continue to be one of the best of your era for another decade or so.

Points
Assists


OP needs to look at this list and go... it maybe a little harder then I laid out.

To even be considered someone would need to win at least 5 or 6 art ross trophies in a row-- or is that not setting the bar low enough
 
Yes I know and that it something that won't be easy considering how dominant he was. I go back and look at his stats and the amount difference in his statistics compared to everyone season by season is unworldly.

And that is why Gretzky is viewed the way he is. He literally did things that people didn't believe was possible.

If a player shows up now and puts up multiple 120 - 140 point seasons while his peers can barely get 100 then the comparisons will need to he made.
 
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Anyways the reason why a hockey player doesn't need to surpass his career point totals to be considered greater than him is because in order for a player to pass his regular season point totals they would need to average 143 points per season for 20 straight seasons. No player in the NHL has scored more than 130 points in a season since the 1990's.

Gretzky clearly averaged this over his career. Your logic here is strange. No one has scored more than 130 pts in a season since the 90's because no one has been as good as Gretzky.

Perhaps the reason it seems so far fetched is because someone being as good as Gretzky is just that far fetched.
 
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