OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: 5 and 2 Justin who? Hand the Fields to Wilson

[TooManyHumans]

I think people are massively overstating Pickens' issues. He is immature but he is also only 23, younger than Porter and Fautanu. He hasn't gotten in any trouble off the field and his on field trouble has been a few dumb penalties and some poor efforts during a time he was not being used correctly while seeing the guy getting all the targets he should have been getting (DJ) giving poor effort. Pickens is a good teammate and his teammates like him. I also don't think Tomlin has said much to indicate that he is exasperated with Pickens or fed up with him. He said Pickens needs to grow up, which is true. I want Pickens to do that growing up with this team because he is young and talented as hell. It would be a big mistake to let him go.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I just can't see that as the NFL can't give Pickens what he wants - his desire to live without discipline or consequences is just not going to fly problem free in that job - and smart teams should be unwilling to give up good prices for guys like that because they're never going to give the team the reliability and leadership they want.

Those goes double when the guy's contract is up for renewal.

I'm sure they'd take him for fee, or hand him a 10m 1 year prove it contract after his rookie contract if nobody else is giving him any better, but handing over a good price so they can screw up their cap structure? Don't see it. I'd be stunned. That's dumbarse Raiders or Browns shit.

Was just going to say this. There are always teams who need to make these desperation moves.

Cleveland did this very thing with Watson. Look how that's going.
Jets did it with Rodgers. A disaster. Then they doubled down by trading for Adams.
KC likely won't entertain this type of stuff as they got a good thing/vibe going for them.

 

[pistolpete11]

I see it both ways.

I think the issues with Pickens are major red flags. We've seen how this plays out and it's a ticking timebomb. At the same time, I don't think there have been any major blowups that would scare teams off too much. He's too good. It's kinda hard to find a comparable. Most WR that get traded 1) aren't nearly as good or 2) are highly paid and older.

I think if you can get a haul for him, you consider it. Otherwise, just try to negotiate the contract so it's not too painful if you have to cut him.

 

[Peat]

I see it both ways.

I think the issues with Pickens are major red flags. We've seen how this plays out and it's a ticking timebomb. At the same time, I don't think there have been any major blowups that would scare teams off too much. He's too good. It's kinda hard to find a comparable. Most WR that get traded 1) aren't nearly as good or 2) are highly paid and older.

I think if you can get a haul for him, you consider it. Otherwise, just try to negotiate the contract so it's not too painful if you have to cut him.

This is where we get to the Tomlin effect though. All the media reports on how people had no idea on how big an annoyance ex-Steelers players were until they signed them themselves and things of that nature. Or to use the big recent one, how Diontae Johnson went from annoyance in Pittsburgh to getting suspended in Baltimore.

So if you're a team that believes in Mike Tomlin's ability to manage people do you look at Pickens and think "well, nothing that major yet" or do you think "my god if he's like that with Mike, what the hell is he going to do over here"?

If you want to find a comp for his value in terms of pure numbers, I'd go with AJ Brown. Traded as a WR1 at the end of Y3 on his rookie contract and the two currently have similar numbers of games played, targets, yards per reception and so on. There's a bit of a bias towards Brown in terms of first downs, yards per game, and particularly touchdowns, but I feel sure that if you traded Pickens this summer you could sweet talk yourself into a similar price to Brown - providing you got Pickens a full personality wipe and remake first.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

This is where we get to the Tomlin effect though. All the media reports on how people had no idea on how big an annoyance ex-Steelers players were until they signed them themselves and things of that nature. Or to use the big recent one, how Diontae Johnson went from annoyance in Pittsburgh to getting suspended in Baltimore.

So if you're a team that believes in Mike Tomlin's ability to manage people do you look at Pickens and think "well, nothing that major yet" or do you think "my god if he's like that with Mike, what the hell is he going to do over here"?

If you want to find a comp for his value in terms of pure numbers, I'd go with AJ Brown. Traded as a WR1 at the end of Y3 on his rookie contract and the two currently have similar numbers of games played, targets, yards per reception and so on. There's a bit of a bias towards Brown in terms of first downs, yards per game, and particularly touchdowns, but I feel sure that if you traded Pickens this summer you could sweet talk yourself into a similar price to Brown - providing you got Pickens a full personality wipe and remake first.

And AJ is going crazy in Philly because Hurts doesn’t throw his way often

 

[Peat]

They should have renamed this week's episode of Hard Knocks to Hard Coughs.

 

[Colonel Mustard]

They should have renamed this week's episode of Hard Knocks to Hard Coughs.

Its no surprise he doesnt cover his mouth

 

[pistolpete11]

This is where we get to the Tomlin effect though. All the media reports on how people had no idea on how big an annoyance ex-Steelers players were until they signed them themselves and things of that nature. Or to use the big recent one, how Diontae Johnson went from annoyance in Pittsburgh to getting suspended in Baltimore.

So if you're a team that believes in Mike Tomlin's ability to manage people do you look at Pickens and think "well, nothing that major yet" or do you think "my god if he's like that with Mike, what the hell is he going to do over here"?

I don't know, man. Teams have given up a lot and paid guys a lot for far worse than anything Pickens has shown. Watson being the prime example there.

And if teams really had that much faith in Tomlin being the diva whisperer, you'd think our biggest divisional rival would have realized it before trading for one of those castoffs.

If you want to find a comp for his value in terms of pure numbers, I'd go with AJ Brown. Traded as a WR1 at the end of Y3 on his rookie contract and the two currently have similar numbers of games played, targets, yards per reception and so on. There's a bit of a bias towards Brown in terms of first downs, yards per game, and particularly touchdowns, but I feel sure that if you traded Pickens this summer you could sweet talk yourself into a similar price to Brown - providing you got Pickens a full personality wipe and remake first.

That's a pretty good comparison. 18th overall + a 3rd? That's a tough one, though. There are other factors of course, but the Eagles went from a 9-8, one-and-done team, middle of the pack offense the year prior to 14-3 and reaching the Super Bowl with a top 5 offense with Brown, though it's slipped a bit since. The Titans have since plummeted as an offense and as a team (though that could be because Artie left, too )

I'd be more likely to pull the trigger on that if they had someone waiting in the wings, but they need another WR as is. Now if they sign Higgins and then use the extra draft capital on another WR, maybe.

 

[JTG]

This is where we get to the Tomlin effect though. All the media reports on how people had no idea on how big an annoyance ex-Steelers players were until they signed them themselves and things of that nature. Or to use the big recent one, how Diontae Johnson went from annoyance in Pittsburgh to getting suspended in Baltimore.

So if you're a team that believes in Mike Tomlin's ability to manage people do you look at Pickens and think "well, nothing that major yet" or do you think "my god if he's like that with Mike, what the hell is he going to do over here"?

If you want to find a comp for his value in terms of pure numbers, I'd go with AJ Brown. Traded as a WR1 at the end of Y3 on his rookie contract and the two currently have similar numbers of games played, targets, yards per reception and so on. There's a bit of a bias towards Brown in terms of first downs, yards per game, and particularly touchdowns, but I feel sure that if you traded Pickens this summer you could sweet talk yourself into a similar price to Brown - providing you got Pickens a full personality wipe and remake first.

It's easy to put up with something when you don't deal with it.

Brown and Bell totally clowned this team.

 

[MrBrightside]

The cult of Ohio State never fails to amuse.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

The cult of Ohio State never fails to amuse.

Reason One thousand and forty two why people hate politicians...

 

[Peat]

I don't know, man. Teams have given up a lot and paid guys a lot for far worse than anything Pickens has shown. Watson being the prime example there.

And if teams really had that much faith in Tomlin being the diva whisperer, you'd think our biggest divisional rival would have realized it before trading for one of those castoffs.

I might be wrong given how yeah, sometimes teams do pay up for known nutcases, but I think in this case after how long the "if Tomlin can't control Pickens, nobody can" narrative has been running, I'm leaning towards it. I also think NFL teams are more comfortable with out and out criminals who act as professionals in the facility than erratic professionals who wouldn't do crap outside. The former is just a PR problem as long as you keep them from committing crimes.

Also the Ravens paid SFA for Johnson and then proceeded to not use him. I don't know what's going on there but it certainly doesn't feel like the Ravens thought they were getting a great guy and were betrayed. More like they brought something from the clearance shelves, took a sniff when they got home, then put in a bag in the pantry to return to the shop later.

That's a pretty good comparison. 18th overall + a 3rd? That's a tough one, though. There are other factors of course, but the Eagles went from a 9-8, one-and-done team, middle of the pack offense the year prior to 14-3 and reaching the Super Bowl with a top 5 offense with Brown, though it's slipped a bit since. The Titans have since plummeted as an offense and as a team (though that could be because Artie left, too )

I'd be more likely to pull the trigger on that if they had someone waiting in the wings, but they need another WR as is. Now if they sign Higgins and then use the extra draft capital on another WR, maybe.

The Titans had some other problems too - Tannehill started getting injured, their OL got worse from when Smith starter - but yeah, Brown's move was critical for both teams. And we've just seen what Pickens means for this team as currently constructed. So I get being reluctant to make the move.

But I just don't really trust Pickens to play like a 25m+ player.

 

[Fiji Water]

Lol. Pickens is trending as a top 5 receiver in the league. He's not a criminal. You pay that kind of player every time and deal with the childish antics. Teammates seem to generally like him, so it doesn't seem like he's creating any locker room issues either.

 

[MrBrightside]

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

This is funny

Doc to show tense Gastineau-Favre rift from '23

Mark Gastineau still accuses Brett Favre of taking "a dive" so Michael Strahan could break Gastineau's sack record. Their tense '23 confrontation is part of an ESPN 30 for 30 documentary.

www.espn.com

 

[JTG]

This is funny

Doc to show tense Gastineau-Favre rift from '23

Mark Gastineau still accuses Brett Favre of taking "a dive" so Michael Strahan could break Gastineau's sack record. Their tense '23 confrontation is part of an ESPN 30 for 30 documentary.

www.espn.com

Gastineau is a lunatic. His sack record has been broken now anyway. He was a one dimensional pass rusher. His last 3 years were shit aside from the 7 final games, and I'm 99% sure he was on steroids at that time.

He can f*** all the way off.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Gastineau is a lunatic. His sack record has been broken now anyway. He was a one dimensional pass rusher. His last 3 years were shit aside from the 7 final games, and I'm 99% sure he was on steroids at that time.

He can f*** all the way off.

Yeah this little kerfluffle is confounding because they both suck. It's like how I felt for that Ravens-49ers Super Bowl.

 

[End of Line]

The cult of Ohio State never fails to amuse.

f***ing stupid. And of course it’s from a state rep out of Toledo

 

[pistolpete11]

But I just don't really trust Pickens to play like a 25m+ player.

It'd definitely be a risk, but I'd rather take the risk than get back a 2nd or 3rd or whatever. He's too talented.

Basically, my stance is that I'd only be willing to listen to offers because of the nonsense. If he didn't have the red flags, it's not even on the table. So if a team wants him, I'm listening, but they are going to have to pay up.