SSM Greyhounds 2024 - 25 Season Thread, Part I

[Houndzfan20]

Just checking in on Brodie M-B...
How has he been playing this season? Noticeable improvement?

Imo, no. He seems a bit slow. Maybe from his early season injury? But some of thr 17 year olds have passed him, or are close to passing him

Sounds like a few select posters undervalue Gibby. He's the top D available at the deadline, and a right hander, which increases that value.

Seems like maybe it's the Firebirds Org. that overvalued Kostov, not the hounds.

I thought kostov was developing really good here. I was actually not happy he was included. Maybe it's flint.

If there's only picks involved, I say it's close to Donovan trade. if a good young prospect, I say 08, 2,3,3. If it's an 07, 2,2,3

I will say I hope he goes to Oshawa. I'd like another brady smith and I think Oshawas defence would be ridiculous and make osters life easy for a long playoff run

 

[leafs4life94]

IMO a Gibby deal will involve a decent prospect and 3-5 picks depending on the player involved. Feel free to revisit that prediction after the deadline. But don't conflate your lack of tradeable assets with a lack of value for a half season of Gibby. Personally I'd trade anything for a cup.

If that's too rich for Kingston's blood then so be it, someone else will pay. I'm sure the 2nd round exit won't sting for too long.

But you've already switched what you think Gibson's value is - at first it was top prospect and a boatload of picks (which prompted my response), now to a decent prospect and 3-5 picks. Hopkins is more than just a decent prospect, so naturally the picks should go down. I think the second is closer to his actual value.

Regardless of the difference in opinion of the players (obviously every team is gonna overvalue their own guy - I'm well I'm probably doing it with Hopkins) moving Hopkins just opens up a hole that's arguably harder to fill than the hole Gibson trade.

I don't think it'll happen because they just signed him as an AP for next year, but Kieren Dervin is one player that could fit Soo's needs - an '07 C with some size, just shy of 2 PPG with St. Andrews College - while also not taking away from Kingston's top 6. Obviously it'd have to come with a ton of picks - essentially add the majority of the Donovan equivalent.

 

[Fischhaber]

You overvalue Gibson. Just like most Hounds players including Kostov who at 18 is a mediocre 4th liner at best. Just flat out slow, not a great skater and zero offensive instincts. I’d take Donovan or McCoy or Andonovski over Gibson and Collins isn’t far behind. I remember sending clips of Gavin Hayes to a friend on draft day and my friend asking what I thought of Wings pick Gibson. My response? “Well, the D getting beat on 3 of those 4 Hayes highlights is Gibson.”

I'm disappointed that Kostov regressed so badly in Flint. He looked to have a shot at getting drafted before the trade, as he was ranked by NHL central scouting. Maybe a nagging injury or something in his personal life derailed his game. Hounds fans were upset to see him go, as he was a real spark plug on the 3rd line who contributed offensively.

Clattenburg has really exceeded expectations, which is nice to see. It goes to show the volatility in young players. Him getting drafted was completely unexpected and a pleasant surprise.

Regarding Gibson, I believe that OHL coaches have voted him as the league's best defender for 2 consecutive seasons (or at least top 3) and Team Canada executives see him as one of the best junior defensemen in Canada. I base his value off of those expert opinions more than my own evaluations.

 

[HockeyPops]

Your really condescending tone

Oh man, now that's funny.

 

[DWI Dale]

But you've already switched what you think Gibson's value is - at first it was top prospect and a boatload of picks (which prompted my response), now to a decent prospect and 3-5 picks. Hopkins is more than just a decent prospect, so naturally the picks should go down. I think the second is closer to his actual value.

Regardless of the difference in opinion of the players (obviously every team is gonna overvalue their own guy - I'm well I'm probably doing it with Hopkins) moving Hopkins just opens up a hole that's arguably harder to fill than the hole Gibson trade.

I don't think it'll happen because they just signed him as an AP for next year, but Kieren Dervin is one player that could fit Soo's needs - an '07 C with some size, just shy of 2 PPG with St. Andrews College - while also not taking away from Kingston's top 6. Obviously it'd have to come with a ton of picks - essentially add the majority of the Donovan equivalent.

I would consider 5 a boatload, and 3 might be reasonable for a high end player. fair enough?

I don't think losing Hopkins opens as much of a hole as you do, I think he needs to be upgraded at 2C either way in order to contend. Nothing against him, but he's 17 and the playoffs is a different game.

If Dervin is so hot, why isn't he on your roster yet at 17? Is he an NCAA commit?

Oh man, now that's funny.

I was thinking that myself HP. We all clearly all have differing opinions on Gibby, but IMO this is a healthy, respectful debate between OHL fans and I have no personal gripe with the opinions presented here, even though I disagree.

Fischy meet kettle, kettle this is Fischy.

 

[leafs4life94]

I would consider 5 a boatload, and 3 might be reasonable for a high end player. fair enough?

I don't think losing Hopkins opens as much of a hole as you do, I think he needs to be upgraded at 2C either way in order to contend. Nothing against him, but he's 17 and the playoffs is a different game.

If Dervin is so hot, why isn't he on your roster yet at 17? Is he an NCAA commit?

Yep Penn State commit for 26-27, currently playing at St. Andrew's (which I've heard is tough to get out of mid-season), planning on getting into a few games this year but being full-time next year.

I guess I was overestimating what you were calling a boatload - when I hear boatload I think the 7-9 picks that a Donovan or a Mintyukov cost.

 

[DWI Dale]

Yep Penn State commit for 26-27...

That's the consensus "all in" year for us so unless he's willing to forgo that commitment he's not really of great value to us as a 1 season 18 year old.

when I hear boatload I think the 7-9 picks that a Donovan or a Mintyukov cost.

That's more the price I'd expect if someone wants gibby with no prospect involved. And I'm not convinced that what we're after as we try to add '07s and '08s to the core.

 

[HockeyPops]

I guess I was overestimating what you were calling a boatload - when I hear boatload I think the 7-9 picks that a Donovan or a Mintyukov cost.

How many picks can you fit in a one man dingy with a slow air leak? Just because our GM owns a boat, doesn't mean it's the boat you are visualizing.

 

[Fischhaber]

How many picks can you fit in a one man dingy with a slow air leak? Just because our GM owns a boat, doesn't mean it's the boat you are visualizing.

I understand questioning some aspects of Raftis' drafting record and his overall strategy, but he's always done well in trades.

Constantly questioning everything he does could come off as somewhat condescending, when compared to someone who usually defers to expert opinions and sticks to facts.

 

[HockeyPops]

I understand questioning some aspects of Raftis' drafting record and his overall strategy, but he's always done well in trades.

Constantly questioning everything he does could come off as somewhat condescending, when compared to someone who usually defers to expert opinions and sticks to facts.

Fair I should stick to the facts.

Below is an exhaustive list of every big fish that Raftis has sold according to the database, and the return that he has received. The database covers every transaction for the past 10 seasons, which covers his entire time in the league. I suppose when faced with these facts, that nobody should doubt the size of his boat.

Complete List of Raftis Big Fish returns:

 

[DWI Dale]

HP SPITTING FACTS!

 

[JoeSchmo]

Fair I should stick to the facts.

Below is an exhaustive list of every big fish that Raftis has sold according to the database, and the return that he has received. The database covers every transaction for the past 10 seasons, which covers his entire time in the league. I suppose when faced with these facts, that nobody should doubt the size of his boat.

Complete List of Raftis Big Fish returns:

I dunno.. Alex Kostov…

 

[DWI Dale]

When I'm sad and lonely I often imagine the returns we could have gotten for guys like Hayton, Frost, Kerins, O'Rourke... Does that count as big fish returns? In my alternate universe we won the Memorial cup last year, bolstered by the returns of Kerins/O'Rourke. Oh well...

 

[Fischhaber]

Fair I should stick to the facts.

Below is an exhaustive list of every big fish that Raftis has sold according to the database, and the return that he has received. The database covers every transaction for the past 10 seasons, which covers his entire time in the league. I suppose when faced with these facts, that nobody should doubt the size of his boat.

Complete List of Raftis Big Fish returns:

Icing a good team every year isn't a valid criticism of a general manager. Here's all of the 'sell' trades for his first few years, at least according to the old database.

We got a 2nd and 6th for Keigan Goetz, who only had 6 points in 23 games at the time. The 2nd turned into Marco Mignosa. Nice deal for a bottom 6 guy. (A+)

He traded underperforming first rounder Liam Hawel for 3 high picks and Noah Carroll. Two of the picks were dealt again and the other was used on Robert Calisti, the best player in the deal. (B+)

We traded Alex Gritz for a 3rd and 10th. He had requested a trade and didn't do much with Erie. He was cut before he finished his OHL career. (A-)

We traded Joseph Raaymakers for Tyler Johnson and 3 high picks. Raaymakers was solid with London, but wasn't a playoff performer. Two of the picks were dealt, one was used on McGroarty. (B)

In an absolute fleecing, we somehow got a defenseman upgrade and 2 high picks when we dealt Anthony Demeo to Sudbury for Drew Wawrow. Those picks were Charlie Schenkel and Ethan Montroy. (A++)

No big fish, depending on how you define that, but a very strong track record nonetheless.

 

[DWI Dale]

Such a try hard. LoL

 

[Savard18]

Sounds like a few select posters undervalue Gibby. He's the top D available at the deadline, and a right hander, which increases that value. We know what we have in him.

Seems like maybe it's the Firebirds that overvalued Kostov, not the hounds.

Oh, for sure they did and every fanbase overvalues their players to a certain extent. I expect Gibson to return a nice haul for the Soo but I’d still take Andonovski or McCoy over him. If I can shuffle an OA spot, for the cost I’d take Collins or K. Smith too. When guys like Xhekaj or Dickinson or older Brustewicz or Parehk are on the ice I’m nervous and something usually happens to warrant that concern. Gibson? Not so much and while he’s reliable and unassuming he’s never wowed me with any play and I’ve seen him quite a bit too. He has 7 points right now. I think he transitions to a solid pro career but I don’t see him being the cornerstone D to a Championship team this year. A great compliment to a team’s top pairing? Sure. As far as Kostov goes, I question Flint’s ability to develop right now too but Alex was a slow, mediocre skater from day 1 and that he didn’t happen overnight. He was slow. He barely has OHL foot speed, let alone getting drafted.

 

[OHLfan200]

Oh, for sure they did and every fanbase overvalues their players to a certain extent. I expect Gibson to return a nice haul for the Soo but I’d still take Andonovski or McCoy over him. If I can shuffle an OA spot, for the cost I’d take Collins or K. Smith too. When guys like Xhekaj or Dickinson or older Brustewicz or Parehk are on the ice I’m nervous and something usually happens to warrant that concern. Gibson? Not so much and while he’s reliable and unassuming he’s never wowed me with any play and I’ve seen him quite a bit too. He has 7 points right now. I think he transitions to a solid pro career but I don’t see him being the cornerstone D to a Championship team this year. A great compliment to a team’s top pairing? Sure. As far as Kostov goes, I question Flint’s ability to develop right now too but Alex was a slow, mediocre skater from day 1 and that he didn’t happen overnight. He was slow. He barely has OHL foot speed, let alone getting drafted.

Of course fans are going to overvalue their players like youre saying. Gibby being the most desired d-man at the deadline isn’t only coming from soo fans. It sounds like multiple teams are in on him and willing to go into a bidding war. Also, his point production isn’t why he’s so desired. And no, he won’t wow you by being flashy. You notice when he’s OUT of your lineup however. His defensive play is really solid. In the Erie road trip when he was hurt the Greyhounds gave up 20 goals in 3 games.

 

[Houndzfan20]

Oh, for sure they did and every fanbase overvalues their players to a certain extent. I expect Gibson to return a nice haul for the Soo but I’d still take Andonovski or McCoy over him. If I can shuffle an OA spot, for the cost I’d take Collins or K. Smith too. When guys like Xhekaj or Dickinson or older Brustewicz or Parehk are on the ice I’m nervous and something usually happens to warrant that concern. Gibson? Not so much and while he’s reliable and unassuming he’s never wowed me with any play and I’ve seen him quite a bit too. He has 7 points right now. I think he transitions to a solid pro career but I don’t see him being the cornerstone D to a Championship team this year. A great compliment to a team’s top pairing? Sure. As far as Kostov goes, I question Flint’s ability to develop right now too but Alex was a slow, mediocre skater from day 1 and that he didn’t happen overnight. He was slow. He barely has OHL foot speed, let alone getting drafted.

Well crap. If you don't see him as a cornerstone d to get a championship, then I guess he isn't.

And here we are hoping ohl gms see something that isn't there. Well, it was a good run boys.

 

[OHLfan200]

London will just drive the price up like they always do and drop out of the race

I see Oshawa as the best destination for a guy like Gibson. If not Oshawa then Brampton and karmiris who is an 06 forward will be the one involved

An 06 would be a nice touch. Hounds are weak in that department.

 

[Houndzfan20]

An 06 would be a nice touch. Hounds are weak in that department.

Maybe van volsen. His dad was a hound

 

[Fischhaber]

Maybe van volsen. His dad was a hound

I think he'd be a nice target in an Allard trade that was rumoured earlier this year.

 

[JoeSchmo]

Gibson a scratch today

 

[Fischhaber]

Gibson a scratch today

I was just going to say before reading the second tweet that guys who need to fight for a spot are usually in the lineup. I'd imagine they already have Gibson penciled in as a shutdown/PK guy, as he's probably the best defender on the squad.

 

[DWI Dale]

maybe Hockey Canada just overvalues him?

 

[frontsfan67]

maybe Hockey Canada just overvalues him?

Phenomenal defensive d man. Not the best d man in the league though. To be that you have to be good at both offence and defence.

Don’t know if there is a better defensive d and any team that gets this guy will have a seriously good player on the back end.


Still. Would I trade Hopkins who is a top 6 guy this year and will be a star the next 2 for half a year of 1 player? No. Don’t think that closes the gap between us and London/barrie/oshawa.

Sarnia probably regrets that martone trade right around now