JediOrderPizza
Registered User
Very weird indeed, I can only assume the earlier trade where they got Kiiskinen and a 2nd for Andrew Gibson was the reason for not caring about losing a 2nd.
Confirmed Trade: [SJS/DET] Jake Walman and 2024 2nd round pick for future considerations
- Thread starter MMC
- Start date
oceanchild
Registered User
I don’t know if you meant to burn Yzerman this hard or not, but damn, if giving away a solid Dman in Walman and adding a 2nd round sweetener isn’t note worthy in significance …………
Hodge
Registered User
- Apr 27, 2021
- 6,852
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The problem with the Yzerplan is that they still don’t have an elite forward on the roster or in the system and have no realistic path to acquiring one. Losing a 28yo 2nd pair dman and a late 2nd round pick doesn’t make a difference.
JediOrderPizza
Registered User
What's an elite forward in your mind? I'm curious since it's different for everyone.
They might be a playoff team if they had a competent 2nd pair this year. Walman and using that 2nd to actually acquire another top 4D and you have a competent 2nd pair
bleedgreen
Registered User
I don’t think they miss him, they made space for their younger guys that they needed - and if Walman was worth more why didn’t he bring more back? He was offered to the league and the only team interested was the only team taking on cap dumps. Good for them for finding value but I still don’t see the world ending fuss here, and I’m not a Detroit fan. Walman had struggled at times in Detroit, on and off the rink? Walman got suspended already this season on a team that needs him. Maybe we don’t all agree with the reason, but it’s also the player telling us the reason not the team. Maybe there’s more there?
Whenever you have to attach anything to move a player that tells you a lot about the players worth to the league. This isn’t the smoking gun the curiously fanatic anti-Yzerman crowd needs it to be. I don’t think anyone is really minding this trade aside from SJ fans and the aforementioned fanatics.
CanadienShark
Registered User
- Dec 18, 2012
- 40,100
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JoeThorntonsRooster
Don’t say eye test when you mean points
Any reason they couldn't have just made space for their younger guys by waiving boat anchor Ben Chiarot who plays the exact same position as Walman and has been playing 20:45 per night?
bleedgreen
Registered User
Probably because they like what the boat anchor brings. No one would take him on waivers and it’s dumb to pay someone that kind of money in the AHL if you think there’s value as a player - and many players have value to their coaches that we as fans don’t see or agree with.
I don’t understand the minutes comment for this overall conversation. Of course Walman is going to play more for the Sharks. They’re a bottom dweller and desperately needed some defenseman with experience - of course he’s going to get bigger minutes. That’s a pretty standard thing to happen.
When the Canes sucked they got Sekera who was being underutilized and made him their number one-ish D for awhile. Bottom dwellers are a great place for guys to get a shot they weren’t going to get anywhere else. Good for Walman to make the most of it but this just isn’t a strong argument against Yzerman. Every team in the league could’ve taken this guy and refused.
Juxtaposer
Outro: Divina Comedia
I mean, Walman is putting up ridiculous numbers next to Cody fricking Ceci, who is every bit as bad as Jeff Petry...
JediOrderPizza
Registered User
There's no way sir.
But it's moot anyways, Walman never put up those numbers even with Seider.
Hobnobs
Pinko
- Nov 29, 2011
- 9,383
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Yes, for an all out offensive team that is a bottom feeder in the league. Walman is bad when he is depended on in important games. Not when playing in hopeless situations and the pressure is off.
Juxtaposer
Outro: Divina Comedia
Ah, yes, Walman definitely wouldn't thrive on the high-flying, contender-adjacent, definitely-not-bottom-feeding Detroit Red Wings, who are most certainly playing high-pressure important games and are a very hopeful situation. Sir no sir!
Or, there was always something more to him and Yzerman missed it. Unless you think Seider was holding him back?
JediOrderPizza
Registered User
More so that they had a legendary tough deployment season over all others and he just couldn't handle it like Seider. His last 20 or so games here were really bad, he was a scratch in the final games.
Glad he is doing well, and like I said earlier it was best for Walman to get out. I don't think he puts those numbers up for the Wings.
Sharks are not that far off the Red Wings in their rebuild because of Celebrini.
Celebrini is so damn good that he probably makes the Sharks a #20ish team as soon as next year by himself. Just incredible. Add to that Askarov and the fact Dickinson is a STUD... Things could get better real fast... And I am not even talking about Smith and Musty.
Wings were less lucky with theur drafting. While Seider and Raymond are great (and I love ASP), they don't have a Celebrini kind of talent to push them over the top fast.
Walman should not be a #1 on any team, but he's certainly a decent 2nd pair D. Weird trade by Shanahan, but that was probably caused by the salary lockjam from signing guys like Chiarot, Copp and co.
Locker room issues were rumored, we'll know more someday.
Celebrini is so damn good that he probably makes the Sharks a #20ish team as soon as next year by himself. Just incredible. Add to that Askarov and the fact Dickinson is a STUD... Things could get better real fast... And I am not even talking about Smith and Musty.
Wings were less lucky with theur drafting. While Seider and Raymond are great (and I love ASP), they don't have a Celebrini kind of talent to push them over the top fast.
Walman should not be a #1 on any team, but he's certainly a decent 2nd pair D. Weird trade by Shanahan, but that was probably caused by the salary lockjam from signing guys like Chiarot, Copp and co.
Locker room issues were rumored, we'll know more someday.
Reggae Shark
Registered User
- Sep 30, 2018
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Walman is titties galore out here on the west coast. Maybe it was just the non-seasonal Detroit Depression that was getting him down.
Hobnobs
Pinko
- Nov 29, 2011
- 9,383
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That's a good strawman but he's not playing for Detroit this year is he? Look at him last year for sources to my claim. This is just sad.
JoeThorntonsRooster
Don’t say eye test when you mean points
So, the Wings like what Chiarot brings, and they had to get rid of one of he or Walman (to make space for young guys), so they kept Chiarot and paid a 2nd round pick to dump Walman. Now Chiarot is playing 20:45 on Detroit and has been one of the worst players in the league, while Walman has been very strong with SJ.
Do you not see how this is still a massive indictment of Yzerman?
Internazionale
Registered User
RedHawkDown
still trying to trust the yzerplan
I’m pretty sure fans that watched Hronek for the entirety of his career before he came to Vancouver know Hronek. What a ridiculous comment.
I am very glad he took his game to the next level in Vancouver, but he was not that player in Detroit, and had shown essentially no signs of being that guy. It’s a win win trade because we got a prospect with that pick that we are very excited about and Vancouver got a very good defenseman that took another step there. This HF obsession with someone needing to lose every trade is exhausting.
This walman trade though, yeah Yzerman f***ed up hard.
The reports I read following the trade suggested Walman was only shopped to a handful of teams and there were a few GM’s surveyed who would have traded positive value for him. The “offered to the league” and “had to attach assets” angle has become part of your narrative defending the trade, but insiders who researched the trade suggests that neither is true.
Not only that, there was a report that the Sharks themselves would have claimed Walman had he been on waivers, Yzerman just messed up the negotiation, and didn't even consider that someone might want him.
With the way ASP looks, I do that Hronek trade 100/100 times.
Hronek isn’t a true top pair D but paid like one
bleedgreen
Registered User
Not even a little bit. I think you have to have an agenda with a desperate need for people to hate Yzerman like you do for whatever reason to see this is such. It’s a second round pick to move a guy no one wanted. For all we know he did offer the world the same second round pick for Chiarot but people wanted the offensive guy in Walman. That’s actually not true. The only team in the league that would take Walman and a second was SJ. Everyone else declined. I don’t understand how this is a slam dunk on Yzerman that he had to take one on the chin to move a guy, when no one else in the league wanted the guy. Well played SJ, who just wanted to use their cap space to get extra picks and would take on the things no one else would….and found a good player. He’s incentivized obviously by the move, and good for him for being so. Just don’t suspended by your own team again and it’s a win for everyone.
Ps. He also needed room for the Trouba would be deal.
