Speculation: Sharks Roster Discussion Part 2

[Mattb124]

Donskoi is day-to-day with an injury but that's just coach speak for healthy scratch.

Fire DeBoer for injuring Donskoi.

This board is getting stupid.

 

[Sideshow Raheem]

I am happy Meier has been bumped out of that first line spot he never deserved to begin with. Hopefully he's sent down soon. He's been a massive disappointment. Goldobin deserves to be on the big club.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

If Schlemko is in, then I don't expect Mueller to be called back up tomorrow. I'd expect a forward to be called up, we'll see who plays well tonight for the Barracuda.

I would think that they keep Heed up. Especially with Martin still day-to-day.

 

[The Nemesis]

I am happy Meier has been bumped out of that first line spot he never deserved to begin with. Hopefully he's sent down soon. He's been a massive disappointment. Goldobin deserves to be on the big club.

"massive" disappointment. There's nothing that's not ridiculously hyperbolic with you, is there?

 

[hohosaregood]

Fire DeBoer for injuring Donskoi.

This board is getting stupid.

It's just one guy who doesn't know how to collect data.

 

[hohosaregood]

I think Timo's been good on the first line but I also think the middle 6 needs a shake up. Couture and Tierney lines haven't been that great lately.

 

[DonskoiDonscored]

I'm going to go ahead and guess that if Goldobin comes up and produces similar numbers it's going to be all DeBoer's fault.

 

[Sharksrule04]

I am happy Meier has been bumped out of that first line spot he never deserved to begin with. Hopefully he's sent down soon. He's been a massive disappointment. Goldobin deserves to be on the big club.

If only he could score as consistently as you post nonsense. We'd have the next Gretzky.

Side note, can't wait until Meier starts producing and shuts Sideshow up for the 2nd time this season (in case no one remembers Sideshow whined when Meier had 0 goals after 4 AHL games).

 

[Sideshow Raheem]

I'm going to go ahead and guess that if Goldobin comes up and produces similar numbers it's going to be all DeBoer's fault.

If he doesn't give Goldobin the same opportunities Meier has been given (and failed to produce anything with), then yes.

 

[Sideshow Raheem]

"massive" disappointment. There's nothing that's not ridiculously hyperbolic with you, is there?

Sorry, my bad. A 14-point full season pace for a top 10 draft pick playing with an array of talented linemates is actually fantastic. He's been killing it up here.

 

[Sharksrule04]

Sorry, my bad. A 14-point full season pace for a top 10 draft pick playing with an array of talented linemates is actually fantastic. He's been killing it up here.

You really just don't know anything about hockey, it's as simple as that.

Weren't you a huge fan of Mikko Rantanen? He had 0 goals in his first 17 NHL games and only 1 assist in that time. Since then he has 17 points in 28 NHL games. Give the guy some time. You sounded like an idiot when you said 0 goals in 4 games was a massive disappointment for Meier in the AHL and you were proven wrong (as always), and now you sound like an idiot with this Meier "massive disappointment" nonsense. Then when Meier starts producing you'll find a new thing to complain about. Do you ever learn or do you just enjoy saying ridiculous things to get a response out of people (aka TROLL).

 

[Sideshow Raheem]

You really just don't know anything about hockey, it's as simple as that.

Weren't you a huge fan of Mikko Rantanen? He had 0 goals in his first 17 NHL games and only 1 assist in that time. Since then he has 17 points in 28 NHL games. Give the guy some time. You sounded like an idiot when you said 0 goals in 4 games was a massive disappointment for Meier in the AHL and you were proven wrong (as always), and now you sound like an idiot with this Meier "massive disappointment" nonsense. Then when Meier starts producing you'll find a new thing to complain about. Do you ever learn or do you just enjoy saying ridiculous things to get a response out of people (aka TROLL).

I never really liked Rantanen, I always wanted Barzal. But even with the Rantanen example, the bulk of those games were played last year when he was a year younger (and when Meier was still in junior). The only fair comparison is between Rantanen and Meier's production this season and clearly Rantanen laps the field with him. So, I am not sure I am the one who "doesn't know anything about hockey."

 

[do0glas]

Lol barzal is killing it in the nhl right now

 

[Mattb124]

Even though I agree the Sharks don't neccesarily need to trade F help for D, if that deal presents itself, you take it and run. Having a top-10 defenseman on each pairing is too good to pass up.

However, OEL is a top-10 defenseman, is 25 years old, and carries only a 5.5 million cap hit for the next two seasons after this one. As much as I love Couture, OEL is way more valuable.

In a vacuum, that trade makes sense but I don't think that for a team in win-now mode that depleting your Center depth in order to get stronger at a position that were arguably top of the league at is the right way to play that.

 

[DonskoiDonscored]

Meier has been given good linemates but incredibly hard competition.

In fact, Meier has played the toughest minutes in the entire NHL among forwards and done extremely well in terms of possession. The points aren't there yet but I'd prefer to give him time to figure things out. It's better to have him figure it out in the next month or so than to try and get him to figure it out in the playoffs.

I'm sure you'd grant the same leniency with Goldobin.

 

[Sideshow Raheem]

Meier has been given good linemates but incredibly hard competition.

In fact, Meier has played the toughest minutes in the entire NHL among forwards and done extremely well in terms of possession. The points aren't there yet but I'd prefer to give him time to figure things out. It's better to have him figure it out in the next month or so than to try and get him to figure it out in the playoffs.

I'm sure you'd grant the same leniency with Goldobin.

If Goldobin can come in and produce, we won't need Meier in the playoffs. Meier has had his opportunities (and no **** - when you play with the Joes you get tougher matchups and opposing defensemen, big deal the tradeoff is more than worth it for him) and failed. If Goldobin can succeed in the same situations then Meier can wait until next season for his next shot.

I've said all along we need two of the kids to break through and establish themselves in order for this team to be a true contender (much like the Pens had Sheary and Rust). Labanc has done so. Meier hasn't. Let's see if Goldobin can.

 

[DonskoiDonscored]

You need to have patience.

Labanc took around 15 games to break through. Meier hasn't even played 15 games. Meier may take more time or he may light the lamp in the next game. You need to have patience with these guys. Giving rookies time to adjust to the NHL isn't going to cause us to drop out of the playoff picture. Heck, call up Goldobin and O'Regan right now and sit the older guys if they show they deserve a callup. There's no real need to worry.

Goldobin will get his chance, relax.

 

[The Nemesis]

If Goldobin can come in and produce, we won't need Meier in the playoffs. Meier has had his opportunities (and no **** - when you play with the Joes you get tougher matchups and opposing defensemen, big deal the tradeoff is more than worth it for him) and failed. If Goldobin can succeed in the same situations then Meier can wait until next season for his next shot.

I've said all along we need two of the kids to break through and establish themselves in order for this team to be a true contender (much like the Pens had Sheary and Rust). Labanc has done so. Meier hasn't. Let's see if Goldobin can.

Labanc has also showed extremely concerning defensive deficiencies at times. But apparently you can be pretty godawful defensively if you look good on offence. You just can't have good underlying possession numbers if they don't translate into immediate offensive production.

Meanwhile the Islanders, a generally bad offensive team, have returned Barzal to junior where he proceeded to be underwhelming in the WJCs in a focal role, and is kinda underwhelming in the WHL as well (he would be on pace for around 10 goals for the season if he could play a full WHL season's worth of games). But nope, let's just bag on Meier.

I'm beginning to believe that it's physically impossible for you not to frame your arguments in inflammatory, over the top hot takes. Even the reaction to being chided for your tendency toward hyperbole and histrionics is a just-as-inflammatory hot take.

 

[Sideshow Raheem]

You need to have patience.

Labanc took around 15 games to break through. Meier hasn't even played 15 games. Meier may take more time or he may light the lamp in the next game. You need to have patience with these guys. Giving rookies time to adjust to the NHL isn't going to cause us to drop out of the playoff picture. Heck, call up Goldobin and O'Regan right now and sit the older guys if they show they deserve a callup. There's no real need to worry.

Goldobin will get his chance, relax.

I've been patient for 12 games with Meier and he's shown very little. People point to the gaudy shot totals but anyone who's watched him game in and game out can see that he shoots from literally everywhere. Below the goal line, ridiculous angle from the half wall with no screen, the neutral zone...everywhere. There's nothing about his game that strikes me as adding a dimension the Sharks don't already have. He never formed chemistry with the Joes and as a result now finds himself back on the third line.

Labanc completely turned the corner in his eighth game. Meier still hasn't done that through twelve. Sure, Labanc is a year older but we're trying to ice the best possible team this season and it would make sense that players with an additional year of development/experience like Labanc and Goldobin would be part of that rather than Meier.

Labanc has also showed extremely concerning defensive deficiencies at times. But apparently you can be pretty godawful defensively if you look good on offence. You just can't have good underlying possession numbers if they don't translate into immediate offensive production.

Meanwhile the Islanders, a generally bad offensive team, have returned Barzal to junior where he proceeded to be underwhelming in the WJCs in a focal role, and is kinda underwhelming in the WHL as well (he would be on pace for around 10 goals for the season if he could play a full WHL season's worth of games). But nope, let's just bag on Meier.

I'm beginning to believe that it's physically impossible for you not to frame your arguments in inflammatory, over the top hot takes. Even the reaction to being chided for your tendency toward hyperbole and histrionics is a just-as-inflammatory hot take.

Just because Juxtaposer pulled up some completely decontextualized stats that speak more about Couture's total collapse as a player this season than anything Labanc is responsible for, doesn't mean Labanc has shown "extremely concerning defensive deficiencies." I defy you to point to one concrete issue in Labanc's defensive game.

Similarly, just because Meier juices his Corsi stats by shooting the puck from anywhere and everywhere on the ice doesn't mean he's some two-way demigod. Ultimately these are rookie wingers who have very little impact on defensive play.

And I'm beginning to believe it's impossible for you to disagree with something without immediately calling it a "hot take."

 

[Timo Time]

It's a hot take when you call for heads with small sample sizes. But you're not about small sample sizes, right?

 

[do0glas]

I've been patient for 12 games with Meier and he's shown very little. People point to the gaudy shot totals but anyone who's watched him game in and game out can see that he shoots from literally everywhere. Below the goal line, ridiculous angle from the half wall with no screen, the neutral zone...everywhere. There's nothing about his game that strikes me as adding a dimension the Sharks don't already have. He never formed chemistry with the Joes and as a result now finds himself back on the third line.

Labanc completely turned the corner in his eighth game. Meier still hasn't done that through twelve. Sure, Labanc is a year older but we're trying to ice the best possible team this season and it would make sense that players with an additional year of development/experience like Labanc and Goldobin would be part of that rather than Meier.



Just because Juxtaposer pulled up some completely decontextualized stats that speak more about Couture's total collapse as a player this season than anything Labanc is responsible for, doesn't mean Labanc has shown "extremely concerning defensive deficiencies." I defy you to point to one concrete issue in Labanc's defensive game.

Similarly, just because Meier juices his Corsi stats by shooting the puck from anywhere and everywhere on the ice doesn't mean he's some two-way demigod. Ultimately these are rookie wingers who have very little impact on defensive play.

And I'm beginning to believe it's impossible for you to disagree with something without immediately calling it a "hot take."

Meier on the Tierney line shot from everywhere. Meier withe the Joe's is getting into grade A scoring positions.

And it gets called a hot take because you say ridiculous things like couture having a total collapse as a player. Lol wut?

 

[Sideshow Raheem]

Meier on the Tierney line shot from everywhere. Meier withe the Joe's is getting into grade A scoring positions.

And it gets called a hot take because you say ridiculous things like couture having a total collapse as a player. Lol wut?

No, he's still shooting from everywhere even on the top line. I believe there was a sequence in the Calgary game where he recovered the puck from a scrum on the left side half wall (almost near the point) and just immediately spun around and threw it to the net. He had a similar play, albeit at least closer to the net, against Detroit too. That's just his game.

Couture has been dreadful defensively this season. Way worse than ever before. Sub-40% faceoff percentage and the worst relative Corsi% on the team outside of Labanc, Tierney, Haley and Wingels.

 

[Bizz]

Put me on the Meier disappointment bandwagon.

You'd think a player who was picked 9th overall playing on the top line would have *at least* 50 goals in his first 12 games by now. Goldobin is clearly our answer to Connor McDavid and Pete Deboer should be fired for not calling him up already.

also Brent Burns sucks.

 

[KirbyDots]

Rumors that the Sharks might be interested in Hanzal.

http://www.fanragsports.com/news/friedman-chayka-has-held-steadfast-in-coyotes-price-for-hanzal/

http://www.thescore.com/news/1207412

The Yotes apparently want a young center who can plan in the nhl right now. Would DW consider it as an upgrade on Tierney? Hanzal's caphit is 3.1m, they'd have to retain or we'd have to make room, maybe Wingles. Not necessarily advocating this, just reporting and trying to make sense of the rumor.

 

[WTFetus]

Hanzal would be a great upgrade.

I wouldn't say Meier has been a disappointment (at least for those not on the super hype train), but he hasn't been great and doesn't deserve to be on that top line. Give him time though. Couture was absolutely dominant in the AHL but wasn't a difference maker until the following season too.

I could totally see DW sending down Meier after 25 games (and then up again during the playoffs) just so he could compete for the Calder next year like Couture.