Player Discussion Shane Pinto (C) - PART 2

[Viletho]

With nothing to do on a rainy Saturday, I was reading thru the Pinto draft thread. Some pretty embarrassing takes in there.

I myself said something like : I can understand moving up to draft Soogard but didn't understand the Pinto pick.

I'm happy to say I was wrong and since then i stopped pretending i knew anything about undrafted prospect I actually never saw playing.

 

[JD1]

I myself said something like : I can understand moving up to draft Soogard but didn't understand the Pinto pick.

I'm happy to say I was wrong and since then i stopped pretending i knew anything about undrafted prospect I actually never saw playing.

Probably a wise move

 

[SlapJack]

In the Pinto thread on the main board people were scoffing when I claimed Pinto will prove he should have been a top 10 pick in his draft year. He's that good.

While it is possible, there's some very good players from that draft to get in there. I think he can be, but there's no shame in being 11th from that group

 

[aragorn]

The only potential better player in that role is White and there's no guarantee on that

What better players do we have for that role?

Nick Paul. While you might not think he is a centre at the NHL level they haven't tried him there either. DJ has already said that Paul can play all three forward positions & he was a pretty good two way defensive centre for Sudbury during his time in junior & that's basically the same role in the NHL for a 3rd line centre. It's also not like the other two are better offensively either. Greig IMO could be better offensively whenever he is NHL ready, but at the moment Paul is the best choice for the 3rd line centre spot IMO.

However, having said that, they still have White & Tierny on this team & need to do something with them & I certainly understand that they would like to get some kind of decent return for Tierny by the TDL. White is a different story since his contract has a much longer term & unless he improves they will need to get creative to move that contract. Therefore it is understandable that they will be in the lineup & we have to suffer through it until they find a trading partner which could take a few months.

 

[OD99]

The only potential better player in that role is White and there's no guarantee on that

What better players do we have for that role?

Tierney is getting a bad rap because DJ said he should be in an offensive role but we now have 2 legit offensive C options better than him.

He is still a fine 3C and has the IQ and vision to make nice, simple plays. If he gets a few more opportunities with top 6 wingers he will produce which is all we can ask.

 

[Xspyrit]

In the Pinto thread on the main board people were scoffing when I claimed Pinto will prove he should have been a top 10 pick in his draft year. He's that good.

That would be one hell of a call considering the wealth of the 2019 first round

Seider, Zegras, Dach, Hughes, Cozens, Kakko, Newhook, Boldy, Krebs, Knight, Caufield, Byram, Turcotte, Tomasino, Harley, McMichael, THOMPSON, etc, and that's just looking at the 1st round (in the 2+ rounds there will be Hoglander, Sogaard, Norlinder, Jones, Robertson, etc)

Seriously, it won't be easy for Pinto to crack that draft top-10 but if there's a guy who always rise on top of how good I thought he'd be, it's him.

You can add Formenton to that list when he is about 20 lbs heavier with muscle & who knows how Sokolov will play, he looks pretty good too when he is in there.

You mean Formenton and Sokolov as potential "best Sens player"? I really believe in them but the 7 guys I have named are prety high-end/elite talent. I can't see Forms and Sokolov being "that good", but I can totally see them being in that 2nd tier of excellence with Connor Brown and Artem Zub for example.

Damn, we've never been richer (in terms of young assets). It would be easy for most NHL teams to become a serious contender for a decade with such a pool of talent.

Add Formenton and Zub

A bit like I said to Aragorn above. I see these 2 more in that 2nd tier. The Magnificent Seven™ will be hard to displace

I can't wait until the trade deadline when Ottawa is able to shed some of this dead weight & make room for more of these younger players who are hungry. Just fine isn't good enough any more, unfortunately it will take a number of months before this happens.

lol you have been saying that sentence every year for at least a decade! A NHL team should absolutely be looking to do that every year, and even more during rebuild/retool years. Even if you're a playoffs team, there shouldn't be a problem to trade an UFA-to-be like Chris Tierney for example, and open a spot for one of your most ready prospects. Always look to acquire picks which could allow your drafting department to feed an already good talent pipeline. That way, you can be good for a long time.

 

[JD1]

Nick Paul. While you might not think he is a centre at the NHL level they haven't tried him there either. DJ has already said that Paul can play all three forward positions & he was a pretty good two way defensive centre for Sudbury during his time in junior & that's basically the same role in the NHL for a 3rd line centre. It's also not like the other two are better offensively either. Greig IMO could be better offensively whenever he is NHL ready, but at the moment Paul is the best choice for the 3rd line centre spot IMO.

However, having said that, they still have White & Tierny on this team & need to do something with them & I certainly understand that they would like to get some kind of decent return for Tierny by the TDL. White is a different story since his contract has a much longer term & unless he improves they will need to get creative to move that contract. Therefore it is understandable that they will be in the lineup & we have to suffer through it until they find a trading partner which could take a few months.

Through 6 pro seasons and multiple coaches at the NHL and the AHL, do you think there might be a reason that he's not played centre?

Look man, I like the player, I just don't see the play making ability to play centre. Not at all. Not only that, he's good at what he does and we'd have to suffer the drop off in play at what Nick is good at

 

[Tuna99]

Pinto is already in the “I want him to marry my sister (or brother)” category with legends such as Hossa, Alfie, Redden, Fisher (who’d I’d marry) and Big Rig.

 

[aragorn]

Through 6 pro seasons and multiple coaches at the NHL and the AHL, do you think there might be a reason that he's not played centre?

Look man, I like the player, I just don't see the play making ability to play centre. Not at all. Not only that, he's good at what he does and we'd have to suffer the drop off in play at what Nick is good at

Play making ability is more important for the top two line centres IMO, most 3rd line centres tend to be good defensive centres which Paul is. But as I said in another thread, I doubt it will happen for Paul either because they will need to trade Tierny & that becomes easier if he is playing & succeeding & it will take time. I agree that Paul is more of a complimentary player, but he has obvious skill, neither Tierny nor White are better at faceoffs or defensively or on the PK.

Even after the TDL & Tierny is moved out they will still have White on the team & they need to do the same for him to get something decent back if they can find a trading partner to take his salary next yr which won't be easy. And then Greig is likely going to be challenging by the end of next season so as it turns out he may never get a chance, but I don't think it's because he can't do it. I think it's because there has always been guys ahead of him that they needed to play on one way contracts. Kastelic IMO could be the 4th line centre once Watson's contract is done next yr.

 

[Sensmileletsgo]

Pinto is already in the “I want him to marry my sister (or brother)” category with legends such as Hossa, Alfie, Redden, Fisher (who’d I’d marry) and Big Rig.

I’d be ok if it was just a one night stand.

 

[coladin]

I know it's just pre season but combined with what we saw last year it's hard not to get excited about this player. He does it all.... Defensive awareness and hockey sense just off the charts.

And look who his linemates were last night. This is the thing that drives me nuts. He had Paul and Watson. He still showed something, every time on the ice., whereas the Logan Brown apologists would complain about linemates. The guy clearly, will play with anyone because he plays his best.

The guy is a revelation, incredible scouting job.

 

[Joeyjoejoe]

Is he the dude that started playing hockey at like 12?

 

[Sweatred]

Is he the dude that started playing hockey at like 12?

I think when people make those types of references they mean the player didn’t start playing and training in elite circles until the age of 12…

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Is he the dude that started playing hockey at like 12?

Not sure but he only started playing high level at 15 or 16

 

[JD1]

Play making ability is more important for the top two line centres IMO, most 3rd line centres tend to be good defensive centres which Paul is.

How would you know this? He's never played centre at the pro level

 

[SENStastic]

Is he the dude that started playing hockey at like 12?

I think he didn't start playing hockey seriously until he was 15 I believe. What a slacker.

 

[aragorn]

Of course, I don't know it to be fact, just like you don't know that he can't do it. It's my opinion based on the history of the player & my viewings of him over the yrs since he played junior. Btw, this has been a good discussion & I appreciate your view point & that you have been open with your comments. In the end it's likely we won't change each other's view & that's okay as long as we are open to other perspectives & view points. Have a great weekend, although it looks like it's gonna rain here all weekend & I have kids to feed.

 

[PlayersLtd]

I think he didn't start playing hockey seriously until he was 15 I believe. What a slacker.

Correct. Shane Pinto was on a path to be a high level baseball player but at 15 opted to take hockey more seriously and that's essentially when his competitive hockey development began, I believe. Between then and 18 his curve was incredibly steep and this was a huge marker for his future potential which we are now seeing come to fruition.

 

[GCK]

I think when people make those types of references they mean the player didn’t start playing and training in elite circles until the age of 12…

It was at age 15 where he began taking it seriously.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Given Pinto's really good performance in preseason and the constant messaging about being careful and not wanting to have to demote him etc..
How would you feel if they sent Pinto to Belleville to start the year?

 

[Micklebot]

Given Pinto's really good performance in preseason and the constant messaging about being careful and not wanting to have to demote him etc..
How would you feel if they sent Pinto to Belleville to start the year?

If it means getting to see more Tierney, sign me up...

 

[bert]

While it is possible, there's some very good players from that draft to get in there. I think he can be, but there's no shame in being 11th from that group

Its a pretty weak draft from the high end potential part. I think he will be in the conversation as a top 10 pick when its all said and done. Insane hockey IQ on him. I dont know how much he is going to score but he is going to be one of the best defensive forwards in the league.

Given Pinto's really good performance in preseason and the constant messaging about being careful and not wanting to have to demote him etc..
How would you feel if they sent Pinto to Belleville to start the year?

Its just not going to happen barring an injury.

 

[H2O]

Given Pinto's really good performance in preseason and the constant messaging about being careful and not wanting to have to demote him etc..
How would you feel if they sent Pinto to Belleville to start the year?

Funny thing is Pinto’s really good performance started as soon as he joined the team last year and hasn’t wavered yet. The team have barely lost games in his short tenure so far. Sending him to Belleville could actually cost Ottawa in losses as crazy as that sound.

 

[Sweatred]

Is Pinot really good or are White and Tierney just really bad ?

 

[H2O]

Is Pinot really good or are White and Tierney just really bad ?

Doesn’t have to be mutually exclusive. My eyes tells me Pinto is really good, White is really average, and Tierney is really soft.