Confirmed with Link: Shanahan, Dubas, Keefe all staying

[Mess]

far from all Leaf fans were aware of this fact and while the Dubas supporters might not find it interesting i'm sure Leafs fans would appreciate putting our post season failures in the proper context

as for your ''fun fact'' , why Leaf fans care how much cap the Bolts spent on their ''primary'' bottom 6 and who the hell knows what you mean by ''primary'' , lol

Fun fact .. in regards to Tampa Bay..

Its precisely those middle tier players like Palat ($5.3 mil), Cirelli ( $4.8 mil) & Killorn ($4.5 mil) that are keys to their success and what people are talking about "deep team" and being able to build a Cup competitive team in a cap world around your stars, that is prevented from happening in Toronto because their core 4 use up 1/2 the cap where TB get Vasilevskiy, Hedman, Stamkos, Kucherov and Point for that same cap usage.

Players like Kadri, Hyman, Kapanen etc etc are all unaffordable middle depth even to the point of player like Mikheyev at $3.5 mil likely too much to retain for Leafs with so little cap room to find a goalie and pay their own RFA players.

Who would have the higher odds of success having Tavares at $11 mil or being able to dress Palat, Cirelli and Nick Paul for the same cap cost and dress an entire line?

Some Leaf fans claim Leafs have a deep team because of a lot of bargain basement old Leafs want to come home in their twilight at end of careers and playing for $1 mil or less.

Quality depth is not quantity depth !!!

Who do Leaf fans always blame for their playoff losses those very same cheap 3rd/4th line depth players and their goalie those exact bargain shopped players due to there poor cap management of their core cost?

If only they could connect the dots that their greenhorn GM spent them into Cap Hell and their greenhorn coach can't coach them out of it, when he doesn't have the experience nor the player personnel.

Leafs aren't getting "Out-goalied" they're getting "out-coached" and "out-managed" because their opponents front offices and management personnel know what their doing, and not learning on the job.

Which is the reason Leaf not so fun fact is they're the only non-expansion team to not win a playoff round in 18 years in Salary Cap World. Spending harder not smarter !!!

 

[RoyalCitySlicker]

No, some players don’t want to do what it takes to win. Some don’t know how.
I have no idea about their desire to win.
Im sure you’ve heard Gretzky comment about sacrifice after their first trip to the Cup final.

You sure had some idea about their desire to win when you said they had none and intimated they were unwilling to do what it takes to win.

Winning does not mean you automatically have the desire...there's 20 players on the team...they don't all operate the same.

Just like losing doesn't mean you don't have the desire.

Kessel for example - when here, many fans thought he didn't play hard enough or the right way (little defensive responsibility) however he goes to PIT and wins and then he suddenly has the desire? And now that he's in Phoenix, back to no desire?

Seems like there might be a little bit more to winning and losing that just wanting it bad enough.

 

[Dekes For Days]

No other teams have done it because we have never encountered a flat cap

Yeah, this is really what it comes down to. Had a global pandemic not unexpectedly stagnated the cap, even conservative projections of the cap for next year would have had us sitting at 91m+, and suddenly their percentage wouldn't be all that abnormal.

Not to mention that while many teams have their high-end player signings relatively staggered, all of ours uniquely just so happened to occur within a year period right before said pandemic. Also not to mention the added 4 forward caveat - I'm not sure too many teams hit on 3 consecutive star+ forwards and then also have one of the only high-end players to ever hit UFA that happened to be a forward be open to signing with them for a reasonable amount, but I'm sure plenty of teams would be happy with that.

It's such a unique situation that of course it's not going to be represented in a sample of 16 that was largely operating in a different environment. In fact, the only winner within this environment so far is a team with a similar method of cap allocation.

The question should be, have teams won with 49.1% of their cap providing less collective value and impact than what our 4 provide. The answer is unquestionably yes. You could find some quirky little unique fact about any single winner in the cap era. It didn't mean they weren't going to win.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Salary allocation is all wrong with this club. No way around it.

 

[notbias]

Fun fact .. in regards to Tampa Bay..

Its precisely those middle tier players like Palat ($5.3 mil), Cirelli ( $4.8 mil) & Killorn ($4.5 mil) that are keys to their success and what people are talking about "deep team" and being able to build a Cup competitive team in a cap world around your stars, that is prevented from happening in Toronto because their core 4 use up 1/2 the cap where TB get Vasilevskiy, Hedman, Stamkos, Kucherov and Point for that same cap usage.

Players like Kadri, Hyman, Kapanen etc etc are all unaffordable middle depth even to the point of player like Mikheyev at $3.5 mil likely too much to retain for Leafs with so little cap room to find a goalie and pay their own RFA players.

Who would have the higher odds of success having Tavares at $11 mil or being able to dress Palat, Cirelli and Nick Paul for the same cap cost and dress an entire line?

Some Leaf fans claim Leafs have a deep team because of a lot of bargain basement old Leafs want to come home in their twilight at end of careers and playing for $1 mil or less.

Quality depth is not quantity depth !!!

Who do Leaf fans always blame for their playoff losses those very same cheap 3rd/4th line depth players and their goalie those exact bargain shopped players due their poor cap management of their core cost?

If only they could connect the dots that their greenhorn GM spent them into Cap Hell and their greenhorn coach can't coach them out of it, when he doesn't have the experience nor the player personnel.

Leafs aren't getting "Out-goalied" they're getting "out-coached" and "out-managed" because their opponents front offices and management personnel know what their doing, and not learning on the job.

Which is the reason Leaf not so fun fact is they're the only non-expansion team to not win a playoff round in 18 years in Salary Cap World. Spending harder not smarter !!!

You post a lot and really don't say much, it is amazing.

 

[Dekes For Days]

far from all Leaf fans were aware of this fact and while the Dubas supporters might not find it interesting i'm sure Leafs fans would appreciate putting our post season failures in the proper context

You don't think Leaf fans would know our playoff series outcomes? You don't think Leaf fans would have read one of the 1,000 other times the same thing has been said in here over the past month? It may be interesting, but it wasn't relevant to my post, and losing is certainly not "fun" for a Leaf fan. I'm also not sure it "puts our post season failures in the proper context" either when we weren't even in the post season for most of those years.

as for your ''fun fact'' , why would Leaf fans care how much cap the Bolts spent on their ''primary'' bottom 6

The discussion centered around the idea that we had failed building because our cap allocation didn't allow us to allocate enough cap to depth and were doomed to failure as a result. My "fun fact" compared how much back-to-back Cup winner and current Stanley Cup finalist Tampa had spent on their bottom-six this year, and questioned if the same applied to them.

and who the hell knows what you mean by ''primary'' , lol

It means the bottom-six players with the most GP for the team.

 

[Trapper]

You post a lot and really don't say much, it is amazing.

Sometimes less is more if you read what he’s saying.

Which is really the moral of the story here.
You wait for 3/4 guys to save you while other teams have 10-12.

 

[ACC1224]

You post a lot and really don't say much, it is amazing.

What words are you struggling with? Perhaps @Mess can help you out.

 

[Apex Predator]

Fun fact .. in regards to Tampa Bay..

Its precisely those middle tier players like Palat ($5.3 mil), Cirelli ( $4.8 mil) & Killorn ($4.5 mil) that are keys to their success and what people are talking about "deep team" and being able to build a Cup competitive team in a cap world around your stars, that is prevented from happening in Toronto because their core 4 use up 1/2 the cap where TB get Vasilevskiy, Hedman, Stamkos, Kucherov and Point for that same cap usage.

Players like Kadri, Hyman, Kapanen etc etc are all unaffordable middle depth even to the point of player like Mikheyev at $3.5 mil likely too much to retain for Leafs with so little cap room to find a goalie and pay their own RFA players.

Who would have the higher odds of success having Tavares at $11 mil or being able to dress Palat, Cirelli and Nick Paul for the same cap cost and dress an entire line?

Some Leaf fans claim Leafs have a deep team because of a lot of bargain basement old Leafs want to come home in their twilight at end of careers and playing for $1 mil or less.

Quality depth is not quantity depth !!!

Who do Leaf fans always blame for their playoff losses those very same cheap 3rd/4th line depth players and their goalie those exact bargain shopped players due their poor cap management of their core cost?

If only they could connect the dots that their greenhorn GM spent them into Cap Hell and their greenhorn coach can't coach them out of it, when he doesn't have the experience nor the player personnel.

Leafs aren't getting "Out-goalied" they're getting "out-coached" and "out-managed" because their opponents front offices and management personnel know what their doing, and not learning on the job.

Which is the reason Leaf not so fun fact is they're the only non-expansion team to not win a playoff round in 18 years in Salary Cap World. Spending harder not smarter !!!

The old saying you get for what you pay for.

 

[rocketman588]

No other teams have done it because we have never encountered a flat cap and the amount of money paid to players until recently. If you think for a second that the leafs will find themselves to be the only team that uses this model you are delusional. Calgary is about to be the next team that does and it’s not going to stop with them as salary’s increase. There are just a lot more forwards than defenseman and goalies

Every team in the league is dealing with the flat cap

How many have put 50% on 4 forwards? We have 3 of the top highest earners in the league it doesn't have to do with the flat cap it's us mismanaging the cap before it became flat

 

[Nineteen67]

You sure had some idea about their desire to win when you said they had none and intimated they were unwilling to do what it takes to win.

Winning does not mean you automatically have the desire...there's 20 players on the team...they don't all operate the same.

Just like losing doesn't mean you don't have the desire.

Kessel for example - when here, many fans thought he didn't play hard enough or the right way (little defensive responsibility) however he goes to PIT and wins and then he suddenly has the desire? And now that he's in Phoenix, back to no desire?

Seems like there might be a little bit more to winning and losing that just wanting it bad enough.

Wanting something and understanding and doing what it takes to get it are two different things.

Kessel demonstrated his abilities in the playoffs with the Leafs and Pens. I was not the least bit surprised he won on a team like Pittsburgh.

I have no idea if every Leafs player, for e.g. Nylander, wants to win a Cup or if they’re content just playing the regular season. I think we’ve observed they don’t demonstrate the willingness to do what it takes to win, for whatever reason.

 

[egd27]

Yeah, this is really what it comes down to. Had a global pandemic not unexpectedly stagnated the cap, even conservative projections of the cap for next year would have had us sitting at 91m+, and suddenly their percentage wouldn't be all that abnormal.

The Leafs had around 50% of cap to 34/91/16/88 at the start of the 2019 season, and it looks likes he'll have the same thing at start of the 2022 season.

Yes, the global pandemic certainly affected the salary allocation "plan". But we've been told for some time now that the league is looking at a flat cap for at least a few seasons, (rumor I heard is 2025)

Given that, the question I have is why the GM hasn't adjusted the "plan" to address this allocation problem given has had around 26 months since the onset of the pandemic?

 

[Nineteen67]

You post a lot and really don't say much, it is amazing.

He said someone should have given Cirelli an offer sheet and messed up TBL‘s cap structure.

 

[Shooter2x]

The Leafs had around 50% of cap to 34/91/16/88 at the start of the 2019 season, and it looks likes he'll have the same thing at start of the 2022 season.

Yes, the global pandemic certainly affected the salary allocation "plan". But we've been told for some time now that the league is looking at a flat cap for at least a few seasons, (rumor I heard is 2025)

Given that, the question I have is why the GM hasn't adjusted the "plan" to address this allocation problem given has had around 26 months since the onset of the pandemic?

Flat cap is pro Leaf. Regular season being so boring is proof.

Think about it. All teams got hit by flat cap. But Leafs kept adding to their roster via the development of matthews marner and Nylander. At the same league wide cap limit these 3 have kept getting better the past 2 1/2 years.

We'd have a cup in one of the last 2 years if we had someone else building the depth , taking full advantage of the situation.

Look at the Blues. They will never win a cup again with that lineup unless Tarasenko has one more superstar year left in him. We have the superstars but management half asses the rest. Playoff flops all over getting out willed by the nick Paul's of the league.

There's no excuses. Flat cap, cap being 90 mil....better job should have been done under both circumstances. All this cap stuff is noise to me. There's enough left over to win a cup.

*short version: There has been no rise in cap for the league to offset the improvements of our core players. The resources also don't exist in-house for 90% of the teams since these are 2 superstars and 1 Allstar we are talking about.

 

[RoyalCitySlicker]

Wanting something and understanding and doing what it takes to get it are two different things.

Kessel demonstrated his abilities in the playoffs with the Leafs and Pens. I was not the least bit surprised he won on a team like Pittsburgh.

I have no idea if every Leafs player, for e.g. Nylander, wants to win a Cup or if they’re content just playing the regular season. I think we’ve observed they don’t demonstrate the willingness to do what it takes to win, for whatever reason.

At least we can agree here. All I am saying is that just because they haven't won, doesn't mean they don't want it bad enough. It's a very subjective measurement done by fans who actually have no idea what they are talking about. The don't know the players - they just see a loss and apparently there is no other explanation other than they didn't want it bad enough.

Had the Leafs beaten Tampa - WHICH THEY DID NOT!!! - and they were within a goal of doing so, this entire narrative becomes garbage....over one goal. It's crazy. And yes, I understand "if a bull had tits" but still.....it's why the conversation around the team is so crazy. Yeah, they haven't made it out of the first round and that's a big disappointment, but the way some people talk about them, you'd think they got swept or didn't make the playoffs.

Anyway, I'm not going to change your mind, or anyone else's here and that's cool. Enjoy your weekend. Cheers

 

[capfit9]

Flat cap is pro Leaf. Regular season being so boring is proof.

Think about it. All teams got hit by flat cap. But Leafs kept adding to their roster via the development of matthews marner and Nylander. At the same league wide cap limit these 3 have kept getting better the past 2 1/2 years.

We'd have a cup in one of the last 2 years if we had someone else building the depth , taking full advantage of the situation.

Look at the Blues. They will never win a cup again with that lineup unless Tarasenko has one more superstar year left in him. We have the superstars but management half asses the rest. Playoff flops all over getting out willed by the nick Paul's of the league.

There's no excuses. Flat cap, cap being 90 mil....better job should have been done under both circumstances. All this cap stuff is noise to me. There's enough left over to win a cup.

 

[DraftSchmaft]

Flat cap is pro Leaf. Regular season being so boring is proof.

Think about it. All teams got hit by flat cap. But Leafs kept adding to their roster via the development of matthews marner and Nylander. At the same league wide cap limit these 3 have kept getting better the past 2 1/2 years.

We'd have a cup in one of the last 2 years if we had someone else building the depth , taking full advantage of the situation.

Look at the Blues. They will never win a cup again with that lineup unless Tarasenko has one more superstar year left in him. We have the superstars but management half asses the rest. Playoff flops all over getting out willed by the nick Paul's of the league.

There's no excuses. Flat cap, cap being 90 mil....better job should have been done under both circumstances. All this cap stuff is noise to me. There's enough left over to win a cup.

*short version: There has been no rise in cap for the league to offset the improvements of our core players. The resources also don't exist in-house for 90% of the teams since these are 2 superstars and 1 Allstar we are talking about.

This post is ahead of its time. It's 100% correct but will get shoved under the rug by both sides due to agendas

 

[Nineteen67]

At least we can agree here. All I am saying is that just because they haven't won, doesn't mean they don't want it bad enough. It's a very subjective measurement done by fans who actually have no idea what they are talking about. The don't know the players - they just see a loss and apparently there is no other explanation other than they didn't want it bad enough.

Had the Leafs beaten Tampa - WHICH THEY DID NOT!!! - and they were within a goal of doing so, this entire narrative becomes garbage....over one goal. It's crazy. And yes, I understand "if a bull had tits" but still.....it's why the conversation around the team is so crazy. Yeah, they haven't made it out of the first round and that's a big disappointment, but the way some people talk about them, you'd think they got swept or didn't make the playoffs.

Anyway, I'm not going to change your mind, or anyone else's here and that's cool. Enjoy your weekend. Cheers

I observed and pointed to the lack the effort by some in the first period of game one, and several other times throughout the series. Particularly, when I saw a similar lack of effort in the dying minutes of the third period of game seven, down a goal, I can assume that they either don’t know what it takes or they’re unwilling to do what it takes. Everyone that saw what I saw has a similar opinion.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Fun fact .. in regards to Tampa Bay..

Its precisely those middle tier players like Palat ($5.3 mil), Cirelli ( $4.8 mil) & Killorn ($4.5 mil) that are keys to their success and what people are talking about "deep team" and being able to build a Cup competitive team in a cap world around your stars, that is prevented from happening in Toronto because their core 4 use up 1/2 the cap where TB get Vasilevskiy, Hedman, Stamkos, Kucherov and Point for that same cap usage.

Players like Kadri, Hyman, Kapanen etc etc are all unaffordable middle depth even to the point of player like Mikheyev at $3.5 mil likely too much to retain for Leafs with so little cap room to find a goalie and pay their own RFA players.

Who would have the higher odds of success having Tavares at $11 mil or being able to dress Palat, Cirelli and Nick Paul for the same cap cost and dress an entire line?

Some Leaf fans claim Leafs have a deep team because of a lot of bargain basement old Leafs want to come home in their twilight at end of careers and playing for $1 mil or less.

Quality depth is not quantity depth !!!

Who do Leaf fans always blame for their playoff losses those very same cheap 3rd/4th line depth players and their goalie those exact bargain shopped players due their poor cap management of their core cost?

If only they could connect the dots that their greenhorn GM spent them into Cap Hell and their greenhorn coach can't coach them out of it, when he doesn't have the experience nor the player personnel.

Leafs aren't getting "Out-goalied" they're getting "out-coached" and "out-managed" because their opponents front offices and management personnel know what their doing, and not learning on the job.

Which is the reason Leaf not so fun fact is they're the only non-expansion team to not win a playoff round in 18 years in Salary Cap World. Spending harder not smarter !!!

This is ALL 100% true .. da truth always hurts .. da other aspect of this recruitment problem is we have it ALL invested in forwards .. Tampa has done it CORRECT with 1G, 1D, 2C and 1 winger .. now it so happens they have BEST G, D and winger in league too .. bottom line it is not getting corrected in next 2 years with Tampa in our division .. so Larry is selling HOPE and who knows Vasi and Kuch get hurt before playoffs and anything is possible i guess .. that said Florida is still a great team too .. with everyone back for next 3 years I can't see anything changing except more of da same

 

[LeafEgo]

Kessel for example - when here, many fans thought he didn't play hard enough or the right way (little defensive responsibility) however he goes to PIT and wins and then he suddenly has the desire? And now that he's in Phoenix, back to no desire?

Could be, same with Karlsson who was a monster when Sens were competitive. Coaching has an impact as well.

Kessel always seemed like a guy who just goes with the flow.

 

[Racer88]

Yeah, this is really what it comes down to. Had a global pandemic not unexpectedly stagnated the cap, even conservative projections of the cap for next year would have had us sitting at 91m+, and suddenly their percentage wouldn't be all that abnormal.

Not to mention that while many teams have their high-end player signings relatively staggered, all of ours uniquely just so happened to occur within a year period right before said pandemic. Also not to mention the added 4 forward caveat - I'm not sure too many teams hit on 3 consecutive star+ forwards and then also have one of the only high-end players to ever hit UFA that happened to be a forward be open to signing with them for a reasonable amount, but I'm sure plenty of teams would be happy with that.

It's such a unique situation that of course it's not going to be represented in a sample of 16 that was largely operating in a different environment. In fact, the only winner within this environment so far is a team with a similar method of cap allocation.

The question should be, have teams won with 49.1% of their cap providing less collective value and impact than what our 4 provide. The answer is unquestionably yes. You could find some quirky little unique fact about any single winner in the cap era. It didn't mean they weren't going to win.

Interesting that it only happened to dubas. We would be in much better position if he hadn’t jumped the gun and got Tavares……who has added nothing to ouch the team over the edge

 

[Dekes For Days]

Yes, the global pandemic certainly affected the salary allocation "plan". But we've been told for some time now that the league is looking at a flat cap for at least a few seasons, (rumor I heard is 2025)
Given that, the question I have is why the GM hasn't adjusted the "plan" to address this allocation problem given has had around 26 months since the onset of the pandemic?

1. Because trading Matthews, Marner, or Nylander is extremely unlikely to make us better, and pretty likely to make us worse, and whatever your personal feelings on Tavares are, it doesn't really matter because there's zero chance he leaves Toronto.
2. Because it's not a real problem. It's an obstacle, but we've managed to build an excellent team despite the additional obstacle.

 

[francis246]

Interesting that it only happened to dubas. We would be in much better position if he hadn’t jumped the gun and got Tavares……who has added nothing to ouch the team over the edge

It affected Tampa what are you talking about? Tampa lost an entire line due to the flat cap. They draft and trade so well that you forget.

They also used a loophole but their cap structure is pretty similar to ours. They got lucky they could circumvent the cap the one year using LTIR

 

[andora]

Again Trevor Moore was good but he was never going to be the Los Angeles Trevor Moore in Toronto. That has a lot to do with opportunity and playing time and the fact of the matter was Trevor Moore is a good young player but he was run of the mill and we already had a few guys in the system who play like Moore. Steeves or Robertson have the potential to be just as good as Moore if not better. Moore is replaceable.

Why not? I will always believe that signing Tavares for that 11 million halted any chance at being able to sustain a strong depth as well as developing that depth at the pro level. Yes it comes down to ice time but you can't tell me Moore did not display strengths at the time that wouldn't have earned him ice time moving forward. While Moore's departure isn't a specific result of the Tavares contract it is an example of quality depth consistently leaving and i was curious what it would look like with not having signed Tavares.

I did this very quickly so i could be missing some names - but i basically left out anyone who was/is important. in 18/19 without Tavares the cap number is fine, and which i always thought was a rebuilding year. a few guys you will see have contract numbers they got from other teams (bozak stlouis / connor brown ottawa) - and the right column is if they are added in the number.

19/20 it got tight but in red i highlighted gardiner/johnsson/kapanen new contracts and that gets us under - johnsson/kapanen at that time could have been good trade bait to keep replenishing.

the defence needed work yes - with the above three noted the cap looks to have left plenty of room to address needs. Zaitsev still would have been a potential problem contract to move and goaltending would need to be addressed (no different from now) - but still look at these numbers without tavares looming.

NAME	18/19	19/20	20/21	21/22	22/23	inc?
Auston Matthews	925,000	11,634,000	11,640,250	11,640,250	11,640,250	y
Nazem Kadri	4,500,000	4,500,000	4,500,000	4,500,000		y
Tyler Bozak	5,000,000	5,000,000	5,000,000	950,000		y
C	10,425,000	21,134,000	21,140,250	17,090,250	11,640,250
Patrick Marleau	6,250,000	6,250,000				y
Zach Hyman	2,250,000	2,250,000	2,250,000	5,500,000	5,500,000	y
Trevor Moore	925,000	775,000	775,000	1,875,000	1,875,000	y
James Van Riemsdyk
Matt Martin	2,500,000	2,500,000	1,500,000	1,500,000	1,500,000	y
Andreas Johnsson	787,500	3,400,000	3,400,000	3,400,000	3,400,000	y
Pierre Engvall	925,000	925,000	1,250,000	1,250,000
Mason Marchment	767,500	767,500	700,000	800,000
LW	12,712,500	15,175,000	7,925,000	12,275,000	12,275,000
William Nylander	10,277,778	6,962,366	6,962,366	6,962,366	6,962,366	y
Connor Brown	2,100,000	2,100,000	3,600,000	3,600,000	3,600,000	y
Mitch Marner	894,167	10,893,000	10,903,000	10,903,000	10,903,000	y
Carl Grundstrom	925,000	925,000	725,000	725,000
Leo Komarov	3,000,000	3,000,000	3,000,000	3,000,000		y
Kasperi Kapanen	863,333	3,200,000	3,200,000	3,200,000		y
Alexander Barabanov			925,000	1,000,000
RW	17,135,278	26,155,366	27,665,366	27,665,366	21,465,366
	40,272,778	62,464,366	56,730,616	57,030,616	45,380,616
Morgan Reilly	5,000,000	5,000,000	5,000,000	5,000,000	7,500,000	y
Nikita Zaitsev	4,500,000	4,500,000	4,500,000	4,500,000	4,500,000	y
Jake Gardiner	4,050,000	4,050,000	4,050,000	4,050,000	4,050,000	y
Ron Hainsey	3,000,000	3,500,000				y
Roman Polak	1,300,000	1,750,000				y
Travis Dermott	863,333	863,333	874,125	1,500,000	1,500,000	y
Justin Holl	675,000	675,000	2,000,000	2,000,000	2,000,000	y
Timothy Liljegren	894,167	863,333	863,333	863,333
Rasmus Sandin	925,000	894,167	894,167	894,167
Sean Durzi		809,166	809,166	809,166
D	19,388,333	20,338,333	16,424,125	17,050,000	19,550,000
Frederik Andersen	5,000,000	5,000,000	5,000,000			y
						y
G	5,000,000	5,000,000	5,000,000	0	0
RETAINED SALARIES	1,200,000	1,200,000	1,200,000	1,200,000
	65,861,111	89,002,699	79,354,741	75,280,616	64,930,616

 

[Captain Crunch]

I don't think it had to do with "keeping his star players happy". I think it has to do with putting your core players in the situations to be difference makers, which is what you want 99% of the time. That's why they're your core players.

I don't think Giordano is really a better option than Rielly on the PP. I just think that PPs can benefit from a mix-up once in a while to get different looks and combinations, especially if you're struggling against an elite PK. But while I personally would have preferred that, that's easy to say with the benefit of hindsight knowing that what we did didn't work. We could have just as easily struggled with the alternative setup and everybody would be saying that Keefe cost us the series by going away from what made us the #1 PP in the league this year.

You have to be careful what you wish for, because I don't think any of us want to go back to the days of playing the likes of a broken down Marleau over Matthews in the 3rd period of game 7.

What's "too late"? Dubas isn't the reason we haven't won yet, and firing him isn't going to magically gift us the cup. If the GM is having a positive impact on the team and making logical moves, that's really all you want in any scenario. That's much rarer in this league than many realize. The issue seems to be that many people here want a blood sacrifice for losing, with no consideration for what exactly that changes, who exactly replaces him, how exactly it helps us moving forward, and what consequences can come from it. I realize that many fans are emotional and reactionary, but in the real world, there has to be more purpose to decisions like this than "we lost? BLAST IT INTO THE SUN!".

No matter what happened this year, we wouldn't be guaranteed to win at least a few rounds next year. There's no transferrable credits for past playoff wins. You're never guaranteed to win anything any year. There is no magic formula. The best you can do is put the best team you can out there.

Talking about who we lost to, and the how and why, isn't about being okay with losing. It's to counter the people who only seem capable of seeing the fact that we lost and the round, and want to make counterproductive moves as a result, because they refuse to acknowledge all of the valuable information and context that goes with it, that gives a much better picture of the quality of our team, what happened, and how far away from the cup we truly are.

Good points, Deke. However, it would have been nice to see Keefe put Gio out on PP1 a few more times to see what would happen.
Keefe losing to Cooper is nothing to be ashamed of, but what about last year? I’ve heard quite a few people, including former players, say that Keefe is being out-coached. I think I tend to agree.