Salary Cap: Salary Cap Summer | The Hunt for 3C | Updated cap info in Post #1

[Paulie Gualtieri]

We're talking about Brian Dumoulin right?

EDIT:

Wait a sec, this might be sarcasm...

Well if he asks for too much the arbitrator would just favor us.

 

[kbuck8851]

I dont care how much. Just sign dumo. Sheary, if he asks or get rewarded too much, can be a piece in a trade for a 3C for all I care. 1 year glued to sid shouldnt get you 5m with term...

We have sprong and ZAR ready or close to ready. Still a few stop gap forwards left in FA too.
We dont have anyone to replace dumoulin.

This.

Frankly, Maatta+Sheary+1st should be a pretty attractive package for a 3C. It depends on who the Pens sees as the #4 Maatta or Cole? Knowing the compatibility of the Cole/Schultz pairing, Cole may have the edge.

 

[ColePens]

For some reference: http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...ie-dekeyser-palmieri-schenn-schwartz-killorn/


I don't think Dumo is going to get too much from an arbitration case. So I'm not worried about that. I look at a guy like Kreider for Sheary. The guy has one season with amazing stats. I can't find a comparable. Kreider had 3 seasons and was working his way up. Looking through these, I think his case is extremely interesting.

 

[Dying Alive]

This.

Frankly, Maatta+Sheary+1st should be a pretty attractive package for a 3C. It depends on who the Pens sees as the #4 Maatta or Cole? Knowing the compatibility of the Cole/Schultz pairing, Cole may have the edge.

It's way too much unless it's a guy who would be a 3C here and at least a 2C elsewhere.

 

[Shady Machine]

Dumoulin will likely gets what's fair. A comparable should be Maatta. So I expect $4mil.

I think Sheary's agent is going to screw him. Sheary needed to sign a 2-3yr deal worth $2mil-2.5mil. Then cash in after that if his play continues. I think they are leaning too much on the regular season stats and under valuing the role Crosby played in his success. He may take his ball and go home and get paid else where...but that's quickly gonna be a bad contract that will be bought out. Sheary was very iffy when away from Crosby and really struggled against bigger, physical teams.

I want Sheary here. I do. I really do. But I also don't believe a hefty cap hit is worth the burden. With Sprong and ZAR chomping at the bit...I wouldn't do anything to make myself movable if I were him, assuming staying in Pittsburgh is something he wants. Bring from Mass, I can't see a more ideal situation closer to home.

Maatta is not a good comparable because he put up 17 goals in his first 2 seasons. The Penguins can easily argue that Maatta regressed and his contract was based on statistically superior seasons than Dumo has had yet.

Maatta is a ceiling for an award that should be granted to Dumo. I'm thinking 3.5-3.75MM should be what he's granted in arbitration.

 

[Pens1566]

I've said it for months, need to sell high on Sheary. Now even more so.

Arbitration can get ugly. Team will/can go seriously negative in their portrayal of the player.

Dumo award doesn't really concern me. He shouldn't get anything really out of whack. He can point to first pairing minutes, but the team can point to zero production and injuries as a rationale.

 

[Corvidae]

Just because they file for arbitration doesn't mean that they won't sign before the hearing. This is just maximizing leverage.

This. If a deal isn't done by the filing deadline, the player will just about always file and very often a contract is still signed before the hearing.

 

[kbuck8851]

It's way too much unless it's a guy who would be a 3C here and at least a 2C elsewhere.

I would be hopeful that a youngish D with some warts but upside would also come back in the deal. Or one having similar contract issues that we may be more willing to pay (Zadorov).

 

[davemess]

Dumoulin should be getting at least the same deal that Maatta got if not a shade more right?

6 years, around $25 million.

 

[CertifiedLurker]

Dumoulin should be getting at least the same deal that Maatta got if not a shade more right?

6 years, around $25 million.

Umm, wrong?

 

[SEALBound]

Vegas has a shortage of LWs on their roster. Wonder if we could work out a Sheary for a center deal.

Looking at Haula, Eakin, Marchessault, or Lindberg?

Looking at the big picture, there is a tremendous parallel between Sheary and Marchessault. That's a pretty even swap IMHO. Considering how many centers LV has and how few LWs they do not have, I think something around that could work well.

 

[SEALBound]

Dumoulin should be getting at least the same deal that Maatta got if not a shade more right?

6 years, around $25 million.

Umm, wrong?

Wouldn't surprise me if that's what arb came up with. More realistically, if he wants long term, 6 years - $21mil - 3.5mil per is what he should get. That's fair for both sides.

 

[66-30-33]

Vegas has a shortage of LWs on their roster. Wonder if we could work out a Sheary for a center deal.

Looking at Haula, Eakin, Marchessault, or Lindberg?

Looking at the big picture, there is a tremendous parallel between Sheary and Marchessault. That's a pretty even swap IMHO. Considering how many centers LV has and how few LWs they do not have, I think something around that could work well.

Haula for 3C then Shore for 4C?

 

[Shady Machine]

Dumoulin should be getting at least the same deal that Maatta got if not a shade more right?

6 years, around $25 million.

No way. Dumo has 2 career goals in 163 games. Let me repeat...2

Fair or not, Dmen get paid more if they produce offensively. Maatta scored 17 goals in his first 2 seasons. The 4MM long term deal was given on the assumption he would be a 2 way dman putting up 30+ points. He's under performed his contract so far IMO (obviously injuries and illness are a part of that).

If someone can find me an RFA top 4 dmen that produces under 20 points a year and can't score a goal to save his life getting over 4MM, I'd love to see it.

 

[ColePens]

I would for sure play chicken with Dumo's agent for arbitration. Offer like a 4-5 year at like 3.5 - 3.75. 1g 15 assists and 0g 16 assists cannot have a **** load of comparable. I'm not sure what else they look at.

I don't think arbitration would give him the Alzner contract. I just don't. Alzner has longevity. I think 3.75 - 4 is the sweetspot.

 

[Shady Machine]

Haula for 3C then Shore for 4C?

That would be amazing, but highly unlikely.

 

[Nakawick]

Dumoulin should be getting at least the same deal that Maatta got if not a shade more right?

6 years, around $25 million.

Dumo would be someone I would go longer term on, just because it protects us in the event Maatta was moved. But then again we really need to watch out for the cap crunch coming with Rust, Wilson, Jake, Murray and potentially Sprong and ZAR big raises coming over the next 1-3 years.

 

[Shady Machine]

I would for sure play chicken with Dumo's agent for arbitration. Offer like a 4-5 year at like 3.5 - 3.75. 1g 15 assists and 0g 16 assists cannot have a **** load of comparable. I'm not sure what else they look at.

I don't think arbitration would give him the Alzner contract. I just don't. Alzner has longevity. I think 3.75 - 4 is the sweetspot.

Agreed. Alzner is the example of Dumo's type of player getting paid on the open market as a UFA. As an RFA with less years and less production than Alzner, he should be under 4MM on a long term deal.

 

[66-30-33]

That would be amazing, but highly unlikely.

:*((

 

[SEALBound]

Haula for 3C then Shore for 4C?

I support either Shore but which one specifically?

 

[ColePens]

And I still think 3 years @ 10m for Sheary makes sense for everyone.

 

[WayneSid9987]

Also if you missed it from Mackey's piece today, JR said he may look outside the trade route(FA'y) or a lesser trade to beef up the C position but nothing that'll stop him from continuing his search for a bonafide 3C.

The DK/Yohe piece, can we get some cliffs? Any new JR quotes in that? And who are his 4C options that were mentioned? Assume Rowney and...?

 

[AjaxTelamon]

Agreed. Alzner is the example of Dumo's type of player getting paid on the open market as a UFA. As an RFA with less years and less production than Alzner, he should be under 4MM on a long term deal.

Yeah, the org probably wants long term at 3.5, Dumo probably wants it at 4.5, and hopefully they settle in the middle.

Dumo is probably the most important non-core player we have (adding Murray to the core). We're just lucky he doesn't have much offensive production to keep his price down.

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

Dumoulin is a lot more than stats though, he's been the rock on defense over the past two years. I'm fine with Sheary at 3.5-4M and Dumo at 4-4.5M on 5 year deals or so, or offer Dumo the same deal as Maatta. Dumoulin is a better dman than him, despite the difference in production. Top 4 dmen in this league get paid, no getting around that.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I support either Shore but which one specifically?

Pauly