Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | The Oilers Biggest Roster Need Is?

[russ99]

November 27th - the first Taylor Hall to the Oilers mention on twitter for the year.

I don't understand this, that time is passed. Hall is perpetually hurt and his skating is affected.

This pipe dream some fans had during the decade of darkness of Hall and Eberle leading an offensive juggernaut to cup after cup needs to go away. If we got Hall back, he wouldn't be that player anymore anyway.

Maybe we be content with the team we have and fix what needs fixing, like long-needed 2RD who can contribute going forward and be a stout defender and see if we can find another goaltending option if Skinner can't find his game.

 

[russ99]

Yeah, I’ll take the analytics over your biased opinion.

Players who play 26 minutes will make mistakes, and sometimes glaring ones.

Yeah and the goalie is there like Fuhr to clean up for all ingnorance of defensive responsibility as long as the shot metrics and goal share go up.

For such a supposed higher level of thinking about hockey, that sounds an awful lot like the 80s style NHL without the goons.

 

[CupofOil]

We must be getting Jiricek. Seeing as how we’re running Bouchard out of town.

It's freaking crazy to me. This is an elite talent that was playing like a legit top 10 if not top 5 Dman for a large chunk of last season and in the playoffs yet he has a bit of a rough patch to start this season and you see posters talking about what trash he is. Boggles my mind.

Highly offensive Dmen make mistakes, sometimes very glaring mistakes, but that's also due to them having the puck on their stick a whole lot so of course the more you have the puck and the more minutes you play the more mistakes that will occur.
The thing is though that the really high end offensive Dmen tilt the ice in such an overwhelming manner that you live with the mistakes because the good far outweighs the bad, he's still a +5 this season despite his "awful" play and an abnormally low save percentage backstopping him when he's on the ice. You don't ever trade Dmen like Bouchard, you hold on to them as tight as you can if you're lucky enough to land one.

 

[russ99]

No need to run Bouchard out of town, he's a very good player. I'd put more onus on the coaching staff for his defensive struggles, and it sure seems this is a strategic mindset to focus on offense to dig ourselves out of an early season hole. But Knoblauch also brought structure and responsibility when he came in, so that sorely needs to come back when the chaos is reined in and we finally fix our gaping roster hole at the back end.

Goaltending has been poor but save percentage is also influenced by defensive play, if such a stat exists, I'd love to see our team save percentage on uncontested chances, as the frequent blown coverage and leaving shooters wide open at the back is not doing our goalies any favors.

The mentality that anything we mess up at the back is OK as long as it's being made up at the other end has undermined our team's ceiling the last 3 years, and I blame Woodcroft for putting that idea in our player's heads, it will take a while to get it coached out.

 

[Scrapin Ice]

It's freaking crazy to me. This is an elite talent that was playing like a legit top 10 if not top 5 Dman for a large chunk of last season and in the playoffs yet he has a bit of a rough patch to start this season and you see posters talking about what trash he is. Boggles my mind.

Highly offensive Dmen make mistakes, sometimes very glaring mistakes, but that's also due to them having the puck on their stick a whole lot so of course the more you have the puck and the more minutes you play the more mistakes that will occur.
The thing is though that the really high end offensive Dmen tilt the ice in such an overwhelming manner that you live with the mistakes because the good far outweighs the bad, he's still a +5 this season despite his "awful" play and an abnormally low save percentage backstopping him when he's on the ice. You don't ever trade Dmen like Bouchard, you hold on to them as tight as you can if you're lucky enough to land one.

Yes Oilcup lets keep brain clutch...and find a excellent skating defensive D to play behind him on the right side. Question is what do you pay BC. He is not complete...needs EKs to cover his flaws. If you trot out the second 'defensive pair' for most D zone faceoffs it will cover off some of the most glaring errors hopefully.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

It's freaking crazy to me. This is an elite talent that was playing like a legit top 10 if not top 5 Dman for a large chunk of last season and in the playoffs yet he has a bit of a rough patch to start this season and you see posters talking about what trash he is. Boggles my mind.

Highly offensive Dmen make mistakes, sometimes very glaring mistakes, but that's also due to them having the puck on their stick a whole lot so of course the more you have the puck and the more minutes you play the more mistakes that will occur.
The thing is though that the really high end offensive Dmen tilt the ice in such an overwhelming manner that you live with the mistakes because the good far outweighs the bad, he's still a +5 this season despite his "awful" play and an abnormally low save percentage backstopping him when he's on the ice. You don't ever trade Dmen like Bouchard, you hold on to them as tight as you can if you're lucky enough to land one.

With Bouchard he has elite offensive talent. His awareness (and sometimes effort) in the defensive zone definitely leaves something to be desired. With that said his pairing with Ekholm at the top of their respective games is one of, if not the best pairing in the entire league.

But as others have said there's no analytic stat for "Pizzas up the middle" or "Dogging it on the backcheck".

It's important to take analytics with the eye test in mind, as they both offer valuable information.

 

[Canovin]

Have people mentioned Nick Jensen from Ottawa?

He's making ~$4 million which isn't that bad... and 50% retained that's a manageable cap hit. Has this year and next remaining on his contract so he's not a pure rental.

He seems like a decent defense first RD to help out the roster.

Nick Jensen would be an upgrade on Emberson and a gapstop until Beau Akey is ready. I think Sens would want to hold onto him tho

 

[CupofOil]

Stauffer shot down anything Jiricek related. He did say players want to come to Edmonton and he keeps hinting we ain’t doing shit until the deadline.

I don’t think we will get any Dman. Every team will know we are desperate at that time. That’s just my opinion. I’m keeping hopes down but I don’t believe in Bowman.

The Oilers are not desperate for a Dman right now and that's not how deadlines work. Just about every team is in the thick of it by the deadline both buyer and seller, there are no "desperation" moves made at a trade deadline.

Also, I will virtually guarantee that the Oilers will make a significant trade by the deadline. There's no chance they won't and you can archive this post and bump it after the deadline and mock me if they don't.

 

[russ99]

Nick Jensen would be an upgrade on Emberson and a gapstop until Beau Akey is ready. I think Sens would want to hold onto him tho

Been wanting Nick Jensen for a few years now. But those types of reliable players are hard to part with.

The Oilers are not desperate for a Dman right now and that's not how deadlines work. Just about every team is in the thick of it by the deadline both buyer and seller, there are no "desperation" moves made at a trade deadline.

Also, I will virtually guarantee that the Oilers will make a significant trade by the deadline. There's no chance they won't and you can archive this post and bump it after the deadline and mock me if they don't.

Trades will start up in earnest right after the Holiday break. We may even get one or two before. Teams don't wait until the deadline anymore if they can line up on a good deal.

The Oilers are not desperate for a Dman right now and that's not how deadlines work. Just about every team is in the thick of it by the deadline both buyer and seller, there are no "desperation" moves made at a trade deadline.

Also, I will virtually guarantee that the Oilers will make a significant trade by the deadline. There's no chance they won't and you can archive this post and bump it after the deadline and mock me if they don't.

Trades will start up in earnest right after the Holiday break. We may even get one or two before. Teams don't wait until the deadline anymore if they can line up on a good deal.

 

[brentashton]

The Oilers are not desperate for a Dman right now and that's not how deadlines work. Just about every team is in the thick of it by the deadline both buyer and seller, there are no "desperation" moves made at a trade deadline.

Also, I will virtually guarantee that the Oilers will make a significant trade by the deadline. There's no chance they won't and you can archive this post and bump it after the deadline and mock me if they don't.

If the deal is there, you make it. For example, if ANA retained on Cam Fowler and took back some salary, the Oilers would be silly not to execute. Might not be desperate but they are wanting for more on the Dline.

 

[McTonyBrar]

This is turning into a cartoon. That’s more than what they want for Provorov (which is just a first)

 

[Spawn]

With Bouchard he has elite offensive talent. His awareness (and sometimes effort) in the defensive zone definitely leaves something to be desired. With that said his pairing with Ekholm at the top of their respective games is one of, if not the best pairing in the entire league.

But as others have said there's no analytic stat for "Pizzas up the middle" or "Dogging it on the backcheck".

It's important to take analytics with the eye test in mind, as they both offer valuable information.

Problem is that some of you are using the “eye test” from two bad plays in one game and extrapolating it to the entire season as if Bouchard regularly makes the couple of mistakes he made in that Toronto game and that is objectively false.

This is turning into a cartoon. That’s more than what they want for Provorov (which is just a first)

Teams usually want more for a top 10 draft pick prospect than they do a ufa rental.

 

[McTonyBrar]

The Oilers are not desperate for a Dman right now and that's not how deadlines work. Just about every team is in the thick of it by the deadline both buyer and seller, there are no "desperation" moves made at a trade deadline.

Also, I will virtually guarantee that the Oilers will make a significant trade by the deadline. There's no chance they won't and you can archive this post and bump it after the deadline and mock me if they don't.

Yes we are. The whole NHL knows we’ve wanted another top 4 Dman since the last deadline. We also lost Broberg. That’s even worse

 

[CupofOil]

If the deal is there, you make it. For example, if ANA retained on Cam Fowler and took back some salary, the Oilers would be silly not to execute. Might not be desperate but they are wanting for more on the Dline.

I'm hoping the Oilers go for younger than Fowler. He'd help now but if the Oilers are spending prime assets, I want a multi-year/long term solution. Then again, Ekholm was the same age as Fowler when the Oilers acquired him but Fowler ain't no Ekholm.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Problem is that some of you are using the “eye test” from two bad plays in one game and extrapolating it to the entire season as if Bouchard regularly makes the couple of mistakes he made in that Toronto game and that is objectively false.


Teams usually want more for a top 10 draft pick prospect than they do a ufa rental.

Bouchard has had more mistakes than just the Toronto game. Early in the season there was a ton of grumbling about his lackluster play. He's not MA Bergeron for sure but he's definitely prone to extremely stupid errors that he shouldn't be making at this level.

 

[Canovin]

Anyone serious about giving Bouchard 11M or anything close to that needs to give your head a shake

 

[FlameChampion]

I believe he's down to a 15 team NTC this year, so he doesn't quite have as much control this year. It's his AAV and level of play that are likely to keep him a Ranger though, as I'm not sure there will be much of a market for him unless NY retains heavily....and maybe not even then. He really hasn't been very good for a while.

Ah I didn’t realize that. I think he’ll eventually get traded then. I think the Rangers are done with him. I can see someone biting on him even with his high aav. His term will help the Rangers move on.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Some of us seen the signs last year that this was coming for Bouchard.

His brain farts, defensive struggles and lack of intensity go beyond this 1/4 season. It's been a pretty big sample size.

When his offensive is elite (like last year) his poor defensive play seems to get looked over.

The analytics definitely have this player wrong.

“The statistics and mathematics are wrong, only my eyes know the REAL story”

I also see that a chunk of this board never negotiated a damn thing in their lives

Yeah and the goalie is there like Fuhr to clean up for all ingnorance of defensive responsibility as long as the shot metrics and goal share go up.

For such a supposed higher level of thinking about hockey, that sounds an awful lot like the 80s style NHL without the goons.

Edmonton has allowed very few high danger chances against compared to some of the other teams in the league. It’s easy to see when people don’t watch hockey that isn’t the Oilers; Other teams just get a save now and again. Except the Avalanche.

 

[brentashton]

This is turning into a cartoon. That’s more than what they want for Provorov (which is just a first)

Waddell has always been an extremely patient GM, thinking back to his time in Carolina especially. He seems to be able to hold out long enough to extract. Thats said, no to Jiricek. I think the Dline needs something more established.

 

[CupofOil]

Anyone serious about giving Bouchard 11M or anything close to that needs to give your head a shake

What would you offer him?
11M does seem a bit rich but he's going to get around $10M in a fast rising cap world and it'll be market value for a player like that.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

What would you offer him?
11M does seem a bit rich but he's going to get around $10M in a fast rising cap world and it'll be market value for a player like that.

Especially since we're not exactly loaded with prospects ready to jump in.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Nick Jensen would be an upgrade on Emberson and a gapstop until Beau Akey is ready. I think Sens would want to hold onto him tho

I expect the Sens will want to keep him too. I think Emberson is coming along. Slowly, but he has shown improvement. I hope that with some more time, he shows continued improvement. I don't expect that he will get to the point where we can call him a 2nd pair defensemen, at least not this season, so I hope we can upgrade on that 2nd pair, bump Stecher down to our #7 slot, and keep developing Emberson on the 3rd.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

What would you offer him?
11M does seem a bit rich but he's going to get around $10M in a fast rising cap world and it'll be market value for a player like that.

again, 11M is his side's first offer. Edmonton's first offer will probably be something like 8-8.5. They'll meet at 9.5-10 and he'll get more money up front and probably get a NTC. It's a negotiation.

 

[CupofOil]

Especially since we're not exactly loaded with prospects ready to jump in.

That's a part of it but Bouchard is also THAT good. I don't think some Oiler fans appreciate how much he drives offense, it's at a very elite level. He's like the Draisaitl of Dmen, gets the lazy tag makes some "lazy" egregious mistakes at times for sure but is an elite offensive driver that does FAR more good than bad. Talents that just don't grow on trees.

 

[ManofSteel55]

What would you offer him?
11M does seem a bit rich but he's going to get around $10M in a fast rising cap world and it'll be market value for a player like that.

His play this season will likely soften that $11M ask he has. I would open negotiations around 8.5 - 9 M if I'm Bowman. He won't take that, but it could lead to a "meet in the middle" at around 10. I think anyone thinking Bouchard isn't worth #1 defenseman money needs to take a look at what other #1 defensemen are making, and then consider the jump in cap space we are about to witness.