Speculation: Roster Building Thread XXXVIII:

[NYSPORTS]

IDK, ADA wrist shot is so sweet I’d rather try him at wing than change defensive sides. He’s not exactly Scott Stevens defensively.

 

[Barnaby]

Believe it or not, I would want someone better. A 60 point defenseman is worth more than a 60 point forward.

Again, I am not sure of how many good matches there are. Do they really need another center if Strome has shown that he is more than capable of playing with Panarin?

If (BIG IF) he is to be traded, it may well be for Trouba's partner. Though I actually think that is what Lundkvist will eventually be a part of a package for.

In an ideal world I’d rather see Strome on the wing on AP’s line. He then gives you the versatility of being able to swing to the middle due to injuries or some line changing.

I’m in favor of keeping ADA bc I know how rare that type of player is. However, if I can get the right higher end center or a true 1LD then I’d listen.

As for peoples mention of the Gaborik trade, I’m certainly not looking to amass a collection of lesser assets. I’d want a game changing talent bc that’s what ADA is.

 

[Barnaby]

Believe it or not, I would want someone better. A 60 point defenseman is worth more than a 60 point forward.

Again, I am not sure of how many good matches there are. Do they really need another center if Strome has shown that he is more than capable of playing with Panarin?

If (BIG IF) he is to be traded, it may well be for Trouba's partner. Though I actually think that is what Lundkvist will eventually be a part of a package for.

In an ideal world I’d rather see Strome on the wing on AP’s line. He then gives you the versatility of being able to swing to the middle due to injuries or some line changing.

I’m in favor of keeping ADA bc I know how rare that type of player is. However, if I can get the right higher end center or a true 1LD then I’d listen.

As for peoples mention of the Gaborik trade, I’m certainly not looking to amass a collection of lesser assets. I’d want a game changing talent bc that’s what ADA is.

For the love of god just play someone on the other side. Right side is stacked, left side is bare. People talk like it’s so impossible but many, many teams don’t have a perfect balance of 3 righties and 3 lefties. It’s not some unthinkable obstacle.

It’s certainly doable if we think these guys have the proper skill set. I don’t see Trouba playing the left side and I don’t see why you’d mess with Fox whose developing well and seems to have great chemistry with Lindgren. That’s leaves ADA. I think his defensive deficiencies are overblown, but I still don’t want to put him in a position to fail. I can’t think of too many high end defensemen who play the off side, but I’m sure someone will have a few examples,

 

[Barnaby]

IDK, ADA wrist shot is so sweet I’d rather try him at wing than change defensive sides. He’s not exactly Scott Stevens defensively.

Idk... ADA is valuable because of the rare offense he provides from the back end. That’s an extremely rare commodity. What does making him a 2nd or 3rd line winger do except for decrease his value? I also feel like guys who slide up tend to be bigger... I’m thinking of a Burns or Big Buff. Making him a forward is like turning a unicorn into a horse.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Moving ADA, the offensive defensemen we've waited ages for is completely asinine. Lock him up.

Betting that Fox or Lundqvist could replace the 4th highest scoring dman in the league this season is reckless.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Idk... ADA is valuable because of the rare offense he provides from the back end. That’s an extremely rare commodity. What does making him a 2nd or 3rd line winger do except for decrease his value? I also feel like guys who slide up tend to be bigger... I’m thinking of a Burns or Big Buff. Making him a forward is like turning a unicorn into a horse.

we all know the only reason any and all of these discussions regarding ADA are happening is b/c of Fox, Trouba and the anticipated arrival of Lundkvist on the same side.

 

[Barnaby]

we all know the only reason any and all of these discussions regarding ADA are happening is b/c of Fox, Trouba and the anticipated arrival of Lundkvist on the same side.

Im not sure it’s wise to start moving ADA around the lineup because of what Lundkvist might be. He needs to come over here and prove it first. ADA has paced at a 60 point level and that’s rare. Tim Erixon was once supposed to be a defensive staple. I can wrap my head around trying a guy on an off side, but completely changing ADA’s game and making him a forward is a little whacky. When does that happen unless you’re talking about a plug like Smith buried on the 4th line or a physical freak like Burns/Buff.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Im not sure it’s wise to start moving ADA around the lineup because of what Lundkvist might be. He needs to come over here and prove it first. ADA has paced at a 60 point level and that’s rare. Tim Erixon was once supposed to be a defensive staple. I can wrap my head around trying a guy on an off side, but completely changing ADA’s game and making him a forward is a little whacky. When does that happen unless you’re talking about a plug like Smith buried on the 4th line or a physical freak like Burns/Buff.

Like I said, we all know why the ADA posts are being made. And he’s not a Scott Stevens defensively in case all those offensive fans forgot and haven’t noticed

 

[Barnaby]

Like I said, we all know why the ADA posts are being made. And he’s not a Scott Stevens defensively in case all those offensive fans forgot and haven’t noticed

Who said Scott Stevens? I do think he’s capable of being okay defensively on a 2nd pair while crushing the PP and getting big minutes late in games when the teams trailing. I don’t think he’s an abomination defensively although granted he gets sheltered at times.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Who said Scott Stevens? I do think he’s capable of being okay defensively on a 2nd pair while crushing the PP and getting big minutes late in games when the teams trailing. I don’t think he’s an abomination defensively although granted he gets sheltered at times.

I said it above. Twice, making a point.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

What is your solution? Offer him a two year bridge deal and have him go UFA after?

Well I'd like to sign him to a team friendly deal but if you can't then you have to move him. Personally I'd love to keep him but we cant spend all our cap space on right side dmen.

 

[bobbop]

Believe it or not, I would want someone better. A 60 point defenseman is worth more than a 60 point forward.

Again, I am not sure of how many good matches there are. Do they really need another center if Strome has shown that he is more than capable of playing with Panarin?

If (BIG IF) he is to be traded, it may well be for Trouba's partner. Though I actually think that is what Lundkvist will eventually be a part of a package for.

Nylander is RW and on pace for 37-34-71 this year. Plus his goals in the triangle were way up this season. What more do you want?

Got any ideas?

 

[FIRE DRURY]

Nylander is RW and on pace for 37-34-71 this year. Plus his goals in the triangle were way up this season. What more do you want?

Got any ideas?

People here shit on Nylander like he’s just a passenger. You watch Leafs games and you’ll see Nylander is the guy that stirs the pot on a lot of plays.

If he needs talented forwards to thrive, we have a couple of good ones.

Not suggesting a ADA/WL swap, but that’s the kind of player you do move him for. Young. Proven. Signed long term. And productive.

 

[Barnaby]

Nylander is RW and on pace for 37-34-71 this year. Plus his goals in the triangle were way up this season. What more do you want?

Got any ideas?

That’s def an offer that I’d mull over. If I make that move then I probably look to shop Buchnevich for a middle 6 guy whose more of a north/south player. I would prefer a natural center but Nylander is a guy you seriously consider.

 

[Mikos87]

Nylander is a high skilled player, but if the Leafs move him, it will be for a top pair RHD that can play with Rielly.

I am not for moving any of the RHDs on the Rangers for two more years until Fox is due for his next contract, or if both Fox and Nils replace DeAngelo's production.

When you have defensemen that are good with the puck on every pair, and can chip in offense at any time, it gives you a 5 man attack. That is not something a lot of teams have. If Key develops into a shutdown force, and you get one of Hajek or Rykov that can handle minutes in the NHL, then you don't have to worry about your defense and can afford to move out players.

As it stands today, you have Staal and Smith getting time in the top 6. While they haven't been terrible the last 20-30 games, that's still 33% of your defense on those guys. Until you replace them, and their production, you do not make a transitional swap in a 1:1.

Offense isn't the Rangers problem. It's the depth roles that are. Guys who can be out there protecting leads, killing penalties so Mika doesn't have to, defensemen on the PK.

You need to fill those roles to be a contender.

I think the team needs a really good 4th line center, and some of the younger forwards to take a step where they play good two way hockey up front, and I think they need a LHD that can pair up with Trouba to handle hard minutes. I would also want an upgrade on the top 6 with a complimentary winger for Bread and/or Zib.

Not all of those roles are going to be filled with kids. Some of them are going to have to come via a trade with some kids going the other way.

Kreider-Zib-Buch
Bread-Strome-Fast
Digi-Chytil-Kakko
Lemiuex-Howden-Goat

Slots to upgrade/Players to shift down the line-up

Viable Prospects: Barron, VK, Lias.

Unless Barron can step in right away, you have VK as your other potential forward, and he needs to take a big step before becoming an NHLer. You also have Lias as a guy who you would have to salvage a relationship with, but frankly he's shown so little and with all the drama, I wouldn't bank on him making a push.

In other words, you don't have prospects up front who can push for a spot in the foreseeable future.

The team would be better served re-signing Fast. Hoping that one of Kakko or Goat can move into the top six. Getting a 4th line center that can play a checking role, or hope that Howden turns into that.

Smith-Trouba
Lindy-Fox
Staal-Deangelo

Viable Prospects: Lundqvist, Hajek, Miller, Rykov, Reunanen

Up-front: You can sign a 4th line center like a Johan Larrson or hope that Howden plays every game like the game he played in Colorado. Move Digi down to the 4th line with Lems, and have them all be a checking unit. You can slot Goat up into the top 9 and see what he can do. Have Kreider mentor him on how to play a similar role. That would be the bare minimum without trades.

Back-end: You have one of the kids step in with DeAngelo, and get minutes with Bread & Zib at even strength. You make a trade with one of the kids and picks to get a top 4 minute eater who can play an effective game with Trouba, unless Miller can step in right away.

 

[egelband]

As for Quinn, DeAngelo has thrived under him. Holding players accountable is not really the same thing as bumping heads with him. Look at the role he has under him now.

I’ll do ya one better. I’d say that every player on the team now* is playing just about their career-best hockey right now. Quinn is doing lots right.

*naturally this excludes Lundqvist and Staal who’s performance issues are more age-related than anything to do with the coaching.

 

[Inferno]

I have heard this view before. That is actually not an accurate statement in av vacuum. Whether or not he was playing with Staal does not change that he received favorable matchups. That seems to imply that the matchups are even. They are not. His numbers would be much worse if his matchups were less favorable.

Again, my view of him is that it is far easier to find him a defensive minded partner that it is to find another DeAngelo.

Haven't studied shown that quality of teammates is a far bigger driving factor than quality of opposition?

I'd say staal has pulled down DeAngelo a ton more than him getting favorable matchups has helped him.

Tough to say for sure tho.

 

[Vitto79]

Haven't studied shown that quality of teammates is a far bigger driving factor than quality of opposition?

I'd say staal has pulled down DeAngelo a ton more than him getting favorable matchups has helped him.

Tough to say for sure tho.

It’s funny cause DeAngelo gets praise , Staal is pooped in yet they are D partners

If no compliance buyout I think they just keep Staal for his last year

 

[Trxjw]

I don't think anyone wants to kick ADA out the door, but the Rangers do need to make a decision about where they're allocating their cap and where their weaknesses are. If competing for the playoffs is the goal next season, that's a pretty tall order with Trouba dragging Smith or Staal around the ice against top competition. So if the Rangers can get a player they can ice with Trouba in exchange for Tony, then I think that's something they'll definitely consider. Trouba/Player X, Lindgren/Fox is your top-4 next season, playing the bulk of minutes. Hopefully with Miller/Hajek and Lundkivst taking over those bottom pairing spots in the next few years.

I would say a top LD is who they would want, with a comparable talent at forward being the secondary ask. The latter ultimately requiring a follow-up move to bring in a capable top-4 LD option. The Rangers have a pretty potent offensive group up front, and that's without Kakko and Chytil really sniffing the high-end of their potential. I think dialing back the load on Shesty is probably the priority, and that starts with bolstering the blue line.

 

[Vitto79]

Haven't studied shown that quality of teammates is a far bigger driving factor than quality of opposition?

I'd say staal has pulled down DeAngelo a ton more than him getting favorable matchups has helped him.

Tough to say for sure tho.

It’s funny cause DeAngelo gets praise , Staal is pooped in yet they are D partners

If no compliance buyout I think they just keep Staal for his last year

 

[True Blue]

Unless the league maintains equal lefties and righties, there has to be many guys playing their offside. I’m not saying they’re considering it I’m saying it’s by far the simplest solution.

The simplest solution is not necessarily the most easiest one. I do not know many defenseman that play the off side

 

[True Blue]

Hm, I don’t follow? Namestnikov made 4m per. Getting rid of him would have been significant.

I realize that the benefit of hindsight is beautiful, working in reality is quite different. Before committing to him long term, Gorton needed to see more and frankly so too did Quinn. If Gorton had used the money on him immediately and DeAngelo had gone out and had a 20 point season with a poor attitude, you would have been saying how badly Gorton bungled the cap space.

Also going through a season with no cap space is not what many GMs would do. Only the arm chair ones.

And what do you mean with “dead cap space”? Smith was and is 100% dead cap space. If we buy him out he is only 66% dead cap space.

For most of the season, Smith was fine as a 4th line wing/PK defensemen. Not until the younger defensemen started to show that they can kill penalties did he get removed from that.

Lastly, resigning TDA this summer instead of last will certainly cost us more for a lot longer time than any Smith/Staal buy-out.

Again, trying to think decisions through with the benefit of hindsight is a beautiful thing, no?

I don’t think this really is debatable. Gorton could easily have created the space to resign TDA last summer, stating anything else is just not in touch with reality...

Except that last summer, DeAngelo was much more of an unknown and it would have been assinne for Gorton to sign him to a long term deal at that point. Stating anything different is completely out of touch with how the real world works.

 

[True Blue]

In an ideal world I’d rather see Strome on the wing on AP’s line. He then gives you the versatility of being able to swing to the middle due to injuries or some line changing.

I’m in favor of keeping ADA bc I know how rare that type of player is. However, if I can get the right higher end center or a true 1LD then I’d listen.

As for peoples mention of the Gaborik trade, I’m certainly not looking to amass a collection of lesser assets. I’d want a game changing talent bc that’s what ADA is.

There is a market clearing rate for everything. And if a Theodore or a Werenksi is presented, I think that all of us would listen. Including Gorton.

Right now, playing Strome at center allows for Quinn to deploy Kreider & ZBad as another line. That has showed itself to be a pretty big weapon. I agree that Strome has versatility to play wing and center, but finding another Pivot while shifting him over may not yield the same results.

 

[True Blue]

Nylander is RW and on pace for 37-34-71 this year. Plus his goals in the triangle were way up this season. What more do you want?

Got any ideas?

My idea is not to trade him at all.

But if I were to do so, given what is out there and what is realistic as far as trading partners go, it would be for Trouba's partner.

 

[True Blue]

Well I'd like to sign him to a team friendly deal but if you can't then you have to move him. Personally I'd love to keep him but we cant spend all our cap space on right side dmen.

Not all the cap is tied down. And a team friendly deal means different things to different people. The kid at 24 has just produced the best offensive season by a Rangers defense man in 25 years. Let that sink in for a bit. And has just run the best power play in probably the same time frame. Let that also sink in for a bit.