Speculation: Roster Building Thread XII

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I think we have to prepare for life without Mika so we def have to keep Chytil, flip Strome+Assets for a controllable C like a Dvorak, Larkin and make sure we get a top tier C prospect back from a Buch transaction. So if we lose Mika, we still have something like:

Chytil/Dvorak or Larkin/Someone like a Holloway down the middle plus Barron/Goodrow if we have to.
 
Do you get a raise when your company is worth more?
If it's capitalism for all - I should. If I'm on a contract I'd like to negotiate the next one to be better. But with the cap I can't. Not here, nor with the competitor. Even if they want me and are willing pay.
 
How to kill @EdJovanovski

Step 1: Give Trouba the C.
Step 2: Sign Goodrow.
Step 3: Trade Buch.

5gytjj.gif
If all 3 happen I’m blaming you
 
Goodrow's camp is going to use Brandon Tanev as his comparable. Tanev signed with Pittsburgh 2 years ago but teams didn't know about COVID. He signed a 6 year deal for $3.5m per season. My sense is that we see a similar term (6 years) at $3.2-3.3m per season.
I love what Tanev brings. If Seattle claims him, I’d make a move to acquire him if the cost is right (I’ve seen Hajek and a 3rd mentioned recently). Absolute PITA to play against and perfect in his role.
 
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you’re ignoring the rest which is part of they why. His point pertains to many companies. Do you get a raise when your company is worth more?

I get the players are the product but are the selling more? Are revenues up? Most of the NHL is in the red.
Many of us probably do get increased compensation or worth when our companies are worth more via bonuses, stock prices and allocations, etc.
 
Dvorak isn't a bad target if you think he has another gear in him. You're getting him at virtually the same age you got Strome but he has term. So if he can take the same steps forward with a better group of players then there's the possibility for having a good complimentary center with term for a number of years.

That being said, he's not a guy I see ending up replacing Zibanejad. So if he's the 2C going forward you're just further strengthening the road block ahead of Chytil. I'm also not giving up a fortune to get him. Someone else can pay Arizona's "he's our only good center" tax.
 
I love what Tanev brings. If Seattle claims him, I’d make a move to acquire him if the cost is right (I’ve seen Hajek and a 3rd mentioned recently). Absolute PITA to play against and perfect in his role.

Why would you do that when they may be able to get Goodrow for a similar contract and only gave up a 7th.
 
How to kill @EdJovanovski

Step 1: Give Trouba the C.
Step 2: Sign Goodrow.
Step 3: Trade Buch.

5gytjj.gif

I was sitting next 2 @EdJovanovski at the 2019 draft in Vancouver (where he lives) when they annouced the JT Miller trade to the Canucks.

In all honesty, that was the most memorable moment of the weekend, where we had a 2nd overall pick :laugh:
 
Many of us probably do get increased compensation or worth when our companies are worth more via bonuses, stock prices and allocations, etc.

i’m not talking about stock prices. In that case, so long as the NHL players have a financial advisor they make money.

Want to talk about the operating income of these NHL franchises? That should this to bed.
 
Louder for the people in the back.

There were a bunch of reasons for this (Roster Construction, Coaching, Covid, Crazy Russian shit, crazy DeAngelo shit, etc) but looking at this roster and thinking "HEY! WHAT WE NEED TO AUGMENT OUR TALENT IS MORE SCORING" is befuddling.

Isn't this a red herring though? Or a straw man? I can't keep my logical fallacies straight.

Point is, who is really arguing that we "need more scoring"?

I think the major argument that almost everyone is making in regard to Eichel, is in regard to a larger argument that we want more young center talent, which goes hand in hand with the "We are apprehensive about giving Zibanejad 7 years at age 29," argument, which goes hand in hand with the "should we be focusing on building around Panarin/Zibanejad/Kreider or Lafreneiere/Kakko/Chytil/Fox?" debate.

It seems to me that advocating for Eichel mostly centers around two concepts (at least that's what I'm steadfastly arguing, so maybe my read of other's posts is tainted in this aspect):

1) Desire for overall better center talent (not necessarily scoring), as most cup winners the past decade and a half have either elite center talent or elite center depth, and

2) Desire for more youth at center so that we have the core to grow with Lafreniere/Kakko/Chytil/Fox, et al.

As I've said in my posts supporting an Eichel trade, first, I'm not emptying the cupboard - I would have a deal centered around, like, Buch/Strome/Jones/15OA. I wouldn't even deal Kravtsov or Lundkvist at this point given his contract and injury uncertainty, but if I can get him for something LIKE that, I do it all day long. If that's fantasy (which it might be to an extent, but I don't think an Eichel package requires anything close to what some have speculated or what Buffalo has asked for), then I move on to other targets. I'm not a huge fan of the Larkin or Lindholm ideas, but I would certainly be aggressive to teams like Florida and Vegas, or other teams who fancy themselves playoff contenders, to try to get shots at guys like Lundell, Krebs, Rossi, Perfetti, Newhook, Vilardi, etc.

Some of those names are well-rounded 200 foot players, not simply "more scoring," prospects.

I think the major idea here is that we have Zibanejad, Chytil, and very little else worth mentioning at center, whereas we have wingers for days.

There is a lot of uncertainty at a position where it's pretty widely thought that you need, need, need pretty high end talent. Are there exceptions? Of course. But the general rule is win with top centers. Or at least that's how you stay a decade-long contender, which is kinda what we are aiming for.

Anyway, Eichel fits in here because he gives us more youth and more roster flexibility in terms of checking off a "long term need" box for those who don't want to be held over a barrel with Zibanejad in 12 months.

I understand there is uncertainty there, in the form of his injury and his existing contract to make you hesitate (though I might argue the 5 years left on that deal make it a positive, not a negative). But what always seems left unsaid is that there should kinda be equal uncertainty if we do nothing but ride what we have.
 
this is rudimentary but if Chytil got Dvorak's minutes (which is affected by his injury so bear that in mind) and we assume he maintained the same p/60, he would've had 30 ES points. That would have tied him with Tavares, Huberdeau, and Farabee for 23rd among all forwards.

I'm sure someone will find a way to say that's not actually good but it's something to think about.
And if my aunt had balls she’d be my uncle. I’m not taking away anything Chytil has done. Especially before injury/covid where he looked like he was making a difference consistently. But it’s impossible to compare. Chytil had 0 Pp time, played on a 3rd line that mainly had 4th line minutes for the last 20 odd games and didn’t go against teams top D/ forward units.
Right now at this point in time, today Dvorak is better defensively, better at face offs, and I’d wager with better line mates, the better offensive player
 
Just to continue the thought, someone with some time today, please do a comparison between Dvorak and Larkin in terms of points, TOI, zone starts, etc. I think we will find that Dvorak compares pretty decently to Larkin. If the cost on Larkin is exorbitant by Yzerman, Dvorak would not be a bad option. Specifically because he is locked into a contract already.

There is no comparison. Larkin is much better at most everything.
 
I would have a deal centered around, like, Buch/Strome/Jones/15OA.

:laugh:

Yeah ok. Sit in the Sabres GM chair and sell that to your fans. Got a wing they didn’t need, a center most didn’t want, a defensive prospect low on their prospect depth chart and a maybe from a weak draft class.

Only way this looks good for Buffalo is if they traded a $10 million dollar player who couldn’t play any more.
 
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:laugh:

Yeah ok. Sit in the Sabres GM chair and sell that to your fans. Got a wing they didn’t need, a center most didn’t want, a defensive prospect low on their prospect depth chart and a maybe from a weak draft class.

Ok, then they can keep him, or deal him for another fantasy land package that they are not going to get back, like Byfield from LA or Zegras from Anaheim.

Not sure where I lost you on that... pretty clearly said if a package "like that," can't get Eichel then I pass.
 
Lord Jesus, I’m game to open up the wallet for Coleman, but $4x6 for Goodrow? Gonna have to be a hard pas from me.

That’s some Vancouver tier dumbf***ery.

I mean, given what RNH just signed for I cannot imagine Goodrow actually gets that. We will see.
 
There is no comparison. Larkin is much better at most everything.
I do think currently Larkin is the superior player. But I also think the gap isn’t a huge margin between the 2. Factor in that Larkin is a local kid/ captain, so the cost of acquisition will be greater, potential to fill role we need, contract status, and availability and Dvorak makes a ton of sense as a legit 2C. If chytil eventually passes him, great. Slide Dvo down and he’s be an excellent 3 C as well making under 5 mill from age 25/26-30
 
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:laugh:

Yeah ok. Sit in the Sabres GM chair and sell that to your fans. Got a wing they didn’t need, a center most didn’t want, a defensive prospect low on their prospect depth chart and a maybe from a weak draft class.


Chytil/Buchnevich/Robertson/Georgiev/15OA/Cond.1st (lottery protected)

for

Eichel


Strome/Kakko/Robertson/Georgiev/150A

for


Eichel (20% retained)



these are about what you can expect realistic offers to be from GM Drury and what Adams would want in his checklist. Lotta bulk for BUF here and a huge risk for NYR but could quite possibly be the best trade this team could make in the next decade or for the rest of history




Buffalo got a lot of interest in Robertson btw
 
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