Speculation: Roster Building Thread XII

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

agree on the Buch return. I think people are expecting to get too much from him. Plus wing is the most abundant position to trade for from the start.
Agree to disagree on Crouse though

I'm expecting a hockey trade, or a 1st and good prospect like most other trades of pending UFAs who are very good... futures could be flipped for a center, etc.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

is Chytil really a "3C'? he's not good defensively, he doesn't really hit, he can't win face offs.. Thats kinda what you want in a 3C.. I understand people not wanting to give up on him, but if he's not a top 6 center he's probably worth more in a trade.

and yes all of these in time can come, he's young.. That doesn't mean the Rangers are going to give him the time to do it.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

is Chytil really a "3C'? he's not good defensively, he doesn't really hit, he can't win face offs.. Thats kinda what you want in a 3C.. I understand people not wanting to give up on him, but if he's not a top 6 center he's probably worth more in a trade.

and yes all of these in time can come, he's young.. That doesn't mean the Rangers are going to give him the time to do it.

False.

He's actually probably our best defensive center right now, or at least until Goodrow signs. Strome can't defend and Zibanejad's defensive game has gone from pretty good to not so good to alarmingly f***ing bad over the last few seasons. You can chalk some of it up to covid last year, but he was trending downwards before that. Quinnfluence? Maybe partially, but no one has tailed off harder than he has.

Teams don't really deploy 3rd line "checking" units anymore. He and Kakko together were pretty f***ing great defensively. Thats a duo that actually works.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

False.

He's actually probably our best defensive center right now, or at least until Goodrow signs. Strome can't defend and Zibanejad's defensive game has gone from pretty good to not so good to alarmingly f***ing bad over the last few seasons. You can chalk some of it up to covid last year, but he was trending downwards before that. Quinnfluence? Maybe partially, but no one has tailed off harder than he has.

Teams don't really deploy 3rd line "checking" units anymore. He and Kakko together were pretty f***ing great defensively. Thats a duo that actually works.

Yes the kid line played well for sure

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

bottom line is the Rangers centers aren't good enough, and we're all lying to ourselves to think they are. They are too similar, not really physical, not great defensively, and kinda easy to play against. It needs to change, no idea what the answer is, but it needs to change.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Dvorak is not great, signed forever, moderately pricy for his production, and a bad fit with panarin since he’s way more of a playmaker than a goal scorer. I have very little interest. I don’t think he’s better than Chytil right now either.

Yeah, I was very interested in Dvorak a year or two ago, but now I don’t see him as much of an upgrade to Chytil. I’d much rather be pursuing a Larkin. Failing that, promote Filip to 2C, and acquire either a more rugged, defensive guy or prospect who hasn’t really broken into the league yet to slot in behind him.

 

[RangersFan1994]

If available I bet Larkin will be a Ranger before Eichel, his cheaper contract, less of a liability, a better 200 ft player, and his chemistry with Kreider during the team USA days.

Anyone thinks Justin Abdelkader will be a Ranger on a rebound type of show me contract? Or is he done at this point?

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

Someone got a pretty long interview with Quinn tonight

 

[jay from jersey]

Thats not a reason to trade Chytil for him. The point is for him to replace Strome, not Chytil.

Wasn’t taking about trading chytil for him. Pointing out he’s an upgrade of Chytil now, currently. He’s only 25 himself.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Nils for Dvo, straight up.

Fight me.

No. Dvorak is so mediocre, there's gotta be a better use of Nils.

 

[Tob]

Someone got a pretty long interview with Quinn tonight

great find. I'll save that for a day when I'm feeling too good and need to put a damper on my day to ground myself back down.

 

[Tob]

The biggest pitfall of the roster building thread is trying to figure out elaborate ways to improve our center depth through trades only to trade away Lundkvist, lose strome as an UFA due to cap acquired in a trade for a center and have the younger center end up on par with Strome.

 

[brakeyawself]

False.

He's actually probably our best defensive center right now, or at least until Goodrow signs. Strome can't defend and Zibanejad's defensive game has gone from pretty good to not so good to alarmingly f***ing bad over the last few seasons. You can chalk some of it up to covid last year, but he was trending downwards before that. Quinnfluence? Maybe partially, but no one has tailed off harder than he has.

Teams don't really deploy 3rd line "checking" units anymore. He and Kakko together were pretty f***ing great defensively. Thats a duo that actually works.

100%. The only legit criticisms of Chytil are his weak faceoffs and, with his size, he could probably be more physical. I still think he could be a very very good 2C for us. Would hate to move him now. But someone really needs to make him practice faceoffs for like 8 hours a day. Being that Chytil is still just 21, I would not be shocked at all if he eventually replaced Ziban at 1C. Barring we don't add someone like Eichel or a clear number 1C.

Right now, I hope they focus on trading Strome, if he's worth anything decent. And I would like to see Chytil deployed at 2C. Main problem is again, faceoffs, as we don't really have wingers like JT Miller or Wheeler who could take faceoffs instead of the C. Also, trading Buch to clear room for our youngsters, and one or 2 of our deep D prospect pool. The one's still not in the NHL, minus Lundqvist.

I do think we could put together a package of some grouping of Buch, Robertson, Tuomanen, Strome, for a Center though. But I do worry about Ziban, who I am not sure if he can ever repeat his BIG year statistically. I like Ziban, I do. But I am really not sure if he is the player we need at C with the rest of this team. Injuries and consistency considered. So either way I would want to keep Chytil, and maybe replace Ziban with a true playmaking, consistent 1C. Just not Eichel please until his neck issue has been sorted out. That kind of injury can easily turn chronic, ruining his career.

And I seriously think Zac Jones will end up being our top offensive LD. Even better than Miller IMO. So I don't want to see Jones leave at all. While Robertson does bring more size, I think size is a bit overrated compared to physicality (Ie Lindgren). And I am not sure if Robertson has the offensive potential of Jones either. So I wouldn't mind moving Robertson, Tuomanen or even Hajek. And I seriously think we will see Jones, paired with either Fox or Lundqvist (assuming Lundqvist is everything he's supposed to be), long term on PP1 or PP2.

Really don't want to lose any of Kakko, Kravtsov, Lindgren, Chytil, Miller or Jones though as far as young players go. Or Schneider for that matter who I think will eventually replace Trouba. Laf, Fox, Panarin and Shesterkin absolutely won't be traded either of course. Which kind of leaves Buch the odd man out. As good as he was this past season, I still think he will be the winger we trade to make room for our 3 young, possible stud wingers (Laf, Kakko, Kravtsov). And I am fine with that as long as we get the right player in return.

Then all we really have to do is draft a nice young center prospect this year and get lucky. Really wouldn't mind McTavish, Lucius or Sillinger but I doubt if any of them will still be there at pick 15. Raty, Pinelli and Bolduc I think would be our best options unless one of the top 3 fall. I am not sure how I feel about Svechkov though. He seems, right now at least, like a probable 3C. Which isn't so bad if we did keep Ziban and Chytil long term. But the others I mentioned I think have higher offensive potential. Bourgault and Kent Johnson are great, but I think are going to be wingers, good ones, in the NHL unless their complete game improves dramatically.

Think we are all set at GK. Shesterkin/Georgiev combo looks pretty great going forward. And I think we were extremely lucky that Kreider was willing to sign long term with the understanding that there's a good chance he will probably end up being a 3rd liner down the road. Good man that Kreider.

And I do not think there is any need to move Lundqvist to bring in a Center. We have assets that we should be more willing to move in Buch, Strome, Robertson and Tuomanen. And I actually do not think Dvorak would be a bad player to get. He's very underrated and on a pretty bad team. In ways, he is similar to Danault who would also be a nice add. But I still think Chytil has a future at center, barring he improves his faceoffs. Rumor has it we tried to get Horvat, which would be AMAZING, but can't see Nucks moving him at all. Other center options might be Tyler Johnson or Y. Gourde, maybe R. Johansen now that Tomasino will be brought up, one of the Kings young excess centers, Monahan, Hertl, or a long shot like Couture or Couturier. I doubt we would have to trade Lunqvist for any of them except maybe Couture or Couturier. But all things considered, Dvorak wouldn't be bad at all and relatively less expensive than other options. Personally, I think Monahan might be the sweet spot. I could see Flames accepting something like Buch and/or Strome, Robertson (or Tuomanen) , which I honestly do not think is too much. Couturier would be my ideal though if the price was right.

 

[smoneil]

Someone got a pretty long interview with Quinn tonight

Good questions on Gauthier and Howden. I was hoping for a question on Chytil (use vs. production rate), but he wasn't brought up. Based on some of Quinn's answers, particularly the answers about the rumored disconnect between him and the star players and way he used the young forwards, I would bet money that Quinn posts here or at least reads the board (the responses sounded very similar to some of the very pro-Quinn posters). He does have a good sense of humor (the bit about "Hey, I always wondered what it would feel like to be fired, and now I know").

I will say this--I honestly think that, had the Rangers not won the draft lotteries, I think Quinn is still the coach. I think those lottery wins threw everything off of the planned route for the rebuild.

 

[Machinehead]

Good questions on Gauthier and Howden. I was hoping for a question on Chytil (use vs. production rate), but he wasn't brought up. Based on some of Quinn's answers, particularly the answers about the rumored disconnect between him and the star players and way he used the young forwards, I would bet money that Quinn posts here or at least reads the board (the responses sounded very similar to some of the very pro-Quinn posters). He does have a good sense of humor (the bit about "Hey, I always wondered what it would feel like to be fired, and now I know").

I will say this--I honestly think that, had the Rangers not won the draft lotteries, I think Quinn is still the coach. I think those lottery wins threw everything off of the planned route for the rebuild.

And arguably with good reason.

I mean, I see a hundred ways it goes wrong, but I also see a scenario with this team is stacked soon.

 

[smoneil]

100%. The only real criticisms of Chytil are his weak faceoffs and, with his size, he could probably be more physical. I still think he could be a very very good 2C for us. Would hate to move him now. But someone really needs to make him practice faceoffs for like 8 hours a day. Being that Chytil is still just 21, I would not be shocked at all if he eventually replaced Ziban at 1C. Barring we don't add someone like Eichel or a clear number 1C.

Then all we really have to do is draft a nice young center prospect this year and get lucky. Really wouldn't mind McTavish, Lucius or Sillinger but I doubt if any of them will still be there at pick 15. Raty, Pinelli and Bolduc I think would be our best options unless one of the top 3 fall. I am not sure how I feel about Svechkov though. He seems, right now at least, like a probable 3C. Which isn't so bad if we did keep Ziban and Chytil long term. But the others I mentioned I think have higher offensive potential. Bourgault and Kent Johnson are great, but I think are going to be wingers, good ones, in the NHL unless their complete game improves dramatically.

Chytil's face-off percentage did go up this year as well, by something like 5 points. Young players are rarely great at face-offs, particularly when they don't get to take many of them during the season. Assuming they sign Goodrow, he may well be an ideal RW on a line with Kreider and Chytil. He can take the face-offs in key situations, and hopefully influence a bit of the intensity in Chytil's game.

Drafting (outside of the top 5) and hoping on a 1C isn't really a sound strategy. This team has only drafted two #1 centers (based on a loose definition of the term) in the last 30 years: Derek Stepan and Marc Savard.

I think the key is to replace one of our current top 3 centers with someone who adds a different element. Zib, Strome, and Chytil are all too similar in the way they play the game. Due to cap cost and age, I think Strome is the logical one to go (Chytil is young and cheap and Zibanejad produces more). Eichel would be more of the same, so I don't want him brought in. A center who is rock-solid defensively while also producing would be a good option (like a Larkin or a Cirelli). I'd be willing to gamble on a guy like Dvorak, but not for a huge price tag. My ideal, and I don't know who this player would be, would be to find a guy who could play like Brandon Dubinsky did before he broke down--a heavy, physical, heart on his sleeve player who can also put up 45-55 points a season. Adding a guy like that to a mix that includes Chytil and Zibanejad would give this team a very different look and make them much harder to play against.

 

[brakeyawself]

Chytil's face-off percentage did go up this year as well, by something like 5 points. Young players are rarely great at face-offs, particularly when they don't get to take many of them during the season. Assuming they sign Goodrow, he may well be an ideal RW on a line with Kreider and Chytil. He can take the face-offs in key situations, and hopefully influence a bit of the intensity in Chytil's game.

Drafting (outside of the top 5) and hoping on a 1C isn't really a sound strategy. This team has only drafted two #1 centers (based on a loose definition of the term) in the last 30 years: Derek Stepan and Marc Savard.

I think the key is to replace one of our current top 3 centers with someone who adds a different element. Zib, Strome, and Chytil are all too similar in the way they play the game. Due to cap cost and age, I think Strome is the logical one to go (Chytil is young and cheap and Zibanejad produces more). Eichel would be more of the same, so I don't want him brought in. A center who is rock-solid defensively while also producing would be a good option (like a Larkin or a Cirelli). I'd be willing to gamble on a guy like Dvorak, but not for a huge price tag. My ideal, and I don't know who this player would be, would be to find a guy who could play like Brandon Dubinsky did before he broke down--a heavy, physical, heart on his sleeve player who can also put up 45-55 points a season. Adding a guy like that to a mix that includes Chytil and Zibanejad would give this team a very different look and make them much harder to play against.

Well, we wouldn't need to count on the draft pick turning into a 1C if we keep Ziban and Chytil. It would just be a best case scenario. And I think Raty, Bolduc and Pinelli all have that potential, but just as likely to end up as middle 6 players.

I would love a guy like Couturier honestly, but think he might cost too much. Monahan similarly, but not sure he's quite what you had in mind. I think there are so many plausible options though if we are willing to just move Buch and/or Strome and Robertson or Tuomanen. I would actually be VERY happy with Christian Dvorak who I think is terribly underrated, in ways similar to Danault who would also be a good choice.

But I see absolutely NO need to move guys like Lundqvist or Chytil which others have suggested. I would rather get a slightly lesser Center in return, just to keep the likes of Chytil and Lundqvist.

Hertl might be another good option. Even Y. Gourde wouldn't be bad. Nugent-Hopkins perhaps? Buchnevich would look pretty great in the Oilers top 6.

But Dvorak to me actually seems like one of the more reasonable options out there.

 

[kovazub94]

... I would bet money that Quinn posts here or at least reads the board (the responses sounded very similar to some of the very pro-Quinn posters)...

Ahaha.

 

[smoneil]

Ahaha.

That sounds like a Bostonian laugh...

 

[NYR Viper]

The guy Goodrow will directly support is Chytil. Goodrow is good defensively, physical and good on face-offs.

 

[kovazub94]

That sounds like a Bostonian laugh...

Spot on. Just like in the earlier post.

 

[Ola]

is Chytil really a "3C'? he's not good defensively, he doesn't really hit, he can't win face offs.. Thats kinda what you want in a 3C.. I understand people not wanting to give up on him, but if he's not a top 6 center he's probably worth more in a trade.

and yes all of these in time can come, he's young.. That doesn't mean the Rangers are going to give him the time to do it.

The thing is, I think all these things must be established on a line by line basis. I.e. you need to be able to get the puck up ice, you need to be able to keep it there, be strong on it in the corners and be able to move it around, you need to be able to set the tone physically and go after the puck hard, you need to be able to win battles for pucks in your own end etc etc etc.

The line of Goodrow-Gourde-Coleman is a perfect example form my perspective in this regard. Chytil can definitely eventually match Gourde’s defense.

The biggest concern I have with Chytil is that he doesn’t have that water bug ability that Gourde have to turn the play extremely fast and take away ice extremely well on the back check. The reason that Tampa line has been so extremely effective is because all it takes is Gourde getting to one lose puck or one of the wingers winning a battle along the boards and being able to get the puck to Gourde — the opponent ends up on its heels.

 

[rangers1314]

Note from Friedman today:

“One situation to watch: Pavel Buchnevich, Rangers. Arbitration eligible. UFA next summer. Too expensive to keep? Other teams like him.”

 

[tomobson]

great find. I'll save that for a day when I'm feeling too good and need to put a damper on my day to ground myself back down.

I want to listen to it but I just can't imagine having to listen to his voice again haha.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Note from Friedman today:

“One situation to watch: Pavel Buchnevich, Rangers. Arbitration eligible. UFA next summer. Too expensive to keep? Other teams like him.”

Lotta smoke around him rn, will be interested to see if he makes it past this weekend