Roster Building Thread VI (2022-23): Offseason edition

[jerseyjinx94]

Want to have an open mind, but hard to get behind dealing KAM, who should be extended for max so as to minimize long term cap hit, 8 x 6.25.

No on giving Kane anything now, let him heal, sign with us as UFA late.

that's for starters

Miller would not sign an 8x6.25 deal. He’ll want 2-3 years and a chance to breakout so he gets big money with a larger cap. It’s not like the Rangers get to assign money to certain guys.

If Miller would sign that deal, you lock it in and make the rest work.

15 pounds is A LOT but i agree with play style being more of a thing here than anything.

That’s not a lot when it’s the difference between the heaviest (1st) and lightest (32). That means all 32 teams are within 15 pounds.

Cooley this season IS a pipe dream
We can make a deal now, and plant a seed for later, but it should be Sykora + BMB +, not Chytil crazy overpay.
Two good close to ready prospects + could get it done
Price goes down if we gamble on only his rights, not a signed and trade elc

Arizona is not trading Cooley for BMB+Sykora plus other prospects. They’ll want a true value piece. What would entice them is a 23 year old with term on the verge of a breakout, not 5-6 wildcard B level prospects who may or may not play in the league

 

[bernmeister]

So there is absolutely no entertaining trading Miller, who has clear braindead moments defensively that may never be course corrected in his development, for high drafts picks, specifically a 1st round pick in one of the deepest drafts in two decades, and then repurposing that money in other areas? This isn’t Adam Fox coming off a Norris Trophy season.
....

It is fair to raise this ?.
I would not say as you do his lapses -- presuming that charge is accurate -- "may never be course corrected" going forward.

So as a rule, no.
Exception to the rule:
If we really want to gamble, if LA went there, have to consider basically Byfield for Miller

 

[jerseyjinx94]

He was just as bad for Vegas this year as he was for the Rangers.

Didn’t follow that closely, but the player I saw in the playoffs was worlds better than the one I saw with the Rangers

 

[Fitzy]

Miller would not sign an 8x6.25 deal. He’ll want 2-3 years and a chance to breakout so he gets big money with a larger cap. It’s not like the Rangers get to assign money to certain guys.

If Miller would sign that deal, you lock it in and make the rest work.


That’s not a lot when it’s the difference between the heaviest (1st) and lightest (32). That means all 32 teams are within 15 pounds.

Really can't say this definitively. It's a gamble for both sides. But if he was offered that number today I think, given how often injuries and other issues can derail a career, he'd take the money.

If the kid becomes a star I have to imagine he could make some money on the side with promotions.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Really can't say this definitively. It's a gamble for both sides. But if he was offered that number today I think, given how often injuries and other issues can derail a career, he'd take the money.

If the kid becomes a star I have to imagine he could make some money on the side with promotions.

An 8 year deal would end when he’s 31, if he breaks out he then has another shot at a huge ufa contract.
I don’t see that being a concern.

 

[bernmeister]

Hopefully. Drury and Laviolette can hire a competent assistant coach who can work with the defenseman. Give Jones an opportunity to play and raise his value for a trade. Fatten up the goose. Spot Jones on the PP. Give them an opportunity to produce. Put him in a position to succeed. You can't win with these little defenseman. The Rangers need to get more out of Miller and Schneider. Robertson is a big boy. It would nice if the Rangers gave him an opportunity at some point next season.

Vegas has these big, long and rangy defenseman. TB was built that way. The Blues. Even the Habs team which lost to TB had Weber, Chiarot, Edmundson and Petry.

Barbashev was tremendous for Vegas. Cassidy put him on the top line with Eichel and Marcessault. Barbashev ended up being the best rental. Not Kane or Tarasenko or ROR. Barbashev. Big hits. Big goals.

Drury needs to worry about adding bottom six players. Quality bottom six players and not guys who dress for the games or fill a roster spot.

View attachment 717840

As usual, @RangerBoy and yours truly are in agreement.
Re: the bold, yes, but I specify Kid line needs to be 2nd or even 1st line.
Kreid + Zib can stay top 6
Bread drop to 3rd line where he deserves to be.

W/that in mind, improve bottom 6

 

[bernmeister]

The Rangers are a big team.

The difference between the heaviest and lightest teams is 15 pounds.

The difference between the tallest and shortest team in the league is 1.5 inches. One point five.

If you wanna talk about play-style, and which teams play "heavy," I'll hear that out.

If we're gonna bring height and weight into it, I'm going to politely remind you that NHL teams are all effectively the same size.

Any other variable aside, and yes, there are freak exceptions to the rule, but:
mo height usually = better reach.

Reach is a valuable consideration.
Not everything, but not to be ignored.

Don't bother signing all those guys. Thats a waste. Let our own players come in and play. It will benefit the Org more than signing Bertuzzi, Acciari and Kane to overpriced contracts that they wont fulfill. f*** that.

Trading for Garland isnt bad. And if we move Panarin, which I still doubt, why not just keep Goodrow? He is a good 4th liner and its not like we would need the cap at that point. Also, you arent getting Reinhart. You'll get Duclair, Smith, Knight and their 2nd this year. Maybe also a prospect.

Laf-Z-K
Duke-Chytil-Garland
Kreider-Trocheck-Vesey
Cuylle-Brod-Goodrow

Yes, board the bern train, stop the failed win now bs

 

[bernmeister]

Miller would not sign an 8x6.25 deal. He’ll want 2-3 years and a chance to breakout so he gets big money with a larger cap. It’s not like the Rangers get to assign money to certain guys.

If Miller would sign that deal, you lock it in and make the rest work.
....
Arizona is not trading Cooley for BMB+Sykora plus other prospects. They’ll want a true value piece. What would entice them is a 23 year old with term on the verge of a breakout, not 5-6 wildcard B level prospects who may or may not play in the league

KAM might/might not do it.
He is getting 50 mil guaranteed now AND he is setting up for an even larger payday by waiting and upping his production/track record.
Also, in theory R mgmt eff ups notwithstanding, kid line + some additional good pieces = worth a 4-5 year + min shot which = most of his 8 yrs term
_______________________
I had mo pieces in that deal, but fair enuf to say, obv, how good are Syk + BMB.
They are getting that now, contributing perhaps as early as this season
I am cautiously optimistic they will be good.
Stellar, at this pt = a reach, but yes, good.

 

[Savant]

Alright, let me just try to put this to bed right now.

View attachment 717882

Guys, Brett Howden still sucks. His defense has improved to the point where he's a passable 4th liner. Good for him.

In the playoffs, he ran into a hot streak playing with one of the best 5v5 forwards in the world.

Also if you look at his pre-Mark Stone line Vegas numbers they are also terrible

 

[duhmetreE]

this is where I'm at. This roster is gonna get another chance with a few tweaks.
-Garand is just a placeholder

If Lavi wants a 'checking line' it could be Kreider Trocheck Engvall

Fast could be a substitute for Engvall

 

[Avery16]

Alright, let me just try to put this to bed right now.

View attachment 717882

Guys, Brett Howden still sucks. His defense has improved to the point where he's a passable 4th liner. Good for him.

In the playoffs, he ran into a hot streak playing with one of the best 5v5 forwards in the world.

k, now do this one.

 

[Machinehead]

k, now do this one.
View attachment 717895

We should have given him a chance.

Three other franchises should have as well.

 

[Machinehead]

If you ran this playoffs in a simulation 100 times Vegas wins the cup maybe 10 at most.

There's just too much random error in the playoffs to try to emulate every cup winning team.

This.

Just be a quality 5v5 team so you're at least throwing your ball into the roulette.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

F Tom Wilson.

 

[surlysailor]

k, now do this one.
View attachment 717895

Didn't the Rangers actually try to sign him after his AHL deal? IIRC they tried to, but he like his chances of making the NYR the next season which is why he eventually went to CBJ because they didn't have a lot of roster spots filled out.

 

[Avery16]

Didn't the Rangers actually try to sign him after his AHL deal? IIRC they tried to, but he like his chances of making the NYR the next season which is why he eventually went to CBJ because they didn't have a lot of roster spots filled out.

He wasn’t cracking the roster as long as Torts was coach.

 

[MrAlmost]

k, now do this one.
View attachment 717895

That one isn't fair. The Rangers offered him a contract. He just didn't accept it. Likely cause he thought Torts wouldnt give him a chance, which is probably true.

 

[Avery16]

That one isn't fair. The Rangers offered him a contract. He just didn't accept it. Likely cause he thought Torts wouldnt give him a chance, which is probably true.

I think it’s fair to criticize personnel decisions (like what coach to hire) an org makes.

 

[bhamill]

Wait....what does fighting have to do with anything?

And i dont want Mika or Panarin fighting...it would be stupid for them to be in the box when they are needed on the ice. Leaders dont have to fight or have a mean streak to be leaders.....

Laf sticks up for teammates, hits, and gets involved. Trocheck is the only forward that had more hits than Laf last year. 3 fights, all of them sticking up for teammates, not about himself, in three seasons is not spending an inordinate amount of time in the box.

Lafy’s value is not that high.

Which is why its an extremely dumb time to trade him.

 

[MrAlmost]

I think it’s fair to criticize personnel decisions (like what coach to hire) an org makes.

Yeah I agree. But we didn't let JAM get away. He was offered a contract. He said no. You cant force someone to sign with you. We traded away Howden. And Weight. And Amonte. And Sandstrom. And Granato. Etc.

Trading away young players too early is our MO for sure, but JAM walked. Can't blame the org for that. Cant blame the Lightning either. They played him and he walked there too. Now the Panthers, they really shit the bed on that one. He broke out with them and they still let him go for nothing.

 

[Fitzy]

Marchessault is just one of those really interesting late bloomer stories.

If Vegas doesn't fumble Shipachyov out of the gate who knows where he ends up.

Easy for us non-youths to forget it was over a decade ago now that he was 'in the organization'

 

[effen]

Two biggest things are going to be if the vets are ashamed of their performance to give a shit a little bit more and if Laviolette has the stones to bench them when they're stinking up the joint.

It's not a hard game, but it is when the best players want to flee to the side boards and make themselves easy to defend instead of going in the hard areas often.

 

[Fitzy]

Two biggest things are going to be if the vets are ashamed of their performance to give a shit a little bit more and if Laviolette has the stones to bench them when they're stinking up the joint.

It's not a hard game, but it is when the best players want to flee to the side boards and make themselves easy to defend instead of going in the hard areas often.

We can start by going back to playing a grinder with Panarin, esp if his center isn’t gonna be Trocheck.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

We can start by going back to playing a grinder with Panarin, esp if his center isn’t gonna be Trocheck.

It's not going to make a difference unless Panarin either starts to rim the puck around the walls when nothing is there or reverts back to year 1 form where he's getting to the middle of the ice himself. Resetting is a concept that is foreign to Artemi and he didn't really do it when he was great either (because he didn't need to. Passing lanes opened up for him because he made them open up. He can't do that anymore.)

OTOH, theres nothing more overrated than the supposed "impact" he that a good "grinder" had on Panarin other than the impact that Strome had on Panarin. Now would it be beneficial for him moving forward? Yeah, but he has to be willing to feed into that.

 

[n8]

Marchessault is just one of those really interesting late bloomer stories.

If Vegas doesn't fumble Shipachyov out of the gate who knows where he ends up.

Easy for us non-youths to forget it was over a decade ago now that he was 'in the organization'

I guess March is now full-on our Martin St Louis and we're Calgary.