Roster Building Thread VI (2022-23): Offseason edition

[RGY]

1) Goodrow will never waive for Arizona
2) Miller will need to return more than a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. 12th overall isn’t good enough for a sure fire top 4 D that just scored over 40 points with no PP time and is only 23.
3) That D corps is atrocious

1) You’re probably right about Goodrow. But I see him going somewhere or bought out.

2) I am happy to get more for Miller, but I am also trying to look at this objectively. Were talking about a young defenseman who while he put up 40 points with no PP time, still has deficiencies in the defensive side of his game. The 12th overall pick in this particular draft is going to be very good prospect. Get the 2nd round pick to be a 2023 and change the 3rd rd pick to a top prospect. Then maybe? There is also the trade-off of what you can do with the money, who you can now sign.

3) I don’t think that D is atrocious. I like what I saw from Mikkola. I think he would handle the Top 4 just fine. Skates rather well. I agree Jones is concerning.

 

[DanielBrassard]

There are two things Lav has to do and one of them is keep Fox and Lindgren together.

The other is convincing fast to come back

 

[RangerBoy]

Hopefully. Drury and Laviolette can hire a competent assistant coach who can work with the defenseman. Give Jones an opportunity to play and raise his value for a trade. Fatten up the goose. Spot Jones on the PP. Give them an opportunity to produce. Put him in a position to succeed. You can't win with these little defenseman. The Rangers need to get more out of Miller and Schneider. Robertson is a big boy. It would nice if the Rangers gave him an opportunity at some point next season.

Vegas has these big, long and rangy defenseman. TB was built that way. The Blues. Even the Habs team which lost to TB had Weber, Chiarot, Edmundson and Petry.

Barbashev was tremendous for Vegas. Cassidy put him on the top line with Eichel and Marcessault. Barbashev ended up being the best rental. Not Kane or Tarasenko or ROR. Barbashev. Big hits. Big goals.

Drury needs to worry about adding bottom six players. Quality bottom six players and not guys who dress for the games or fill a roster spot.

 

[McRanger92]

Hopefully. Drury and Laviolette can hire a competent assistant coach who can work with the defenseman. Give Jones an opportunity to play and raise his value for a trade. Fatten up the goose. Spot Jones on the PP. Give them an opportunity to produce. Put him in a position to succeed. You can't win with these little defenseman. The Rangers need to get more out of Miller and Schneider. Robertson is a big boy. It would nice if the Rangers gave him an opportunity at some point next season.

Vegas has these big, long and rangy defenseman. TB was built that way. The Blues. Even the Habs team which lost to TB had Weber, Chiarot, Edmundson and Petry.

Barbashev was tremendous for Vegas. Cassidy put him on the top line with Eichel and Marcessault. Barbashev ended up being the best rental. Not Kane or Tarasenko or ROR. Barbashev. Big hits. Big goals.

Drury needs to worry about adding bottom six players. Quality bottom six players and not guys who dress for the games or fill a roster spot.

View attachment 717840

Hathaway/Fast/Sheary types. We can maybe sign more than 1 if the players pay off the escrow and the cap goes up 3 mil. Add Cuylle/Othman to the big club. Robertson and Jones can rotate on D. Edstrom/Sykora/Berard could provide energy on the lower lines as the season goes on. I’d love Wilson but it’s a pipe dream. We know they’ll add at the deadline if they’re in the mix (they will be).

 

[mike14]

Hopefully. Drury and Laviolette can hire a competent assistant coach who can work with the defenseman. Give Jones an opportunity to play and raise his value for a trade. Fatten up the goose. Spot Jones on the PP. Give them an opportunity to produce. Put him in a position to succeed. You can't win with these little defenseman. The Rangers need to get more out of Miller and Schneider. Robertson is a big boy. It would nice if the Rangers gave him an opportunity at some point next season.

Vegas has these big, long and rangy defenseman. TB was built that way. The Blues. Even the Habs team which lost to TB had Weber, Chiarot, Edmundson and Petry.

Barbashev was tremendous for Vegas. Cassidy put him on the top line with Eichel and Marcessault. Barbashev ended up being the best rental. Not Kane or Tarasenko or ROR. Barbashev. Big hits. Big goals.

Drury needs to worry about adding bottom six players. Quality bottom six players and not guys who dress for the games or fill a roster spot.

View attachment 717840

NYR Defencemen, leaving out 6-6 231 Harpur...

Fox 5-11 182
Lindgren 6-0 190 (Theodore - this one is a bit off)
Mikkola 6-4 209 (Whitecloud)
Miller 6-5 215 (McNabb)
Schneider 6-3 208 (Martinez)
Trouba 6-3 203

Fox/Hague is the only standout difference really, and seeing as basically no-one else in the NHL can do what he does, who cares?
Our D are big enough and heavy enough (especially when you factor in that KAM and Schneider are still developing), they just don't move the puck well enough and suffered from a lack of structure and puck support from the forwards

 

[NYR Viper]

NYR Defencemen, leaving out 6-6 231 Harpur...

Fox 5-11 182
Lindgren 6-0 190 (Theodore - this one is a bit off)
Mikkola 6-4 209 (Whitecloud)
Miller 6-5 215 (McNabb)
Schneider 6-3 208 (Martinez)
Trouba 6-3 203

Fox/Hague is the only standout difference really, and seeing as basically no-one else in the NHL can do what he does, who cares?
Our D are big enough and heavy enough (especially when you factor in that KAM and Schneider are still developing), they just don't move the puck well enough and suffered from a lack of structure and puck support from the forwards

If you sub Jones for Mikkola it looks less similar. I think that was his point.

 

[Avery16]

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

saying you have to win with big lugs of defensemen is f***ing nonsense

Colorado won last year with Girard and Makar

There’s more than one way to win. Jones should be in over Robertson, they need someone who can move the puck on the left

 

[Savant]

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Too bad we didn’t have Mark Stone to play with him

 

[jerseyjinx94]

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Kid was rushed by the Rangers. He was terrible here.

But he’s developed in Vegas into a solid NHLer. Doesn’t change that he was awful with the Rangers.

 

[Machinehead]

Wild seeing the name Brad Richards this morning

 

[Machinehead]

Alright, let me just try to put this to bed right now.

Guys, Brett Howden still sucks. His defense has improved to the point where he's a passable 4th liner. Good for him.

In the playoffs, he ran into a hot streak playing with one of the best 5v5 forwards in the world.

 

[Leonardo87]

Alright, let me just try to put this to bed right now.

View attachment 717882

Guys, Brett Howden still sucks. His defense has improved to the point where he's a passable 4th liner. Good for him.

In the playoffs, he ran into a hot streak playing with one of the best 5v5 forwards in the world.

I don’t think anyone here is saying he is good. Passable is a good word to use. He is on a Vegas team with depth and they utilized him better than the Rangers. It’s not like he is a Top 6 or even Top 9 player.

I think it also goes to show how underrated Mark Stone is who got some criticism over the years, probably because of his health.

 

[Mac n Gs]

saying you have to win with big lugs of defensemen is f***ing nonsense

Colorado won last year with Girard and Makar

There’s more than one way to win. Jones should be in over Robertson, they need someone who can move the puck on the left

I mean, Makar kind of transcends that point because he’s one of the best dmen in the league. Fox fits into that category too

Girard was their least played dmen during their run last year, and they’ve been trying to move him for the last year or so. I don’t think anyone is saying you need goons back there, but it does make sense that size/skill on the backend to help clog up the slot is a key to winning in the playoffs. You just can’t have your size/skill be wasted on guys like Hajek/Harpur

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Rangers need a PMD way more than they need another rangy D, even if said rangy D is actually a good defender.

Systems tweaks should help here (shorter passes, more forward support, etc) but unless they're getting a long guy who is at least competent to above average as a puck mover, they should probably focus on giving Jones a go.

The Vegas D isn't really any better than what we have and Fox is the best D in both groups by a lot. The Mikkola/Braun or (what I'm fearful of) Irwin types need to be avoided.

People wanted to point to a lack of transition as the issue with this team (and it was one of them) but they didn't exactly do a great job with the puck when they had it outside of their own end. To be thats the biggest thing that needs to change and its the much harder thing to fix.

As far as UFA's go - I love Orlov (he'll cost too much) but two cheap buys on my radar with be Erik Gustafsson and Connor Brown. You could probably get both for around what they're paying Goodrow.

It'd be a lot easier to mold this team if they had an additional 11.6 million to work with but here we are.

 

[Machinehead]

The Rangers are a big team.

The difference between the heaviest and lightest teams is 15 pounds.

The difference between the tallest and shortest team in the league is 1.5 inches. One point five.

If you wanna talk about play-style, and which teams play "heavy," I'll hear that out.

If we're gonna bring height and weight into it, I'm going to politely remind you that NHL teams are all effectively the same size.

 

[Machinehead]

I don’t think anyone here is saying he is good. Passable is a good word to use. He is on a Vegas team with depth and they utilized him better than the Rangers. It’s not like he is a Top 6 or even Top 9 player.

I think it also goes to show how underrated Mark Stone is who got some criticism over the years, probably because of his health.

That's fair. The Rangers couldn't utilize a knife and fork.

 

[MrAlmost]

Reinhardt + Knight + FLA 1st ‘24

Trade Reinhardt to Dallas for their 1st ‘23

Sign Kane, Bertuzzi and trade for Garland.

Lafreniere-Zibanejad-Kaako
Kreider-Chytil-Garland
Bertuzzi-Trochek-Kane
Motte-Acciari-Vesey

Miller-Fox
Jones-Trouba
Lindgren-Schneider

Shesty
Domingue

Knight on LTIR or substance abuse if not there yet

Don't bother signing all those guys. Thats a waste. Let our own players come in and play. It will benefit the Org more than signing Bertuzzi, Acciari and Kane to overpriced contracts that they wont fulfill. f*** that.

Trading for Garland isnt bad. And if we move Panarin, which I still doubt, why not just keep Goodrow? He is a good 4th liner and its not like we would need the cap at that point. Also, you arent getting Reinhart. You'll get Duclair, Smith, Knight and their 2nd this year. Maybe also a prospect.

Laf-Z-K
Duke-Chytil-Garland
Kreider-Trocheck-Vesey
Cuylle-Brod-Goodrow

 

[Fitzy]

If you ran this playoffs in a simulation 100 times Vegas wins the cup maybe 10 at most.

There's just too much random error in the playoffs to try to emulate every cup winning team.

 

[surlysailor]

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I like the idea of selling Miller to recoup draft pick assets. I think there would be a ton of interest and you recoup that level of draft picks for him. I would take the saved money and bring back Tarasenko and Mikkola. Tarasenko may be looking for $5.5-$6 but maybe he shaves off some numbers for a discount to stay in a place he loved and with his buddy.

You can roll with Zac Jones or sign a cheap LHD for the 3rd pair. Or both, the Vet being insurance. I dont want to see Harpur as that cheap LHD.

Othmann slides in at 3RW and provides some of that edge we are looking for.

Cuylle gets promoted. I would love to have Motte back as insurance there but likely cannot afford the luxury of both. Maybe Cuylle starts in the AHL and Motte has that spot.

Acciari and Raanta are interchangeable with other free agent options. Whomever comes at the best price. There is also the option of Domingue but that is not a reliable option and you can get a backup in FA at a reasonable price.

The last portion is Kane and LTIR him. I think you can get him at that AAV. I admittedly don’t know how the cap implications would workout. Are the Rangers banking space daily so that when Kane is ready in what sounds like will be January, will the Rangers have accrued cap space to add him. He would bump someone down. Maybe Othmann goes to the AHL to finish the season.

There is maneuverability if the Rangers want to pursue certain avenues.

Oof not a fan of that top 4. Mikkola was fine as a stop gap while Lindgren was out but he gives me serious B. Smith vibes. Great on the short term but once he's here for a full season everyone will start picking apart his game and will see he's a 5/6 d men at best(and most likely overpaid as a FA). Miller had a few bad weeks after his suspension but he was a beast for the rest of the season. He's only 23 and still growing, and the odds of him getting better instead of worse is much better vs the opposite. Lindgren should be the guy you should move for picks. Teams will love his effort and his gritty style, but I don't see him eventually becoming Girardi 2.0. I see him becoming more injury prone and eventually those injuries slowing him down. Also now everyone wants big D because of Vegas & Fl and we're getting rid of a 6'4 defenseman who can actually skate well? I say give him time away from Trouba (or at least a fully healthy Trouba) and I think his game will flourish.

Also I doubt NYR are moving anyone for picks/prospects. They're in win now mode. As much as I would like another first round pick or a Cooley, unless they're going to make an impact next season NYR are short sighted and only worries about next season. Which I think is the wrong move but the pressure is def on Drury now.

 

[SA16]

Kid was rushed by the Rangers. He was terrible here.

But he’s developed in Vegas into a solid NHLer. Doesn’t change that he was awful with the Rangers.

He was just as bad for Vegas this year as he was for the Rangers.

 

[bernmeister]

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I like the idea of selling Miller to recoup draft pick assets. I think there would be a ton of interest and you recoup that level of draft picks for him. I would take the saved money and bring back Tarasenko and Mikkola. Tarasenko may be looking for $5.5-$6 but maybe he shaves off some numbers for a discount to stay in a place he loved and with his buddy.

You can roll with Zac Jones or sign a cheap LHD for the 3rd pair. Or both, the Vet being insurance. I dont want to see Harpur as that cheap LHD.

Othmann slides in at 3RW and provides some of that edge we are looking for.

Cuylle gets promoted. I would love to have Motte back as insurance there but likely cannot afford the luxury of both. Maybe Cuylle starts in the AHL and Motte has that spot.

Acciari and Raanta are interchangeable with other free agent options. Whomever comes at the best price. There is also the option of Domingue but that is not a reliable option and you can get a backup in FA at a reasonable price.

The last portion is Kane and LTIR him. I think you can get him at that AAV. I admittedly don’t know how the cap implications would workout. Are the Rangers banking space daily so that when Kane is ready in what sounds like will be January, will the Rangers have accrued cap space to add him. He would bump someone down. Maybe Othmann goes to the AHL to finish the season.

There is maneuverability if the Rangers want to pursue certain avenues.

Want to have an open mind, but hard to get behind dealing KAM, who should be extended for max so as to minimize long term cap hit, 8 x 6.25.

No on giving Kane anything now, let him heal, sign with us as UFA late.

that's for starters

 

[bernmeister]

It's all a pipe dream at this point - the kid said he wanted to stay in college and finally win a championship. From what I read, the question kind of steered him into saying the situation in Arizona played a part in the decision but I gathered that it's more about winning an NCAA championship than it is about refusing to play for the Coyotes. This has, probably, at least another year+ to play out and likely a big nothing burger that will never turn into Cooley being a New York Ranger.

Cooley this season IS a pipe dream
We can make a deal now, and plant a seed for later, but it should be Sykora + BMB +, not Chytil crazy overpay.
Two good close to ready prospects + could get it done
Price goes down if we gamble on only his rights, not a signed and trade elc

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Hopefully. Drury and Laviolette can hire a competent assistant coach who can work with the defenseman. Give Jones an opportunity to play and raise his value for a trade. Fatten up the goose. Spot Jones on the PP. Give them an opportunity to produce. Put him in a position to succeed. You can't win with these little defenseman. The Rangers need to get more out of Miller and Schneider. Robertson is a big boy. It would nice if the Rangers gave him an opportunity at some point next season.

Vegas has these big, long and rangy defenseman. TB was built that way. The Blues. Even the Habs team which lost to TB had Weber, Chiarot, Edmundson and Petry.

Barbashev was tremendous for Vegas. Cassidy put him on the top line with Eichel and Marcessault. Barbashev ended up being the best rental. Not Kane or Tarasenko or ROR. Barbashev. Big hits. Big goals.

Drury needs to worry about adding bottom six players. Quality bottom six players and not guys who dress for the games or fill a roster spot.

View attachment 717840

The thing is every year people do this. Your post is well reasoned. But you just need the best players to play and get opportunities. The Rangers get obsessed with these things and play Harpur over Jones, for example. If Jones is the better player, play him. Don’t force players in because they’re big.

What is Jones value in a trade? I would consider moving him for 2 2nds. Maybe a 2nd and a 3rd. I think Seattle may be a good fit, they’ll be looking for young defensemen that don’t break the bank. But I’d rather just give him 950K and give him a true chance to play, as you said.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

The Rangers are a big team.

The difference between the heaviest and lightest teams is 15 pounds.

The difference between the tallest and shortest team in the league is 1.5 inches. One point five.

If you wanna talk about play-style, and which teams play "heavy," I'll hear that out.

If we're gonna bring height and weight into it, I'm going to politely remind you that NHL teams are all effectively the same size.

15 pounds is A LOT but i agree with play style being more of a thing here than anything.