Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXXII

[duhmetreE]

I think you're not wrong that there are probably some things that can adjusted within the system, but I'm not sure how you can say talent isn't an issue. Right now the Rangers have 4 legitimate top 6 forwards, a 3rd line that struggles to produce and a 4th line that hasn't been all that effective since the beginning of the season.

I didn’t say talent isn’t an issue.

 

[TheDirtyH]

The only teams in the East that really worry me are the 2 Florida teams and Carolina.

Everyone else can be had. Toronto is good too but I'll believe they get over the playoff hump when I see it.

Washington and Pittsburgh haven't dropped off, and Boston is still playing very well.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

If Vancouver wants Schneider, I want Pettersson.

 

[mas0764]

You identified 5-6 as teams that should go for it. If someone is going for it they should add no? That is the context that we have been discussing for days. Now you are trying to squirm back and avoid having to provide anything substantial to back your position.

I will make it even easier for you, forgot the 5-6, which teams 0, 1, 3, 10?) do you think are justified in the nhl to add this year?

I never identified 5-6 teams that should go for it. I said I do not think we are in the top 5-6 teams in the league and therefore I do not think WE should go for it. I said if we WERE in that top 5-6 teams I would think it would be easier to justify going for it.

But of those 5-6 teams who make up the top class of the league, in which I do not think we are currently in, I am not analyzing each of them as to whether or not any of them should be buyers or sellers.

Again, I'm not getting drawn into a debate with you of giving you a hard list of team names and then going through them one by one as to whether they should buy or sell or whether we are on par with them or not.

I do not think we are in the elite group of teams in this league. I would wager that group is probably about 5-6 teams big. Tampa is certainly in it, and they will stand in our way. I'm not interested in getting into the details of whether a team like Florida checks more boxes than us or should buy or sell. I'm not analyzing them, I'm analyzing the Rangers.

 

[mas0764]

If Vancouver wants Schneider, I want Pettersson.

I'd pay a hefty sum for him. Though it also means we probably have to move out Kreider or Trouba because I don't think letting Strome walk frees up enough space.

 

[mas0764]

Maybe I'm wrong but I think we can look at the Yandle to NYR as parameters for this deal. So something like:

conditional 1,
2nd round pick (better of the NYR or STL pick)
Jones/Lundkvist/Cuylle = Duclair (Higher end, not elite prospect)
Chytil/Barron/Gauthier=Moore (Young NHL player).

Not saying I'd do that but I think something like maybe less gets it done, esp if there's cap retention

Who is this package supposed to be bringing us?

 

[TheBloodyNine]

VGK and CAR too.

Yes, absolutely.

 

[NYR Viper]

To repeat what I said earlier, here's the long term outlook we need to focus on (and I'm not saying these will be the exact lines, just a guideline):

Lafreniere - Zibanejad - Kakko
Panarin - Young Center - Kravtsov
Young winger - Young Center - Chytil
4th Line WGAS

Miller - Fox
Jones - Schneider
Robertson - Lundkvist

There is your winner in 3-4 years from now.

Chase that. Fill in those blanks.

Win 2 Cups. Enjoy.

I think you have some pieces missing that are already here. Goodrow is either 3rd line LW or Center. So one of those spots is filled. I'm not sure Chytil is going to be around long-term here if he doesn't develop as a center. Too many good wingers coming.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

I don't necessarily disagree with those teams, and I would add Vegas, but every one of those teams has at least one glaring issue if not multiple glaring issues on the roster. I'm thrilled that Florida can score nine goals in a game, but we saw what happens in the playoffs. They need goaltending, and when other teams tighten up goals don't come as easily as they do during the regular season. Same exact thing can be said for Colorado. Out of that group you listed Tampa probably has the best chance to win simply because of their goalie, and that's where Igor is such a huge piece. When he's playing like he's capable of you actually expect him to shut down the other team the entire game and you're surprised when the other team scores. People can claim all they want that you can't plan for that, but when you have a goalie as good as Igor or vaz (I'm not suggesting that they're equals at this point) You have a great equalizer that can completely change everything. There's really no other elite level contenders that have that kind of goaltending at their disposal

The difference between Tampa and the Rangers is that they have that elite G, elite D and they also have an elite F. The Rangers have a ways to go in the latter two departments and nothing Igor does in the postseason is going to make up the difference in that. Colorado and Florida can certainly go out and address the one issue they have. There's no one player out there that is going to change the Rangers current issues in my opinion.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Just as an observation, Miller has played some of his best hockey with Petersson. The Rangers have a player in Kravtsov who plays somewhat similar in style to Petersson.

I don’t want Bozo but playing devils advocate.. Pettersson was also a winger in Europe, turned center. Bozo often takes faceoffs for Pettersson. Perhaps Bozo could be a good winger alongside Krav switching to center, he could take faceoffs for him as he adjusts to center

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

I'd pay a hefty sum for him. Though it also means we probably have to move out Kreider or Trouba because I don't think letting Strome walk frees up enough space.

Agree, most likely the package includes Schneider and Chytil(couple mil)+ more assets. Would still have more work to do but $7.3M for the next couple years should be workable.

 

[Avery16]

could be interesting, those rosters from 2002-2004 were like some weird Frankenstein team.

Holik blames the FO.

 

[Avery16]

Gemel Smith on waivers.

 

[duhmetreE]

Looks like Barron is getting kicked to the curb already.

We need to get rid of some of the deadweight or put them on the taxi squad.

 

[LORDE]

DP

 

[EdJovanovski]

 

[bleedblue94]

I never identified 5-6 teams that should go for it. I said I do not think we are in the top 5-6 teams in the league and therefore I do not think WE should go for it. I said if we WERE in that top 5-6 teams I would think it would be easier to justify going for it.

But of those 5-6 teams who make up the top class of the league, in which I do not think we are currently in, I am not analyzing each of them as to whether or not any of them should be buyers or sellers.

Again, I'm not getting drawn into a debate with you of giving you a hard list of team names and then going through them one by one as to whether they should buy or sell or whether we are on par with them or not.

I do not think we are in the elite group of teams in this league. I would wager that group is probably about 5-6 teams big. Tampa is certainly in it, and they will stand in our way. I'm not interested in getting into the details of whether a team like Florida checks more boxes than us or should buy or sell. I'm not analyzing them, I'm analyzing the Rangers.

so you wont get into any details but you will keep throw around vague numbers and statements that you wont actually back up.

saying there are 5-6 teams who make up the top class of the league and then trying to avoid saying which teams if any in the league you think should go for it is more of the same. You like making statements with no substance, and claiming you dont want to get into a debate is foolish when that's what you have been doing with me, debating. I have made statements that have something behind them and you keep throwing this vague crap around. You want to take a (vague) stand on something and in the same paragraph even say you dont want to analyze things.

I again ask for you to identify any number of teams (0, 1, 4, 20) that you think are justified in going for it this year. The fact you are avoiding even naming one is pretty comical. You wont "debate," yet you keep spending more time trying to justify not answer questions.

One hand you say that there's five or six teams that are better positioned than the rangers to make a run this year and because of that the rangers can't justify making adds, and then try to avoid identifying those teams 5-6 teams.

 

[Chalfdiggity3]

Maybe I'm wrong but I think a Miller deal would look similar to the Yandle to NYR as parameters for this deal. So something like:

conditional 1,
2nd round pick (better of the NYR or STL pick)
Jones/Lundkvist/Cuylle = Duclair (Higher end, not elite prospect)
Chytil/Barron/Gauthier=Moore (Young NHL player).

Not saying I'd do that but I think something like maybe less gets it done, esp if there's cap retention

Jones/Nils/Cuylle will not be traded for JT miller. Can we stop offering our best prospects for this scrub.

 

[bleedblue94]

The difference between Tampa and the Rangers is that they have that elite G, elite D and they also have an elite F. The Rangers have a ways to go in the latter two departments and nothing Igor does in the postseason is going to make up the difference in that. Colorado and Florida can certainly go out and address the one issue they have. There's no one player out there that is going to change the Rangers current issues in my opinion.

I'm not sure tb has elite d at this point. They have one elite guy, and one that plays elite in the playoffs, but defenses made up of bogosian, sustr, schenn, etc even with sergachev there are still full of holes. You ride your horses in the playoffs, and you need them to play like horses.

 

[LORDE]

I'm not sure those two cores are at all comparable. Like if you line them up side by side do you really think any of the rosters from the henke era compares to now? I don't at all, today's team would absolutely beat the pants off of the teams from that era

That wasn't my point at all. My point was that we never had a team that was all there at the same time... Hank was great but he never had a full team in front of him at once.

Very similar in the timing, or lack of... with this 2 distinct core situation.

While our elite and high priced talent are ready (along w Fox and Shesty) the kids aren't and when the kids are (hopefully) will Kreider, Trouba, Zbad and Panarin be as good? Elite?

This is why I was against Panarin in the 1st place... not that I think ANYONE is upset at him on this team... but the timing wasn't right to get him as it pried open the window pre-maturely.

 

[Mac n Gs]

To be honest, Larkin is all about whether or not he wants to be part of the long rebuild that will still be going on for a few more years. Larkin is in his prime, i understand he is a detriot boy and all that jazz, but lets be real, if you were 25 and played on a losing team all your life, IE Eichel, you dont think that Larkin would like to take his talent elsewhere in order to win a cup? Lots of things can still happen

They’re not that far out of a wild card spot right now in a season where they had no business winning this many games. They have some holes to fix on the roster, but their young guys have been great, and they have a pretty strong group of young players that’ll be their next core. Plus, they’ve already made a ton of top picks and have made some really good later round choices that are doing well in their respective leagues.

I think they’ll surprise a lot of people at how quickly they’ll become competitive. They have a ton of cap flexibility too

 

[KOVALEV022473]

That wasn't my point at all. My point was that we never had a team that was all there at the same time... Hank was great but he never had a full team in front of him at once.

Very similar in the timing, or lack of... with this 2 distinct core situation.

While our elite and high priced talent are ready (along w Fox and Shesty) the kids aren't and when the kids are (hopefully) will Kreider, Trouba, Zbad and Panarin be as good? Elite?

This is why I was against Panarin in the 1st place... not that I think ANYONE is upset at him on this team... but the timing wasn't right to get him as it pried open the window pre-maturely.

I don’t understand this logic at all. What are the chances the Rangers, or any other team will be able to draft a player of Panarin’s caliber? (I realize he was not drafted) still a top four or five player in the league. How many players in the last ten years drafted, even including 1st overalls, that are better than Panarin…two, maybe three?

 

[kovazub94]

So many posters now can't wait to ship Chytil out for a minimum return (mostly rentals). Reminds me of how not long ago Buch was being shipped out at every opportunity.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Today’s Media Availability.
Ryan Reaves, K’Andre Miller an Coach Gerard Gallant.

 

[LORDE]

I don’t understand this logic at all. What are the chances the Rangers, or any other team will be able to draft a player of Panarin’s caliber? (I realize he was not drafted) still a top four or five player in the league.

He is and I think he's amazing and I love seeing him in a NYR sweater doing what he does... but the bottom line is we're wasting some of his best yrs (as we did with Hank) because the rest of the team isn't ready yet. Hopefully he'll still be elite IF/when they are.