Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXXII

[bhamill]

I put 500 on them at the beginning of the season. But I do that every year. I got +4000 so I’m hoping goaltending/special teams can steal us a few rounds and we catch some lighting in a bottle

I wish you the BEST, sir!
I mean I have zero on them and I'd be over the moon myself of course.

 

[jay from jersey]

But we have so far to go to match the Lightning.

In any case, we aren't going to exactly match anyone.

Here's the long term outlook we need to focus on (and I'm not saying these will be the exact lines, just a guideline):

Lafreniere - Zibanejad - Kakko
Panarin - Young Center - Kravtsov
Young winger - Young Center - Chytil
4th Line WGAS

Miller - Fox
Jones - Schneider
Robertson - Lundkvist

There is your winner in 3-4 years from now. But you need Chytil and Kravtsov to stick. You can't run those guys off already; you just maybe need to lower expectations a little. Kravtsov can still be a 40-50 point second line winger. Chytil can be a 40 point third line winger.

As far as "grit," goes the Hunts and Reaves who can't really play otherwise are not important. What you need is sandpaper in that top 9/top 4, but that just means yours stars can't be pushovers. Lafreniere, Kakko and Chytil all have that requisite size, toughness, and edge.

If we had acquired a player like Lundell, he's also the perfect template for a large, tough to knock off the puck, knows how to throw his weight around gritty forward who can also put up offense and play defense all over the ice.

So basically at this point we need two Lundells and then to have some of Othmann, Berard, Panjuniemi, Barron, and Cuylle fill out the bottom.

We don't need to go get two Nathan MacKinnons in the top 5 of the draft. We need two Lundells picked more like 10-15.

It's not impossible. Figure it out.

But for the love of God don't trade Lundkvist, Schneider, Othmann, Kravtsov, Chytil, first round picks, etc, for players who aren't going to be here to fill out this championship roster.

It’s really tough to say, because we have no idea what guys inside the system can become.
If 1-2 of Berard/Othmann/Cuylle whoever we draft in the next 2 years in the first 2 rd become impact players/point producers, your outlook changes dramatically.
That’s not including any trades we make, players we sign, or undrafted FAs that choose the rangers whether they can make an impact on the team, or have value in trade.
They will def add at this deadline, but I doubt anyone is under the illusion the part with more then 1-2 key so called pieces. Likely not even that.
I’m sure they know the cap situation upcoming better then most, and know the holes that need to be filled over the next 3-4 seasons.
But getting to and winning in the playoffs is good for youth and vets alike

 

[bhamill]

Not saying the Rangers should go all in, but waiting isn't risk-free. Given the Rangers track record of developing forwards, their unused draft picks won't factor for at least another 5 years (if ever). And while their cupboard feels stocked at the moment (Lundvkist, Kravstov, Schneider, Jones, Othmann, Berard, Robertson, Cuylle), odds are that quite a few of these guys are not going to pan out.

Yeah, they flat out won't ALL pan out. In my line of thinking that is why you don't "squander" any. Established players you can keep, or comparable prospects at positions of need that are themselves a bit of a gamble with upside, that's where I would go with it at this point.

 

[McRanger92]

I forgot he has a year left on his deal. Chytil+1st then.

Getting warmer. I think it takes 1 more piece, but that’s where you can fleece a GM hopefully

 

[Boris Zubov]

Getting warmer. I think it takes 1 more piece, but that’s where you can fleece a GM hopefully

Agree. I think we have to assume Kravtsov would be part of any deal.

 

[tlk]

Depth and experience are crucial. At some point soon the Rangers need to stop introducing more kids into the lineup and focus on building experience and expertise.

You can't produce experience out of a magic hat, but you can provide for more depth. As for now, we're riding our top6. And even that is somewhat faulty. 2C, 1/2RW, lower D pairings all have to be solved, the earlier the better before the post season kicks in. Currently, we're just a wildcard team, if not in style (table pos), but in substance.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

I put 500 on them at the beginning of the season. But I do that every year. I got +4000 so I’m hoping goaltending/special teams can steal us a few rounds and we catch some lighting in a bottle

Try not betting on them next season just to see what happens.

 

[McRanger92]

It's fairly clear, at least to me, that Drury believed this organization needed much more of a swagger to itself than what has been present in the past. Adding Goodrow, Blais, Hunt and Reaves has begun that process. Adding Miller who has a similar swagger would make sense. The team's cap crunch will be next year so getting a player who is signed at a reasonable deal for next year makes sense. I like his flexibility in terms of center or wing. I like his physicality as well.

Count me in the minority but I still think the team and Strome come to a mutual agreement on a long term deal that keeps the cap hit down.

If Strome takes a hometown discount and Miller comes in 50% retained, there’s a way to thread the needle with both on the roster this year and next

 

[McRanger92]

I mean, if you step back and forget Miller during his time here, he’s kind of the perfect target for this team. He’s still got one year left on his deal, can slot anywhere in the lineup this year, and easily slots in at 2C next year. He’d also prevent them from giving a long-term deal to Strome and buy them another year for Chytil to figure it out (assuming he isn’t moved). I think that’s where the most value would be in this deal.

I liked Miller during his time here, even though he got incredibly frustrating at the end. If the team is going to make a big move -whether you agree with it or not - getting someone in the same mold as JT Miller does make the most sense. I’m just not sure who else is out there that also has some term and plays C that’s realistically available for trade.

If Detroit continues to fall out of the race, maybe they consider dealing Larkin? Similar player to Miller and has been rumored here before

 

[Raspewtin]

The price for JT is too high for 1.5 years...Drury did not succumb to the Vegas price for Eichel ....this is not the year to go for it.

huge difference between eichel and miller. we likely offered very competitive packages but got shot down for being an east coast team.

 

[bhamill]

If Strome takes a hometown discount and Miller comes in 50% retained, there’s a way to thread the needle with both on the roster this year and next

Or better yet, Van EXTENDS Miller and retains salary on trade. Then some of these overpay packages make sense.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Miller at half retained has made so much sense to me all season, someone like him with a contract that only had another year. Makes so much sense for the Rangers and their cap situation. And allows them to keep Strome if they want to.

 

[McRanger92]

Miller at half retained has made so much sense to me all season, someone like him with a contract that only had another year. Makes so much sense for the Rangers and their cap situation. And allows them to keep Strome if they want to.

Agreed. I’d overpay for them to retain, like the Yandle trade

 

[EdJovanovski]

Protect Kravtsov at all costs

 

[bleedblue94]

Finding a Crosby or McDavid is not going to be possible for us, in all likelihood, true.

This is where (if you bothered to actually read the article) you'll see that there is checklist flexibility, but we still have to get as close as we can to replicating it. Or, if we are short one place, have excess elsewhere.

We are not going to be able to replicate Pittsburgh. There is no way we are going to get a 1-2 down the middle of Crosby-Malkin.

What isn't debatable though is that we are far too short on forward talent. We are too short as we stand here now, and we are too short as projected in the future.

Right, and you talk about the flexibility in the model and you ignore the fact that the rangers check off way more of that list than a lot of other teams. Again which teams in the league right now do you think have legitimate chance to win based on your notions

 

[mas0764]

Right, and you talk about the flexibility in the model and you ignore the fact that the rangers check off way more of that list than a lot of other teams.

I agree they check off way more of that list than "a lot of other teams."

How is that relevant, though?

Yeah, the Rangers are clearly better than approximately 20 other teams in the league. No debate.

They are also clearly worse than 5-6 other teams too.

Again which teams in the league right now do you think have legitimate chance to win based on your notions

If I was a betting man I'd put my money on Tampa again.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Agreed. I’d overpay for them to retain, like the Yandle trade

So would I. Gives you two shots with him at a great number and allows the Rangers to be a bit more flexible in the offseason.

 

[bleedblue94]

Well that is my genuine belief. The team is dogshit at 5 on 5 currently. All the winning is masking that the team is a boring unstructured mess most of the time that has a hard time generating and sustaining offensive pressure.

I don't see any player or two players that turn that around who are available to them.

What we are most missing is another top center, and then the maturation of 2-3 forwards (Kakko, Lafreniere, Chytil/Kravtsov) and 2-3 defenders (Lundkvist, Schneider, Jones/Robertson).

That's our path. All those things need to be accomplished. The team isn't going to turn into a powerhouse that can win a Cup without a good number of improvements from young players.

The problem is by time that happens, and by time they've gotten another top C to play on their second line, Zibanejad and Kreider are not going to be Zibanejad and Kreider anymore.

The team is, as egelband said, unsynced. They think they can have two windows but I think they are wrong.



Having those pieces isn't enough. They need more.



Well then why are you arguing with me?

Let's enjoy the inevitable playoff run and elimination for what it is, and focus on getting another young center and winger in here while we wait on Kakko and Laf and the defenders to mature.

They need more, so they can go trade for it.

There are 31 teams that aren't going to win, and 15 playoff teams that won't win. The odds are NEVER in any team's favor that they will win, even if they have a seemingly perfect roster...

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I'm very doubtful Vancouver has the appetite to retain salary on Miller. Part of the reason they'd be moving on from him is the cap.

 

[Ratelleitlikeitis]

Protect Kravtsov at all costs

I hope there are other Gms who like your thinking.

 

[bleedblue94]

He also said "hey someone is always injured so maybe we can just do that." If our GM said that I'd head for the hills. That's not a way to build a team.

Checking cap friendly they are saying they have currently 5 mill in deadline space, however, that's still not enough to get both Eichel and Martinez back on the team, and not even enough for just Eichel.

Vegas has built their team like a drunken sailor. They've also traded away almost all of their high end young talent that could potentially slot in and replaced guys.

I expect max to get out looooong term. And when eichel is ready I will be shocked if dadanov or reily doesn't have a sprained pinky.

 

[mas0764]

They need more, so they can go trade for it.

There are 31 teams that aren't going to win, and 15 playoff teams that won't win. The odds are NEVER in any team's favor that they will win, even if they have a seemingly perfect roster...

No team is ever a favorite against the field but certain teams certainly have the best odds versus any other particular team. And why trade long term assets when the short term additions aren't likely to swing the odds in your favor substantially?

But that's beside the point. The issue is that there is a clear cut group of teams that have talent edges. While the Rangers have many of the boxes currently checked, indeed perhaps the hardest boxes currently checked, they do not have all the boxes currently checked or even enough of them to be a real threat. This is pretty easily ascertained by observing their 5 on 5 numbers; they simply do not have enough top offensive OR defensively matured talent to tilt the ice in their favor consistently.

They are not there yet. Ergo this is not the year to buy, unless it's for something exceedingly cheap that they will not miss in the future, and what's more, their long term hopes require 2-3 more young forwards who have top 6 potential, including a 1B center.

You want to have fun and enjoy this run, go ahead. No one is saying to be miserable. We are a team on the rise and there's no preventing that. I'm just not putting it on a credit card. And there is still some roster construction to be done.

 

[jay from jersey]

Try not betting on them next season just to see what happens.

Did it last year too. I always put some cash on them at the beginning of the year to make it interesting.
Maybe you can keep telling me how bad they are and have no chance, and I’ll bet those games straight up

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I will say this, as long as the players get along with Kravtsov it would be a huge mistake for Drury not to attempt to get him here, we're talking about giving up assets for scoring wingers here and this guy like him or hate him costs us nothing to have on the team. He needs to play here whether he is a long term fixture here or not. Him not playing NHL games ruins his value and hurts this current team.

 

[jay from jersey]

I wish you the BEST, sir!
I mean I have zero on them and I'd be over the moon myself of course.

Thanks buddy. Obviously, if by some crazy chance they make the finals, I’d hedge a little bit just to make sure I win a nice chunk of change