Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXX

[McRanger92]

Chychrun was/is definitely one of the situations the Rangers have been monitoring for a little while.

A match with Arizona is challenging, and costly, but not impossible either.



This isn't the answer people want to hear, but salary wise you'd probably be looking at Lindgren going elsewhere as opposed to Trouba, and (as previously discussed) Kreider's contract being one that becomes a more frequent (and louder) topic of discussion in the summer.

Does something around Chytil+Kravtsov start the conversation for Chychrun?

 

[Clark Kellogg]

All fine and dandy but it's not the reality we live in. Dolan has made it clear he doesn't want to rebuild anymore. So we can all be Bern and trade every 26+ yr old player for first round picks and prospects and hope they turn into the TBL or we wake up to reality.

Dolan isn't going to let Drury turn a team in 1st place in mid December into a lottery team for a potential cup 5 years from now. Not to mention every GM and owner looks at the Cinderella Habs last year as justification of "just make it to the dance" is an easier pill to swallow then rebuilding for years. At the end of the day owners want profits.

Is this an assumption about Dolan? Or just an axiom?
Dolan firing J.D. and Gorton. Was that about him being embarrassed by his players being pushed around or about losing.
If it’s about losing and the rebuild, please supply a link so I can know what other’s believe to be true.

 

[duhmetreE]

Does something around Chytil+Kravtsov start the conversation for Chychrun?

I would do that but would AZ? Kravtsov not being signed can scare away a lot of teams....

 

[mas0764]

You can't keep endlessly building in search of the perfect lineup.

Who said do it endlessly? We are probably two top 6 players away, that's not endlessly, it's just a little further. The team turned up it's nose at that course of action though, which was foolish.

 

[Cmox]

Yeah I don't know what the fear is of just rolling with the kids. Nemeth is disgustingly bland and Hajek and Tinordi stink. Send them both down to Hartford already and scratch Nemeth, he can collect his money from the press box.

Play Jones and Lundkvist together.

There is no need to worry about size. Trouba has brought enough of that, this is the third pair and they see the least minutes anyway. Not like Nemeth is using his "size," to do anything.

Just screening the goalie

 

[duhmetreE]

Nemeth is rivaling Staal. He may be bigger, slower and doofier.

I cringe everytime he pinches in... as nimble as a cruise liner

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Who said do it endlessly? We are probably two top 6 players away, that's not endlessly, it's just a little further. The team turned up it's nose at that course of action though, which was foolish.

Who are these top 6 players? Where are they coming from? What are you giving up to get them? What are the salary and lineup implications. I mean, sure this team is just a McDavid or Matthews away... whooptey doo! This is a business, not a fantasy league.

 

[McRanger92]

I would do that but would AZ? Kravtsov not being signed can scare away a lot of teams....

I would certainly add a 1st or Lundkvist/Jones to that offer if needed

 

[duhmetreE]

I would certainly add a 1st or Lundkvist/Jones to that offer if needed

I'd keep all of our 1sts. Use our abundance of near NHL ready prospects since we do not have room for all of them

 

[cwede]

so much talk about Canucks making changes, and needing RD -
would a Nils<>Podkolzin swap seem fair to you guys?
yeah, i realize he is not a Center ....

 

[mas0764]

Who are these top 6 players? Where are they coming from? What are you giving up to get them? What are the salary and lineup implications. I mean, sure this team is just a McDavid or Matthews away... whooptey doo! This is a business, not a fantasy league.

Well, I mean, trading Kreider for Robertson and a first was one example, trading Buch for Kupari and a first was another. It goes on and on.

Instead the team decided to double down on extending a 30 year old and trading a first liner for "grit."

It's stupid.

What are the next opportunities we will have? I don't know, but we have to start addressing the future instead of the present. The opportunities are there, we have just foolishly passed. They will be there again, but the idiots in charge of the team have to stop deluding themselves that they "need," players like Kreider, Strome, Blais and Trouba.

I would much rather have PPG Jason Robertson, Rasmus Kupari, and two first round picks as opposed to Kreider, Blais and a second. That was in-hand, we just made foolish decisions.

If we had done those things we'd be sitting here with a veritable treasure trove of assets to get a center; and we'd be moving Strome as well, because we'd have that center all lined up. We'd have way more cap space as well.

 

[Daves a mess]

Chytil getting scratched for Gregg Fn McKegg must be a real kick in the d**k for FIL. Trading he and Kravstov in a package is probably the way to go, but talk about selling low.

Sucks that a
good player like Zac Jones may have to be added because Fil hasn't gotten better and Kravstov is allergic to Connecticut air.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I feel like it's too soon to give up on Chytil unless the player coming back is a clear, clear upgrade.

 

[McRanger92]

I feel like it's too soon to give up on Chytil unless the player coming back is a clear, clear upgrade.

A lot of this is based on what Chytil does between now and the trade deadline id think

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Well, I mean, trading Kreider for Robertson and a first was one example, trading Buch for Kupari and a first was another. It goes on and on.

Instead the team decided to double down on extending a 30 year old and trading a first liner for "grit."

It's stupid.

What are the next opportunities we will have? I don't know, but we have to start addressing the future instead of the present. The opportunities are there, we have just foolishly passed. They will be there again, but the idiots in charge of the team have to stop deluding themselves that they "need," players like Kreider, Strome, Blais and Trouba.

I would much rather have PPG Jason Robertson, Rasmus Kupari, and two first round picks as opposed to Kreider, Blais and a second. That was in-hand, we just made foolish decisions.

If we had done those things we'd be sitting here with a veritable treasure trove of assets to get a center; and we'd be moving Strome as well, because we'd have that center all lined up. We'd have way more cap space as well.

I don't know how accurate those rumors are, but I'll take your word for it. The team chose different players than you did. Not the first, won't be the last. They're trying to construct a Stanley Cup winning roster, same as you are. Short of owning a time machine and having access to Gorton or Drury, that ship has sailed. And I don't think anyone is against adding good/young players but you aren't going to see this team take a step back in service of the future. That doesn't mean mortgage the future for a Cup run this season, but it's pretty clear they've identified their veterans (yes, you need veterans) for the next few seasons at least. So either hop on board or scream into the abyss. Personally, hockey's more enjoyable when the team I root for is winning. I'm ok with the direction the team is headed in. There are no guarantees come the playoffs.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

A lot of this is based on what Chytil does between now and the trade deadline id think

Even if they don't see him as a center, move him to wing before pulling the trigger. Maybe he's the top 6 wing the team needs?

 

[McRanger92]

I don't know how accurate those rumors are, but I'll take your word for it. The team chose different players than you did. Not the first, won't be the last. They're trying to construct a Stanley Cup winning roster, same as you are. Short of owning a time machine and having access to Gorton or Drury, that ship has sailed. And I don't think anyone is against adding good/young players but you aren't going to see this team take a step back in service of the future. That doesn't mean mortgage the future for a Cup run this season, but it's pretty clear they've identified their veterans (yes, you need veterans) for the next few seasons at least. So either hop on board or scream into the abyss. Personally, hockey's more enjoyable when the team I root for is winning. I'm ok with the direction the team is headed in. There are no guarantees come the playoffs.

The constant hand-wringing over a team thats 2nd in the NHL in points with a treasure trove of cap space and asset to add is baffling. If only our goal differential was +20 instead of +10!

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

The constant hand-wringing over a team thats 2nd in the NHL in points with a treasure trove of cap space and asset to add is baffling. If only our goal differential was +20 instead of +10!

I just don't understand why anyone would let a player's salary ruin the enjoyment of rooting for their team.

 

[tomobson]

Even if they don't see him as a center, move him to wing before pulling the trigger. Maybe he's the top 6 wing the team needs?

I think trading Chytil now even if his value is low will instantly get you a better winger than what Chytil could be. Nothing about his game really says winger to me and it'll be a big adjustment for him to make especially with the centers on this team. I don't see Chytil traded until this team makes a decision on Strome. They're going to need all their chips moving forward if Strome prices himself out.

 

[Fitzy]

NYR won the President's trophy in 2015 with 113 points. They almost won it in 2012 with 109 points.

Team is currently on pace for 116 points. I know the schedule has been weak but that's a promising sign regardless of individual performances.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I think trading Chytil now even if his value is low will instantly get you a better winger than what Chytil could be. Nothing about his game really says winger to me and it'll be a big adjustment for him to make especially with the centers on this team. I don't see Chytil traded until this team makes a decision on Strome. They're going to need all their chips moving forward if Strome prices himself out.

Wing is easier to play than C though, less responsibility. The move could free him up to just go out there and play. But you're probably right, regardless.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Nothing we can offer Anaheim to pry him out of there though.

It's his own fault for signing with them then.

 

[mas0764]

I don't know how accurate those rumors are, but I'll take your word for it.

I'm going by what Edge reported and he seems to be trusted around here.

The team chose different players than you did. Not the first, won't be the last.

The team made mistakes. Not the first and won't be the last either.

I'm not always right either. But I am this time.

They're trying to construct a Stanley Cup winning roster, same as you are. Short of owning a time machine and having access to Gorton or Drury, that ship has sailed.

Ok. But those errors should be recognized and then be instructive as for how to do better moving forward.

And I don't think anyone is against adding good/young players but you aren't going to see this team take a step back in service of the future. That doesn't mean mortgage the future for a Cup run this season, but it's pretty clear they've identified their veterans (yes, you need veterans) for the next few seasons at least. So either hop on board or scream into the abyss. Personally, hockey's more enjoyable when the team I root for is winning. I'm ok with the direction the team is headed in. There are no guarantees come the playoffs.

Well part of our difference in viewpoint may be personality based: it is endlessly disheartening for me that I see a team that as currently constructed probably won't turn into a Cup favorite (ie when we are told "this is our core." It better not be!)

There is time to change that but the BEST and EASIEST time to address these dire needs has passed (the Kreider and Buch trade opportunities, a hypothetical DeAngelo trade opportunity which I banged the drum for and was told he was too valuable to trade, or, continuing to tank).

I like to see the team win too, but every game I see won on the back of Kreider and Strome, et al, is also a blatant reminder of how far we need to go and how much the kids need to develop before we will have a hope of winning a Cup.

As far as moving forward, I accept the team isn't tanking anymore, but the team has to be open to getting 2-3 more young forwards. I'm not saying go get guys who are years and years away, but you have to get some Lundells or Newhooks or something, guys who aren't Zegras-type untouchable, but project as top 6ers and are also in the league TODAY. Yes, they are very expensive but, you know, Kupari and a first for Buch was on the table. Robertson and a first for Kreider was on the table. Again, how f'n sweet would it be to have Robertson, Kupari, and two firsts here instead of Kreider, Blais and a second? Robertson is probably already Kreider's equal or superior. Kupari checks young middle six center if not 2C. You also have an extra first round prospect from 2020 - let's say Maret Khusnutidov with that Stars pick and an extra first in this coming draft that can be packaged to move up for, say, Brad Lambert.

Something nice will probably be on the table at the deadline for Strome. Kreider and Trouba at some point can be approached to waive and something nice may be on the table for them. The prospects we have can't be pawned off for deadline rentals like Joe Pavelski, they have to be consolidated into a package for the next Eichel that becomes available. Kravtsov has to be begged to return because he's desperately needed to turn into a good top 6 winger.... unless we LIKE Hunt playing constant top 6 minutes.

These are the things that need to change. It's not impossible and it doesn't require running off every veteran. Even if we moved Kreider, we'd have Mika, Panarin, Goodrow, etc. It's just that SOME of these guys are going to have to go because we need to acknowledge the build is unfinished in relation to top young forward talent.

Think about this though:

Robertson - Zibanejad - Kakko
Panarin - Strome - Chytil
Lafreniere - Kupari - Kravtsov
Gauthier - Rooney - Goodrow

Reaves, Hunt as scratches.

Marat Khusnutdinov in the minors.

Two first round picks in the coming draft.

It was there to be accomplished.

 

[mas0764]

It's his own fault for signing with them then.

He shoulda done the Adam Fox maneuver, eh?

I mean, I would. If I was a top center prospect like that, I'd do the same thing. I'm staying in college or whatever until my time is up then I'm signing with the Rangers. Or trade me there now.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I'm going by what Edge reported and he seems to be trusted around here.



The team made mistakes. Not the first and won't be the last either.

I'm not always right either. But I am this time.



Ok. But those errors should be recognized and then be instructive as for how to do better moving forward.



Well part of our difference in viewpoint may be personality based: it is endlessly disheartening for me that I see a team that as currently constructed probably won't turn into a Cup favorite (ie when we are told "this is our core." It better not be!)

There is time to change that but the BEST and EASIEST time to address these dire needs has passed (the Kreider and Buch trade opportunities, a hypothetical DeAngelo trade opportunity which I banged the drum for and was told he was too valuable to trade, or, continuing to tank).

I like to see the team win too, but every game I see won on the back of Kreider and Strome, et al, is also a blatant reminder of how far we need to go and how much the kids need to develop before we will have a hope of winning a Cup.

As far as moving forward, I accept the team isn't tanking anymore, but the team has to be open to getting 2-3 more young forwards. I'm not saying go get guys who are years and years away, but you have to get some Lundells or Newhooks or something, guys who aren't Zegras-type untouchable, but project as top 6ers and are also in the league TODAY. Yes, they are very expensive but, you know, Kupari and a first for Buch was on the table. Robertson and a first for Kreider was on the table. Again, how f'n sweet would it be to have Robertson, Kupari, and two firsts here instead of Kreider, Blais and a second? Robertson is probably already Kreider's equal or superior. Kupari checks young middle six center if not 2C. You also have an extra first round prospect from 2020 - let's say Maret Khusnutidov with that Stars pick and an extra first in this coming draft that can be packaged to move up for, say, Brad Lambert.

Something nice will probably be on the table at the deadline for Strome. Kreider and Trouba at some point can be approached to waive and something nice may be on the table for them. The prospects we have can't be pawned off for deadline rentals like Joe Pavelski, they have to be consolidated into a package for the next Eichel that becomes available. Kravtsov has to be begged to return because he's desperately needed to turn into a good top 6 winger.... unless we LIKE Hunt playing constant top 6 minutes.

These are the things that need to change. It's not impossible and it doesn't require running off every veteran. Even if we moved Kreider, we'd have Mika, Panarin, Goodrow, etc. It's just that SOME of these guys are going to have to go because we need to acknowledge the build is unfinished in relation to top young forward talent.

Think about this though:

Robertson - Zibanejad - Kakko
Panarin - Strome - Chytil
Lafreniere - Kupari - Kravtsov
Gauthier - Rooney - Goodrow

Reaves, Hunt as scratches.

Marat Khusnutdinov in the minors.

Two first round picks in the coming draft.

It was there to be accomplished.

I don't think you give guys like Trouba, Strome and Kreider enough credit. These are the kinds of players every team would find a roster spot for and give big minutes to. I understand your desire to see the young players shine but that takes time. This doesn't have to be an either/or situation. How about we give this team an opportunity to show what they can do in the playoffs before deciding they aren't good enough to win in the playoffs? There's absolutely no need to rush anything, especially since two of the guys you want gone are in total control of the situation for the next 2-3 seasons.