Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XIII (Nanaki edition)

NYR Viper

Registered User
Sep 9, 2007
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I REALLY never understand this logic where a proven player shouldn’t be traded for futures when good NHL players, literally sometimes a month later, are then traded for other futures, at which point Ranger fans complain they don’t have the assets available to make said trade.

Trade Kreider somewhere, get a couple of good young prospects and a 1st and then wait and see what comes to be. It may not even be this season but someone will become available that’s worth it to make the deal. Or if not, leverage the cap space to your advantage in other ways
 

DanielBrassard

It's all so tiresome
May 6, 2014
23,907
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PA from SI
Trading Chris Kreider would send the wrong kind of Rangers message

Chris Kreider is not the problem. He is not an issue in the room. Fact is, he is not among the most pressing dozen or so matters the Rangers and GM Chris Drury are dealing with at the moment.

But by highlighting Kreider’s name in Chris Drury’s league-wide memo, the GM created more than some shock value. We are told that Drury has engaged in multiple conversations over the last 48 hours with counterparts about the Blueshirts’ senior player.

I don’t buy the suggestion that Drury used the memo-leak tactic to motivate his underachieving team. It is my understanding that the GM recognizes that it is imperative to change the dynamic, and the sooner the better.

So I kind of get it. Among the team’s veterans, Kreider has the most value. He has played up to at least every cent of his $6.5 million AAV on a contract that has two seasons remaining after this one. He might be able to bring a bounty in return. He has no baggage.

But what type of bounty, if that is even realistic? Stanley Cup contenders don’t generally sacrifice current value when they are seeking to fortify. Would Drury take a package of prospects and draft picks that are generally templates for deals around the trade deadline?

If so, this would be an indication of a teardown rather than a buildup. The ramifications on pending unrestricted free agent Igor Shesterkin would likely be massive and would have to be measured. Is the goalie signing up for a rebuild? Isn’t that actually where the goalie came in?

This is a whole other rabbit hole in which we could get lost for days.

Keep in mind that Kreider has a 15-team no-trade list. It may not matter if Ottawa would be willing to send Shane Pinto and a first-rounder to New York in exchange for Kreider. It probably doesn’t matter what Calgary would be willing to offer, no offense.

Would Buffalo, a perfect fit, be willing to trade Dylan Cozens for the winger? I wouldn’t think so. Would Anaheim, whose GM Pat Verbeek doesn’t have all that much to show for his tenure, be willing to send Trevor Zegras to New York in exchange for Kreider?

Would Buffalo, a perfect fit, be willing to trade Dylan Cozens for the winger? I wouldn’t think so. Would Anaheim, whose GM Pat Verbeek doesn’t have all that much to show for his tenure, be willing to send Trevor Zegras to New York in exchange for Kreider?

Again, it is unclear whether Drury’s priority is merely to shake up the core and change the dynamic or whether it is to make targeted deals that would improve this team’s prospects of getting those six extra wins in June?

If it’s the latter, I’m not quite sure that trading away the club’s most reliable playoff performer is the way to go. I’ll tell you this, as well, the Rangers would be talking about finding nine more wins and not six if Kreider had not been wearing the Blueshirt in Game 6 in Carolina last spring.

Of course, Kreider is an imperfect player. He is not the prototypical power winger folks might have envisioned at the start of his career. But everyone has known that for a very long time. No. 20 stopped being a ferocious puck-hunter in the wake of the Carey Price incident that was followed by a bevy of head-scratching goaltender interference calls the next season, remember? Yes, he should have more consistent impact at five-on-five.

But Kreider has evolved into one of the most productive goal scorers in the league and one of the most dangerous special teams weapons extant on each side of the puck, attributes that should elevate the winger onto the USA’s Four Nations squad even if he is a role-playing fourth-liner.

And he has served this organization honorably from the moment he arrived fresh-faced off the Boston College campus for the start of the 2012 playoffs. He is admired for his generosity within the organization and within the hockey community. His work ethic is legendary.

I almost hesitate to point this out after excoriating the core just a day ago, but Kreider has become the latter day Mr. Ranger. He is the organization’s institutional memory. He is the lifeline to Henrik Lundqvist and Rick Nash, to Ryan Callahan and Ryan McDonagh, to Derek Stepan and Marty St. Louis, to Marian Gaborik and Ruslan Fedotenko. To John Tortorella.

Of course, the original Mr. Ranger, the beloved Rod Gilbert — whom Kreider trails by 93 goals (406-313) for the all-time franchise record — was flat out released seven weeks into his 16th season by then GM John Ferguson nearly 47 years ago to the day.

And you thought waiving Barclay Goodrow was disrespectful ?

The Rangers have serious issues with which to contend. The Drury Memo has added another layer to it all. He has thrown a grenade into the room, but no one can quite tell whether the pin is in place or not.

Chris Kreider is not the problem. And unless there is a bounty coming back in return that fortifies the 2024-25 Rangers — unlikely, but perhaps not impossible because it only takes one dancing partner — trading Kreider is not the solution, either.
Kreider has been a great Ranger, and I would hate to see him go. That being said, he’s one of the few pieces on this roster that you can get good value back for. If you are going to move past this core group and begin to transition to one that you hope is able to become a legitimate Stanley cup core, moving a guy who is 33 going on 34, who’s had a real bad start to his season and plays a position where you have depth in the NHL and in the system, it makes too much sense to not move him. In fact, the Rangers could be moving him at just the right time if his play continues to decline.

Obviously I would much rather move out Zibanejad if at all possible but I don’t think it is.
 

MrAlmost

Beer league hero.
Jun 3, 2010
2,630
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He was so frustrating to watch. The talent was evident & he would look dazzling for weeks. Then he would disappear for weeks.

I actually met him in the Bahamas over Memorial Day weekend in 2000. Couldn't believe how skinny he was without equipment on. He was shocked that I knew who he was when we wound up sitting at the same table in the casino of the Atlantis.
Yeah but that is kinda the par for players like him. He was never supposed to be the #1 guy. He would have been the perfect #2 if we had had a real team, but that was a tough time.

Heard he is a nice guy though. And him being skinny makes sense. My dad used to say trying to hit nedved was like trying to hit a slinky. It was just going to bend around you. Haha
 
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haohmaru

boomshakalaka
Aug 26, 2009
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Trading Chris Kreider would send the wrong kind of Rangers message

Chris Kreider is not the problem.

Kreider being the problem or not being the problem isn't THE problem

The problem is he is the only valuable asset that the Rangers can dangle and stir up the room at the same time. Trouba to a much lesser extent. These are Drury's only cards to play.
 

Levitate

Registered User
Jul 29, 2004
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I mean, you can't pin the problem on only one player but the way Kreider has been playing is definitely indicative of the teams problem sand it's a way he's been trending for a bit now. He wants to be in front of the net and not play on any other areas of the ice. You can't do that at the NHL level
 

TheDirtyH

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Jul 5, 2013
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Chicago
If you're just making a move to shock the system how about just sit a guy out for a f***ing game. Tortorella scratched Couturier last year like weeks after they named him captain. God forbid Mika sits one game. Or Lindgren or Trouba play third pair minutes. It's so insane to me that the rangers are closer to waiving their leading goal scorer than scratching a center whose been a -3 or worse in 5 games before Thanksgiving.
 

AirGut

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Jul 1, 2019
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If you're just making a move to shock the system how about just sit a guy out for a f***ing game. Tortorella scratched Couturier last year like weeks after they named him captain. God forbid Mika sits one game. Or Lindgren or Trouba play third pair minutes. It's so insane to me that the rangers are closer to waiving their leading goal scorer than scratching a center whose been a -3 or worse in 5 games before Thanksgiving.
Current Rangers FO cares too much about optics. Country Club.
 

TheDirtyH

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Jul 5, 2013
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Chicago
Current Rangers FO cares too much about optics. Country Club.
I legitimately have no idea what this FO cares about. Are the optics of scratching a player that everyone and their mother knows has been an on-ice detriment to the team after 20 games of it really worse than purposefully stirring a media circus up by telling the world (Again) that you really want to be rid of your captain?
 

AirGut

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I legitimately have no idea what this FO cares about. Are the optics of scratching a player that everyone and their mother knows has been an on-ice detriment to the team after 20 games of it really worse than purposefully stirring a media circus up by telling the world (Again) that you really want to be rid of your captain?
The dramatics of it are ridiculous I agree but I'm holding onto the hope of this being the lead up to one big Drury trade.
 

80shockeywasbuns

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Feb 12, 2022
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Also, the sport is to blame. Or the league. However you want to categorize it.

As much the Yankees make me want to pour bleach into my eye sockets, I'm at least interested to see how they go into 2025. They're going to be involved in a major free agency sweepstakes.

NBA teams get one or two kicks at the can and then changes are made. The Knicks will attest.

The NHL has a crippling salary cap that has created an overbearing "run it back" culture, and the Rangers are guilty of it even by NHL standards.

2022, 2023, 2024, and 2025 are just about the same teams, with an assortment of corks plugged into the same holes.

Literally the only meaningful difference is Will Cuylle. That's why people are excited about him.
I genuinely believe that if Chris Drury had no salary cap and every other team did he still wouldnt even be able to put together a team that appears to have the best chance at the cup
 

HockeyBasedNYC

Feeling it
Aug 2, 2005
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If they made a bunch of changes and it just didn't work, even then, I think the vibes around here would be better.

I think we all kinda knew they did nothing, it already wasn't good enough, and it won't be this year.

I think people feel like they're wasting their time going through another whole season where they could already tell you the ending.

Nobody expects to win the Cup every year. Hell, nobody expects to win the Cup at all. But it's fun if you could win it. It's fun if you're making progress and maybe in two years you could win it. It's even fun if you stink but the team is young and maybe in five years we're a juggernaut. It's fun if you have no idea if it's any of those and you need to see the season play out.

This isn't any of the above. This is the fourth go-around of a season we've watched three times before that isn't going to lead to any of the above. It's a ghost of a season. It's a literal waste of time.
This sums it all up for me and it’s not even hard to admit.

Many of us said going into camp that there was an uninterested malaise hanging over the entire season before they even dropped the puck.

No new faces really, no exciting rookies breaking the lineup. We knew what 95% of the lineup would be and what to expect.

It’s a foregone season with manufactured Cup expectations that the casual fan may fall for but the diehards know it’s not worth the investment.

But we watch. We’ll always watch.
 

RangersFan1994

Registered User
Aug 20, 2019
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Still the same issues just as they had back then, if not much much worse now.
 
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bhamill

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Cuylle is more captain material than anyone on the team. With all due respect, Fox isnt a captain. He is just their best player. Leadership clearly means something and if they are going to have a long-term C it needs to be a guy willing to get his hands a little dirty. Adam Fox doesnt need more on his plate.
I think Laf. But Cuylle is a good choice.
 

GoAwayPanarin

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Kreider being the problem or not being the problem isn't THE problem

The problem is he is the only valuable asset that the Rangers can dangle and stir up the room at the same time. Trouba to a much lesser extent. These are Drury's only cards to play.

What about the bad players with locker room cred who don’t have a ton of value?

Seems to be that they'd be the optimal ones to move.






Still the same issues just as they had back then, if not much much worse now.


I know that you think you're proving some kind of point but Thornton made this in reference to the 2011-12 team which was... the epitome of grit and intangibles and toughness and all the things that you think that this current group isn't.

It was a dumb comment by Thornton just as bringing this up now as a way to link the 2 teams and act like this is a decade+ long problem is dumb.
 

bernmeister

Registered User
Jun 11, 2010
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Kreider being the problem or not being the problem isn't THE problem

The problem is he is the only valuable asset that the Rangers can dangle and stir up the room at the same time. Trouba to a much lesser extent. These are Drury's only cards to play.
NO, eff that bs mentality which says let's just make a deal to change the picture a bit but not deal with the underlying problems

also they are not the only cards
Lindgren can go = addition by subtraction
and Vesey also we are better off with Rempe

IF and WHEN it makes sense to consider moving CK, fine, but since he is an exceptional athlete so 3 top yrs and 5 or so overall is realistic, now is not the time esp if it is giving him away


DON'T FEED THE VULTURES



No one could miss open net like Nedved could, not even Strome
Gene Carr stopped by to say "hi", pls don't forget me.
Remember, I'm the guy Bill Chadwick said, "he couldn't shoot the puck off a pier and hit the ocean" [or to that effect].



If we are punting, trading Kreider make sense. If the goal this season is still the Cup, trading Lindgren and Trouba make sense but not Kreider.
yes otherwise but bold is no
as per above deal CK only if and when what he brings back is a profit over and above his projected production
we think he'll re-up here on team friendly deal 4.5-5.25 per a yr at a time
and following 2-ish seasons should mean keep unless crazy offer
 
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