Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part LXII

[Leetch3]

I’m still baffled by the Staal trade before the draft. They must have several possible trades teed up, no?

I mean we have about 7 or 8M comfortably after signing all our free agents

I think its clear that they want to make other moves, but I don't think we can assume anything is teed up...

the conclusion that I make from moving staal is that 1) they feel we are better without staal on our blueline and 2) between dealing staal and buying out lundqvist, the team felt that it was important to give us the OPPORTUNITY to go get missing pieces because the team is 'ahead of schedule' and they wanted to make sure they weren't stuck in neutral for a year waiting for bad contracts to expire....whether or not those deals can be made is unknown but they have at least now opened the window to make them possible.

 

[LokiDog]

Anyone ever notice how similar Mika and DJ Steve Aoki look?

 

[GAGLine]

I’m still baffled by the Staal trade before the draft. They must have several possible trades teed up, no?

I mean we have about 7 or 8M comfortably after signing all our free agents

No we don't. Strome, ADA, Lemieux and Georgiev will likely cost about 13 mil, then we've got to add 2 more forwards and 2 more dmen.

Laf will be one of those forwards. His cap hit will be 925k, but he'll have 2.85 mil in performance bonuses, and we have to account for those bonuses under the cap since we will exceed the bonus cushion. Basically, due to bonuses, we can't spend to 81.5 mil, we can only spend to 77.5 mil.

We have enough cap space that we could fit Fast as the 12th forward (Smith would be the lone spare at both F and D), but that's it. If we do re-sign him, we're going to have to be careful about which young players make the team, because a lot of them, like Barron and Kravtsov, have bonuses as well.

 

[bl02]

I’m still baffled by the Staal trade before the draft. They must have several possible trades teed up, no?

I mean we have about 7 or 8M comfortably after signing all our free agents

And I hope we don't go out an waste all of that money we freed up this past week. Gonna need it for the future

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Can someone compare Lindholm and Monahan?

 

[UnSandvich]

I maintain that Johan Larsson would be an awesome fit in our Bottom 6

 

[Leetch3]

I maintain that Johan Larsson would be an awesome fit in our Bottom 6

if I'm bringing in a veteran 4C my 2 biggest criteria are that he can kill penalties and win faceoffs...Larsson plays alot on the pk but the sabres have one of the worst pks so not sure what that says about him specifically as a pker....and he was good last year on draws but bad this year, not really sure the reason for the drop off.

 

[gravey9]

Question: I get that we COULD trade for Monahan and Hanifin. But given flat cap and our buying power, shouldnt we wait this out for a bigger apple to fall off the tree? While we have some cap room, we don't have a ton. We likely only have so many moves before we run out of ramp. Is this a big enough upgrade? Or is a bit too lateral?

 

[Savant]

Can someone compare Lindholm and Monahan?

One is a right wing who can sometimes play center. One is a center who is incredibly streaky (14 game drought last season), and contributes nothing if he isn’t scoring.

 

[Leetch3]

Question: I get that we COULD trade for Monahan and Hanifin. But given flat cap and our buying power, shouldnt we wait this out for a bigger apple to fall off the tree? While we have some cap room, we don't have a ton. We likely only have so many moves before we run out of ramp. Is this a big enough upgrade? Or is a bit too lateral?

not sure what 'bigger apple' you are expecting to fall...but if they feel they are the right guys, I wouldn't be overly concerned with cap hits considering who is likely to be heading out if that happens...we aren't resigning all of our RFAs and then adding those 2 on top. getting a 2C all but guarantees that strome is gone, and the deal strome would get if re-signed probably isn't that far off from monahan's deal and if deangelo is in the deal his new contract would definitely be more than hanafin's contract...so the cap hits coming in and going out will likely net out.

so I think from the cap stand point its workable...the question is are they the right guys?

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Anyone ever notice how similar Mika and DJ Steve Aoki look?

No. Guess why? They don't.

 

[Barnaby]

I think its clear that they want to make other moves, but I don't think we can assume anything is teed up...

the conclusion that I make from moving staal is that 1) they feel we are better without staal on our blueline and 2) between dealing staal and buying out lundqvist, the team felt that it was important to give us the OPPORTUNITY to go get missing pieces because the team is 'ahead of schedule' and they wanted to make sure they weren't stuck in neutral for a year waiting for bad contracts to expire....whether or not those deals can be made is unknown but they have at least now opened the window to make them possible.

Plus if you make the other moves first then your desperate and could end up in the Toronto/Marleau situation. It was time to move on from Staal as seen as you find a solid deal.

 

[eco's bones]

In 7 years Monahan is 4 times over 60 points and once over 80. Every year he's been over 20 goals and three times he's been over 30. He knows how to finish. I'm not sure how anyone could say he wouldn't be an upgrade over Strome. Monahan is not the best skater or defensive player? Neither is Strome.

Monahan would give us a better 2nd line center and if he plays with Panarin (better player than Gaudreau) I expect that his typical numbers will go up.

If the cost is DeAngelo I would do it. DeAngelo is an excellent offensive player but a mediocre defensive player and we're talking in both cases of Monahan and DeAngelo as numbers producing flawed defensive players. I'd rather have that issue with a center than a defenseman. The Rangers could really use a 2c type and we have a cheap replacement for Tony in Lundkvist waiting in the wings. The money issue works IMO more in Monahan's favor too. Keeping DeAngelo long term we're looking at having way too many cap $'s allocated for the RD position and not enough for center. If we're going to have a good 2C he's going to cost us some cap. If we're going to stick a kid (there's usually a learning curve) in the 2c slot--that might mean a couple cheap years but after that you want that guy to have done well enough to justify paying him quite a lot more.

 

[usekakkorightquinn]

Monahan for TDA. Sign me up. Done.

 

[Ghost of jas]

In 7 years Monahan is 4 times over 60 points and once over 80. Every year he's been over 20 goals and three times he's been over 30. He knows how to finish. I'm not sure how anyone could say he wouldn't be an upgrade over Strome. Monahan is not the best skater or defensive player? Neither is Strome.

Monahan would give us a better 2nd line center and if he plays with Panarin (better player than Gaudreau) I expect that his typical numbers will go up.

If the cost is DeAngelo I would do it. DeAngelo is an excellent offensive player but a mediocre defensive player and we're talking in both cases of Monahan and DeAngelo as numbers producing flawed defensive players. I'd rather have that issue with a center than a defenseman. The Rangers could really use a 2c type and we have a cheap replacement for Tony in Lundkvist waiting in the wings. The money issue works IMO more in Monahan's favor too. Keeping DeAngelo long term we're looking at having way too many cap $'s allocated for the RD position and not enough for center. If we're going to have a good 2C he's going to cost us some cap. If we're going to stick a kid (there's usually a learning curve) in the 2c slot--that might mean a couple cheap years but after that you want that guy to have done well enough to justify paying him quite a lot more.

Yeah, but he's not the perfect 2C candidate, so we should wait until the ideal one comes along.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Question: I get that we COULD trade for Monahan and Hanifin. But given flat cap and our buying power, shouldnt we wait this out for a bigger apple to fall off the tree? While we have some cap room, we don't have a ton. We likely only have so many moves before we run out of ramp. Is this a big enough upgrade? Or is a bit too lateral?

I think I agree with this if we’re talking about Hanafin. There is no telling if he’ll end up being the minute eating shutdown guy on the left side that we really need. He is young and defensemen can hit their prime much later, so it’s very possible that his best years are ahead of him. But I agree, we better be sure that is true if we make that move.

for Monahan, I actually do think this is a player that slots in perfectly as a 2C. He’s a goal scorer that would have the opportunity to play with puck moving, dynamic wingers and we would be setting him up for success here. I do think this is a guy that is more than a lateral move over Strome. We should go get him.

 

[motopanekeku]

No. Guess why? They don't.

We'll he looks more like Steve Aoki than say Ed Sheeran...

 

[mas0764]

Seems like we kinda have to talk ourselves into Monahan. He’s not cheap either. I dunno, doesn’t seem like the best option to me.

My goal really is more of a player to grow with Kakko and Lafreniere. I’d rather just resign DeAngelo and move him later if no one is gonna blow me away. Monahan may be an ok return but I’m not blown away. I wasn’t even thrilled with Elias Lindholm but I like that return better. If I have to justify whether it’s good enough then I’d rather keep ADA.

I really do think ADA has star potential. Career 2C - and for a career that is half over - isn’t my jam. I know Edge said the leagues opinion of ADA may not match ours, but then I keep him if I’m not getting someone who I don’t at least see as a young 1/2.

 

[kovazub94]

In 7 years Monahan is 4 times over 60 points and once over 80. Every year he's been over 20 goals and three times he's been over 30. He knows how to finish. I'm not sure how anyone could say he wouldn't be an upgrade over Strome. Monahan is not the best skater or defensive player? Neither is Strome.

Monahan would give us a better 2nd line center and if he plays with Panarin (better player than Gaudreau) I expect that his typical numbers will go up.

If the cost is DeAngelo I would do it. DeAngelo is an excellent offensive player but a mediocre defensive player and we're talking in both cases of Monahan and DeAngelo as numbers producing flawed defensive players. I'd rather have that issue with a center than a defenseman. The Rangers could really use a 2c type and we have a cheap replacement for Tony in Lundkvist waiting in the wings. The money issue works IMO more in Monahan's favor too. Keeping DeAngelo long term we're looking at having way too many cap $'s allocated for the RD position and not enough for center. If we're going to have a good 2C he's going to cost us some cap. If we're going to stick a kid (there's usually a learning curve) in the 2c slot--that might mean a couple cheap years but after that you want that guy to have done well enough to justify paying him quite a lot more.

I think the pushback (and I’m somewhat agree) against Monahan is not because whether or by how much he is better than Strome, but it’s because of how much a less desirable return he is for ADA COMPARED to Lindholm. Everything that we all like about Lindholm as a player whether it on offense or defense or his salary or the length of his contract, EVERYTHING is less desirable when it comes to Monahan. I personally can’t automatically assume that playing with Panarin instead of Gaudreau will translate into more production because chemistry is a fizzle thing. Then we almost salivate looking at Lindholm contract and term, and wince a bit looking at about $6.5m for Monahan and knowing that in only 3 more years he’d want an increase.

Without a gun to my head I’d rather keep Strome and ADA (and Buchnevich too) for another year and wait for Lindholm-like opportunity to come along instead of pulling a trigger on Monahan now.

 

[Avery16]

Yeah, but he's not the perfect 2C candidate, so we should wait until the ideal one comes along.

Maybe we shouldn’t trade a better player and asset for him. Maybe this team is better with ADA than it would be with Monahan.

 

[Trxjw]

I'd rather have a two way center. I like ADA yet if a two way center in the mold of a young ROR, or something was able to be traded for, then I could probably understand the trade even if the pay seems like a lot.

For me at least it's not like I see ADA as a do not trade, more like I'd want a very specific player in return. That may be a center or LD given what the Ranger likely will need, it may be a youngish NHLer or some package that could return that with another trade now or in the future, yet from my point of view the Rangers do not need to move ADA unless that type of player is available right now.

Similar with just about everyone who may or may not be on the maybe trade list, get the right player at the right age, who is in their career at the right contract spot, and I'll be fine with any trade. Given their position they do not need to capitulate and get less than what they should get or should want. They have time to get it right.

I think most of us would love an ROR type in this situation. That being said, if there simply isn't that player available or teams aren't willing to part with that kind of player for DeAngelo, well, then the market has spoken.

The Rangers clearly see him as the 3RD. They're very high on his near-term substitute in Lundkvist. They have holes elsewhere and seem intent on making changes. At some point you've gotta take action, even if it's not the perfect value you had cooked up in your head. They're not going to give Tony away for something they don't see equal value in. However, that equal value isn't likely to be an elite 2C without any flaws or a premier, shutdown LD on a great contract. They're trading a guy who is incredible at one side of the game and very weak at the other. We should prepare ourselves to get some flawed assets in return. I just JD and Gorton to know what kind of team to put together.

 

[Rangeri]

Yeah, but he's not the perfect 2C candidate, so we should wait until the ideal one comes along.

People also tend to forget that we are talking about New York Rangers here. We always have advantage when we are talking about free agents. Of course you have to pay them, but so what? We also have the money to do so. So I'm really not worried about 2c position right now, there will be numerous opportunities to get better at that in the near future.

Also our assets are not going to lose value in one year, more likely they are going to increase it.

 

[Cag29]

Question: I get that we COULD trade for Monahan and Hanifin. But given flat cap and our buying power, shouldnt we wait this out for a bigger apple to fall off the tree? While we have some cap room, we don't have a ton. We likely only have so many moves before we run out of ramp. Is this a big enough upgrade? Or is a bit too lateral?

I hear what you’re saying but I’m sure they are pounding the phone and maybe that’s the best deal. I trust Gorton.

 

[kovazub94]

I think most of us would love an ROR type in this situation. That being said, if there simply isn't that player available or teams aren't willing to part with that kind of player for DeAngelo, well, then the market has spoken.

The Rangers clearly see him as the 3RD. They're very high on his near-term substitute in Lundkvist. They have holes elsewhere and seem intent on making changes. At some point you've gotta take action, even if it's not the perfect value you had cooked up in your head. They're not going to give Tony away for something they don't see equal value in. However, that equal value isn't likely to be an elite 2C without any flaws or a premier, shutdown LD on a great contract. They're trading a guy who is incredible at one side of the game and very weak at the other. We should prepare ourselves to get some flawed assets in return. I just JD and Gorton to know what kind of team to put together.

If Hanifin - Buchnevich and a swap of 1rd picks are part of the deal I’d be a lot more willing to buy in.

 

[Vitto79]

IF The big moves don’t work out I’d take Zadorov for a 3rd.......sign Tony.....revisit when Lundkvist signs

Zadorov can be exposed and buys time for kids like Miller