Toggle sidebar

Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part LX

  • Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
Status
Not open for further replies.
MahomesIsGod said:
If the Eichel trade goes down I guarantee you they won’t get that much
Click to expand...

I was going to post this on the main board Eichel thread yesterday, but I decided not to waste my time. I looked back at all the drafts from 2005-2019 and the only time a top 3 pick was traded was in the Kessel to Toronto deal. And the argument can very easily be made that Toronto was not anticipating that 1st round pick being that high at the time of the trade...the Duchene trade to Ottawa also netted Colorado 4th overall, but similar circumstances about not anticipating that draft pick to be that high.

In the cap era, teams just don't move top draft picks or players drafted with top draft picks that are still on their ELC's. The most comparable trade of a top 5 drafted player that I could find was the Ryan Johansen / Seth Jones trade. Looking at Johansen as the comp, he was 23 years old at the time of the trade, ended with 60 points in 80 games that season, and was due a major extension in the near future (I think he got a $6M bridge deal, then signed his current $8M/year deal). At the time of his big extension, Johansen's cap hit was about 10.6% of the cap, Eichel's is about 12.3% of the current cap. Eichel is the more valuable player of the two, but is the difference in value really #1 overall or the #2 overall pick a year removed from the draft? I don't believe it is.

As far as compiling a trade offer, I would be fine with a combination of one or two of Chytil/Kravstov/CAR 2020 1st/2021 1st, one of Miller/Nils, and a roster player or two from Buch/DeAngelo/Strome/Howden. Mix and match as you see fit. Problem there is it really doesn't address the future cap implications of adding $10M and not really moving anything else out, but to get a player like Eichel I think that's a secondary problem that can be addressed down the line.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Levitate said:
well, it gets it done if Buffalo decides Eichel has to be moved. It gets it done as a general framework of a package, perhaps not the specifics

In general it's highly unlikely that dealing someone like Eichel gets the actual value in return. Teams just aren't going to give up crazy huge amounts of players and picks and prospects
Click to expand...

Yes, the Eichel speculation has always rested on whether or not Eichel forces his way out.
 
  • Like
Reactions: egelband and Brooklyn Rangers Fan
jas said:
Yes. Go look at these deals historically. That gets it done.
Click to expand...
as a Rangers fan I would do that deal. maybe get a guy like McCabe in the deal along with Eichel, to add depth to Defense if Buffalo needs to rid of another roster player
 
I dont think the Rangers would think twice if Buch Tony Kravtsov and 22 got it done. That would still be a steal. I would love that for us.
Panarin Eichel Kakko
Lafreniere Zibby Kreider
Thats a top 6 that can win as Kakko and Laf grow.
 
No to trading the house for Jack Eichel.

Yes to trading ADA for the 6th overall and getting Saucy Rossi.
 
Tawnos said:
The problem is that the Rangers are better suited to getting players that fit both now and the future. In other words, someone of a similar age to DeAngelo, or slightly younger, who is of similar caliber and plays a position of current need. That's LD or C. Future assets are nice, but only somewhat fit what we're trying to do at the moment.
Click to expand...

Well the Rangers are gonna do what they are gonna do and we have no say in it. What they are trying to do might be both compete now and set themselves up for the future, but as the old proverb goes, those who walk in the middle of the street get hit by cars on both sides. I have to ask, why are they better suited for getting players for both now and in the future? Why not get a player for each instead of one player that fulfills both roles? Why not go out and acquire a stud prospect center, and then sign a vet like Erik Haula, Carl Soderberg, Joe Thornton, Jason Spezza, someone who can hold that spot down for a year or two? Why is trading for Lindholm better than that? I'm not sure I would agree.

They have Trouba, Zibenejad, Panarin and Kreider who are 26, 27, 28 and 29, but their true core is absolutely the 25 and under crowd (and really, the 22 and under crowd, because other than Shesterkin, I could argue no one in those 25 or 24 categories are true cornerstones moving forward).

25
Buchnevich

24
DeAngelo
Georgiev
Shesterkin

22
Fox
Gauthier
Hajek
Howden
Lindgren

21
Andersson
Barron
Chytil

20
Kravtsov
Lundkvist
Miller

19
Kakko
Lafreniere
Robertson


They need another center for that 22 and under group, not 25 and up.

I think this point needs to be reinforced: The Rangers true hope of winning a Cup, or Cups, does not lie with Trouba, Zibanejad, Panarin, and Kreider. Those four do not have a prayer in the world of carrying a team to a Cup.

It's not until Lafreniere, Kakko, Fox, and perhaps 1-2 others from that list have joined them in the upper echelon of NHLers that the team has a real chance at being more than a run of the mill playoff team. And if we have to wait for those guys, then we are waiting on about 10 other guys who will all be entering their primes at about the same time. THAT's the winning core, then. Not Zibanejad at 29 and Kreider at 31. The value of those four (Trouba, Zibanejad, Panarin, and Kreider) is to be the elder vets supporting the elite Kakko/Kravtsov/Chytil/Lafreniere/Fox (and hopefully another center) core.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: egelband, Minmonster and NYRangers16
Trxjw said:
Well, for starters, the draft might be stacked but is sure as hell isn't stacked with centers. So I'm not sure where you're getting the notion that there's some premium top-six center prospect sitting at 6. Like I said in another post, you're either betting huge on Lundell or gambling that Rossi actually stays at center as a pro. Otherwise the BPA available at 6 is likely a defensemen or a winger. So sure, your suggestion is fine in theory but it doesn't really apply.

DeAngelo can't "walk" so I'm not sure where you're getting that from. He's a RFA and right now the Rangers can protect him in expansion so there's no issue with losing him for nothing.

You answered your own question about futures. There's a very, very big difference between Lafreniere and just your run of the mill futures. There's a very, very wide gap between Lafreneire and #6 in this draft. Could you get a great player at 6? Absolutely. However, surrendering a great player to maybe get a great player is a huge, huge gamble no matter how you try to spin it.

Cozens and 8 I can get behind. 6 and a good prospect? Sure. DeAngelo for a pick straight across? No thank you.
Click to expand...

I do think DeAngelo for what might be essentially Lundell is a bit of an overpayment on our part.

Now DeAngelo for 3OA, that's a different story.
 
  • Like
Reactions: egelband
what cup winner hasn't had big contracts and been forced to make tough choices in the year or years following their win??

is the idea here to win and to have a pretty cap speadsheet. things happen ever year to players and the cap and you adjust as you go. established players like eichel do not become available when they are entering their prime. you take the opportunity that you put yourself in position to take advantage of...
 
  • Like
Reactions: TominNC
and for the Sabres fans reading this board and going "lol they think they're gonna get Eichel for spare parts!" I (and I think other people posting similar things) aren't saying that all the Rangers have to do is offer a package like we've discussed and Buffalo is gonna go for it, just that even though Eichel is a top tier player a trade isn't likely to return a huge haul of top NHLers, #1 overall draft pick and blue chip prospects. It's just too much for a team to give up for 1 player.
That is also why players like Eichel are rarely traded, it's just so hard to get what people would think of as fair value. So Buffalo isn't going to trade him for the "lesser" offers we've discussed unless things get bad and Eichel is forcing his way out and Buffalo has to find a way to recover assets for him (because honestly otherwise why would they want to trade him at all?)
 
  • Like
Reactions: I Eat Crow
If we are trading for Eichel Chytil is most definitely going the other way. No way around it.

i also think Eichel will cost similar to what Nash cost us.


I think it could be Chytil Buch and a prospect not Krav Miller or Lundkvist and a 1st round pick
 
  • Like
Reactions: mas0764
Richard Banger said:
If we are trading for Eichel Chytil is most definitely going the other way. No way around it.

i also think Eichel will got similar to what Nash cost us.
Click to expand...

and that said, it's unlikely they trade him for that package unless they're forced to...which is the only situation in which they're trading him to begin with
 
  • Like
Reactions: Brooklyn Rangers Fan
Vitto79 said:
I’m pretty pretty sure most would be in favour of him signing longterm it’s just their top prospect is a RD and it’s a log jam
Click to expand...

Yup, I love DeAngelo.

It's just that we have a plethora of young RD, Trouba is not getting traded, and we need a center.

Something has to give and ADA is the one up for a contract first.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NYRangers16
My own opinions of dealing Tony for futures aside, we're definitely getting an interesting picture of what Gorton's call history probably looks like. Talking to the Sens, Ducks, and Sabres with picks 5, 6, and 8 in the draft, respectively. Gotta think there's some conversation with Dorion along the lines of "If I had another top-10 pick, how far would you move back? What would the cost be?" and the same thing with Murray in Anaheim. Vegas doesn't have the high pick but has the center prospects and good depth players to add to the roster.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Brooklyn Rangers Fan, NYRangers16, mas0764 and 1 other person
Richard Banger said:
If we are trading for Eichel Chytil is most definitely going the other way. No way around it.

i also think Eichel will cost similar to what Nash cost us.


I think it could be Chytil Buch and a prospect not Krav Miller or Lundkvist and a 1st round pick
Click to expand...

Who was Chytil in that trade? Dubinsky and Anismov were more established players. Erixon was a prospect, then the 1st round pick. I think if you break that down, you'd be looking at ADA, Buch, Kravstov and a 1st.

Though when Nash was traded he was 28 years old i think. Eichel would be 4 years younger (turns 24 later this month).
 
UAGoalieGuy said:
Who was Chytil in that trade? Dubinsky and Anismov were more established players. Erixon was a prospect, then the 1st round pick. I think if you break that down, you'd be looking at ADA, Buch, Kravstov and a 1st.

Though when Nash was traded he was 28 years old i think. Eichel would be 4 years younger (turns 24 later this month).
Click to expand...
Back then there wasn’t a flat cap either. And I think Chytil has shown more than both of Dubi and AA.
 
UAGoalieGuy said:
Who was Chytil in that trade? Dubinsky and Anismov were more established players. Erixon was a prospect, then the 1st round pick. I think if you break that down, you'd be looking at ADA, Buch, Kravstov and a 1st.

Though when Nash was traded he was 28 years old i think. Eichel would be 4 years younger (turns 24 later this month).
Click to expand...

ADA is definitely the best player out of all those mentioned in the deals from the Rangers side though, if you're trading a 60 point defenseman you can probably get away with that prospect being more of a B prospect than Kravtsov
 
  • Like
Reactions: jas
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Top Bottom