Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part LVI

[HFsNumber1Heel]

A 4th line of Lemiuex-Howden-Gauthier doesn't have enough sandpaper. This team needs more balls. Yes Lemieux hits but he's one guy.

And what was the point of trading for Gauthier if he's going to be on the 4th line? He has skills and is basically diet Kreider. Let him develop all over the lineup.

This team desperately needs at least 2 hard nosed veterans who have been there and done that, and have had deep playoff runs. That's why I'm about someone like a Simmonds. One year in and out of the lineup but can play bottom 6.

 

[pld459666]

I don't know how much I agree with the notion that it isn't teachable.

If we ever hired a coach that knows what forechecking is, I think you'd be surprised.

I've never see physicality coached into a player.

Either they play that way and they can be taught to harness that and play well defensively, or they don't.

 

[Machinehead]

I've never see physicality coached into a player.

Either they play that way and they can be taught to harness that and play well defensively, or they don't.

You can't be physical if there's nobody to hit. We don't put ourselves in situations where hitting is necessary.

Quinn preaches playing hard and stuff but he plays the same passive, conservative, scared-kitten system AV did.

 

[egelband]

Lemieux-Gettinger-Gauthier.

There I just did it.

JT Brown and Curtis Lazar are free agents.

Here's two more:

You wanna know why our 4th line sucks? Because I'll tell you.

This is why:

JUST GET REPLACEMENT-LEVEL NHL PLAYERS!!!

Rome wasn’t built in a day. They made some huge strides. If they still can’t get value from the bottom six in a year or two, sure. But it’s nothing to be up-in-arms about yet, if you ask me.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

You can't be physical if there's nobody to hit. We don't put ourselves in situations where hitting is necessary.

Quinn preaches playing hard and stuff but he plays the same passive, conservative, scared-kitten system AV did.

I wouldn't categorize the Rangers are conservative at all. They were very much a take one to give one team this year.

The guys do play hard. They play like they have no idea what they're doing half of the time but they play hard.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Lemieux-Gettinger-Gauthier.

There I just did it.

JT Brown and Curtis Lazar are free agents.

Here's two more:

You wanna know why our 4th line sucks? Because I'll tell you.

This is why:

JUST GET REPLACEMENT-LEVEL NHL PLAYERS!!!

Or have some patience and let the kids mature. I wouldn't ask a kid to wire my house until he finished his electrical training, why are we trying to rush this build and the kids involved in it?? We aren't a 4th line away from a cup, we have a lot of holes right now.

 

[Machinehead]

Rome wasn’t built in a day. They made some huge strides. If they still can’t get value from the bottom six in a year or two, sure. But it’s nothing to be up-in-arms about yet, if you ask me.

I'm not exactly up-in-arms yet, I just make my points forcefully, it comes from the lecturing.

It's just that it's so simple. Get non-NHL players off the Rangers. It needs to be a priority.

 

[Machinehead]

Or have some patience and let the kids mature. I wouldn't ask a kid to wire my house until he finished his electrical training, why are we trying to rush this build and the kids involved in it?? We aren't a 4th line away from a cup, we have a lot of holes right now.

I'm fine with that too.

Notice my first option was a line of guys already on the Rangers.

I'm just showing that it's possible and these guys exist.

 

[Machinehead]

I wouldn't categorize the Rangers are conservative at all. They were very much a take one to give one team this year.

The guys do play hard. They play like they have no idea what they're doing half of the time but they play hard.

Offensively, they're not, but on defense, they still run back to their own net and lay out the welcome mat at the line.

Because, heaven forbid, somebody might get past Marc Staal for an odd-man rush as opposed to taking 8 shots at him.

 

[egelband]

I'm not exactly up-in-arms yet, I just make my points forcefully, it comes from the lecturing.

It's just that it's so simple. Get non-NHL players off the Rangers. It needs to be a priority.

Sure. But a guy like Howden who isn’t an NHL-level player yet may well turn into a pretty good one based on what he has learned the past two (rebuilding) seasons. I’m sure many would laugh at me for that comment but the Rangers obviously see a light at the end of that tunnel so I’m fine giving them the benefit of the doubt.
I would agree that playing Smith at forward for so long was pretty much a waste of time.

 

[Machinehead]

Sure. But a guy like Howden who isn’t an NHL-level player yet may well turn into a pretty good one based on what he has learned the past two (rebuilding) seasons. I’m sure many would laugh at me for that comment but the Rangers obviously see a light at the end of that tunnel so I’m fine giving them the benefit of the doubt.
I would agree that playing Smith at forward for so long was pretty much a waste of time.

They got something for that. It's called the AHL!

 

[egelband]

They got something for that. It's called the AHL!

Well, my point is, they’re building their roster how they see fit and i - for one - am happy to see how it plays out. If they’re still developing and experimenting in Panarin year two, I start to worry. And if we’re not looking at a pretty mature team the following year, we can definitely push the lever to Code Red.

 

[Rangers in 7]

Here is everyone’s friendly reminder that howden isn’t an NHL player

 

[CommaSynapse]

If it's true that Hanifin is available, I hope we're inquiring. (sorry if it's been commented on before)

 

[Machinehead]

Well, my point is, they’re building their roster how they see fit and i - for one - am happy to see how it plays out. If they’re still developing and experimenting in Panarin year two, I start to worry. And if we’re not looking at a pretty mature team the following year, we can definitely push the lever to Code Red.

Nobody is going Code Red here, don't misinterpret the tone (although I am partial to red).

I get your point. If Howden plays in 20-21, I don't give a f***. I don't think we're going anywhere anyway just yet and that's fine.

I do get the feeling that the Rangers like what Howden is doing and that's scary.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

I’m not questioning the strategy. My point is that those “legendary fourth line” type players are the easiest ones to acquire. If any team in the league wanted to, they could do it.
Ken Oberkfell was a good player, too. Just not the guy you need a ton of.
It obviously worked out for the Isles this season. I still want no part of it.

I feel it would be better to try and develop those players in our system. It seems when teams acquire 3rd and 4th liners through free agency it rarely works out. Better results through trades but still not great.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

A 4th line of Lemiuex-Howden-Gauthier doesn't have enough sandpaper. This team needs more balls. Yes Lemieux hits but he's one guy.

And what was the point of trading for Gauthier if he's going to be on the 4th line? He has skills and is basically diet Kreider. Let him develop all over the lineup.

This team desperately needs at least 2 hard nosed veterans who have been there and done that, and have had deep playoff runs. That's why I'm about someone like a Simmonds. One year in and out of the lineup but can play bottom 6.

I don’t believe that Wayne Simmonds has ever gone deep into the playoffs.

 

[bobbop]

If it's true that Hanifin is available, I hope we're inquiring. (sorry if it's been commented on before)

Hanifin interests me a lot. His development certainly hasn’t been a straight line but I’ve seen many young defensemen who don’t figure things out at a young age but go up from there. He was pretty good in 2018-19, not as good this year. He does have some similarities to Brady Skeji but I think he is a better player. And I think his upside is much greater.

There’s sure a lot of smoke between here and Calgary.

 

[Richard Banger]

Nobody is going Code Red here, don't misinterpret the tone (although I am partial to red).

I get your point. If Howden plays in 20-21, I don't give a f***. I don't think we're going anywhere anyway just yet and that's fine.

I do get the feeling that the Rangers like what Howden is doing and that's scary.

No Quinn likes what Howden is doing.

Same way AV liked what Glass was doing.

Eventually the GM just brings in better talent and they have no choice but to sit that player or trade them.

Howden isn't part of this core. In fact JD hinted at the point that a lot of players that will be on this team when we are contending aren't even here yet.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Here is everyone’s friendly reminder that howden isn’t an NHL player

Could have said the same about Chytil before the season started.

 

[Fitzy]

My hot take is that with today's conditioning, 4th liners shouldn't be playing much except in long games in the playoffs.

Do you need one or two spare forwards to fill in for shifts where there is an injury, or a player is in the penalty box? Sure. But do you need the 10th, 11th, and 12th best forwards on your team skating a regular shift all together? I'm not sure.

I get that this allows teams to 'stretch' forwards ice time on the PP, but we're gonna have two decently balanced PP units if they play their cards right.

If they up the ES minutes of (Now possibly third line players) Chytil, Kredier, and the like, we shouldn't have to see Lemieux at ES more than 9 minutes a game and the other two guys more than 5. (Though ideally they can kill penalties.)

 

[Levitate]

Offensively, they're not, but on defense, they still run back to their own net and lay out the welcome mat at the line.

Because, heaven forbid, somebody might get past Marc Staal for an odd-man rush as opposed to taking 8 shots at him.

Gonna be interesting to see Martin's effect on the defensive side of things

The thing with 4th liners is that if you're concerned with getting them minutes and trying to win matchups with them, you're robbing your more skilled players of minutes that they will very likely be more productive with. I think a good 4th line is one you can throw out there to shake up the tempo or direction of the game a bit but not run the risk of hurting you because they can't play defense or apply any pressure offensively. That 2014 4th line was real good not because they were gritty or hit a lot or anything, but because they were tenacious and could apply some offensive zone pressure even if they weren't gonna score a lot

4th line shouldn't just be a bunch of guys who hit but are terribleplayers otherwise, that just hurts you

 

[Alluckks]

Lordy, people hate on Howden an awful lot for being 22

Nobody is saying he is great, but get a grip guys

 

[bleedblue94]

Lordy, people hate on Howden an awful lot for being 22

Nobody is saying he is great, but get a grip guys

Just crushing s kid who was one of the few in our playoff debacle that showed consistent battle. He's physically maturing still, he's like a wet noodle. He needs to time. People do not like the P word

 

[Savant]

Hanifin interests me a lot. His development certainly hasn’t been a straight line but I’ve seen many young defensemen who don’t figure things out at a young age but go up from there. He was pretty good in 2018-19, not as good this year. He does have some similarities to Brady Skeji but I think he is a better player. And I think his upside is much greater.

There’s sure a lot of smoke between here and Calgary.

Hanifin is certainly a guy that could be a late bloomer, but I’m also not exactly sure what he does. Doesn’t seem like a great offensive guy or defensive guy. I think he is a better version of Skjei, but I also don’t know if that’s a compliment. I don’t know if he ever gets to that McDonagh level for example. Rangers need to be really careful that the LHD they acquire is a good fit with Trouba, because that’s where they are going to settle up. With Brodin off the board, and Dunn likely off the board, the pool is shrinking a bit.

As for his development, the guy who coached him for most of his pro career was one Bill Peters, so who knows of there is some collateral damage from that.