Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXXI: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[GoAwayPanarin]

2Cs in their prime, under contract at reasonable term, don’t grow on trees. This isn’t EA and people aren’t perfect.

I don’t want to shock you, but Kuznetsov is probably not the first NHL star that used cocaine. He wouldn’t be the first Ranger either.

Your last sentence is 100% correct.

But this trade would still be a terrible idea.

 

[Avery16]

"My sense is that Rick Tocchet's days now are probably over with the Coyotes at the end of the season. There was sense that perhaps there would be an opportunity to extend, but my sources indicate that it's more likely that Tocchet goes to the free-market."

from the mainboards

We’ve been trying to land Tocchet since 1996.

 

[Edge]

We’ve been trying to land Tocchet since 1996.

1994 even.

 

[Savant]

We’ve been trying to land Tocchet since 1996.

But is he a good coach?

feels like @bobbop would have a good handle on that

 

[Ruggs225]

Talking about Arizona, is there any chance that Hayton could be had for not too much?

i thought i remember reading that he had fallen out of favor there a couple months ago. Just thinking of a buy low prospect.

 

[Kodiak]

In the next few year his NTC becomes more manageable. I can see him on the 3rd line but not the 4th, where's this other LW coming from that's going to supplant him? People seriously undersell his importance to the team. And it's not like he's not scoring.

Who is supplanting him? It depends on how other things shake out. It could be Barron. Chytil could get pushed from center to wing. Pajuniemi might come in and make enough noise that Kakko or Kravtsov switch to LW. It may be a player we acquire or someone that comes out of left field. The point is not who supplants him. The point I am making is whether Kreider's ES production in a few years will be enough to warrant a top 9 spot. And if Kreider does not add other aspects to his game, I don't think it will.

 

[Tob]

wrong thread

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Who is supplanting him? It depends on how other things shake out. It could be Barron. Chytil could get pushed from center to wing. Pajuniemi might come in and make enough noise that Kakko or Kravtsov switch to LW. It may be a player we acquire or someone that comes out of left field. The point is not who supplants him. The point I am making is whether Kreider's ES production in a few years will be enough to warrant a top 9 spot. And if Kreider does not add other aspects to his game, I don't think it will.

I think those scenarios are highly unlikely at best to be honest. At worst, he's the teams 3rd line LW for the next three seasons. Again, people are making it out like he's currently a shell of his former self, not the case.

 

[NYR Viper]

Kreider was on pace for a career high in goals and about an average number of points. 33g and 49 points over 82 games. I am sure he isn't overly happy with his overall play if you ask him but production wise it wasn't horrible.

 

[LokiDog]

I think those scenarios are highly unlikely at best to be honest. At worst, he's the teams 3rd line LW for the next three seasons. Again, people are making it out like he's currently a shell of his former self, not the case.

Its not that he’s a shell of his former self. But he is soft and doesn’t use his size anymore. He plays just like all the other top six forwards and that’s a huge part of what our problem is. It’s a very same-y blend of guys who don’t forecheck hard and don’t play with a high motor. He did that when he was younger, but it’s disingenuous to say he still does it, and certainly with any consistency.

It isn’t about Kreider in a vacuum. On a different team he could be 1st line LW and captain. Here it’s about having too many wingers and not enough of other assets, as well as the reality of having too many big contracts. Fox, Lindgren, Shesterkin and Kakko need new contracts after next year (I think). Fox obviously is getting a pay day. We’re going to lose Buch, who is objectively better than Kreider, due to not wanting to tie more money up on the wings. We want to upgrade at center, as well as change the complexion of the roster (which means people need to be replaced - you can’t change the complexion of the roster by adding one 4th line grinder, but if Zib, Strome, Chytil, Panarin, Laf, Kreider, Kakko and Krav are all returning, where is there room to do so? We’re already likely losing Buch because we chose to re-sign Kreider, should we start shipping kids like Kravtsov and Chytil out to keep Kreider in the lineup? That’s the only way to change the complexion of the team. Change.)

In a vacuum Kreider is fine. I have a Kreider jersey. I’ve loved him as a Ranger most of his career. Still, signing him was a mistake for where we were in our rebuild and and he doesn’t make sense going forward. Offer him an opportunity to go be an impact player on a team with a top six spot open looking for a net front guy. He’ll thrive and we’ll have much more flexibility to remodel our current lineup and re-sign all of the more vital core pieces.

 

[Avery16]

Kreider was on pace for a career high in goals and about an average number of points. 33g and 49 points over 82 games. I am sure he isn't overly happy with his overall play if you ask him but production wise it wasn't horrible.

He needs to get more physically involved. He stopped caring about that aspect of the game long before we gave him that contract.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Kreider was on pace for a career high in goals and about an average number of points. 33g and 49 points over 82 games. I am sure he isn't overly happy with his overall play if you ask him but production wise it wasn't horrible.

Same story every year. Guys produces at a consistent clip and people are never happy.

 

[Fitzy]

As frustrating as Kreider has been at even strength, he's one of the very top 5 in the league in front of the net on the powerplay.

What he provides there is unique to this roster, what Buchnevich provides is not.

Add in the fact that Buchnevich will return more in a trade, and I don't think it's a Shakespearian tragedy if Kreider stays and plays 3rd line/ 1st PP duties. Hell, lowering his minutes even strength might allow him to up his intensity.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Tocchet is another bad coach that’s done nothing in Arizona.

Also, I genuinely cannot believe that anyone would want to trade Chytil or K’Andre

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Its not that he’s a shell of his former self. But he is soft and doesn’t use his size anymore. He plays just like all the other top six forwards and that’s a huge part of what our problem is. It’s a very same-y blend of guys who don’t forecheck hard and don’t play with a high motor. He did that when he was younger, but it’s disingenuous to say he still does it, and certainly with any consistency.

It isn’t about Kreider in a vacuum. On a different team he could be 1st line LW and captain. Here it’s about having too many wingers and not enough of other assets, as well as the reality of having too many big contracts. Fox, Lindgren, Shesterkin and Kakko need new contracts after next year (I think). Fox obviously is getting a pay day. We’re going to lose Buch, who is objectively better than Kreider, due to not wanting to tie more money up on the wings. We want to upgrade at center, as well as change the complexion of the roster (which means people need to be replaced - you can’t change the complexion of the roster by adding one 4th line grinder, but if Zib, Strome, Chytil, Panarin, Laf, Kreider, Kakko and Krav are all returning, where is there room to do so? We’re already likely losing Buch because we chose to re-sign Kreider, should we start shipping kids like Kravtsov and Chytil out to keep Kreider in the lineup? That’s the only way to change the complexion of the team. Change.)

In a vacuum Kreider is fine. I have a Kreider jersey. I’ve loved him as a Ranger most of his career. Still, signing him was a mistake for where we were in our rebuild and and he doesn’t make sense going forward. Offer him an opportunity to go be an impact player on a team with a top six spot open looking for a net front guy. He’ll thrive and we’ll have much more flexibility to remodel our current lineup and re-sign all of the more vital core pieces.

He's an impact player here and I don't see that changing in the next three years. And his salary will not prevent the team from keeping any player they want. If Buch is a casualty it's because of Kakko and Kravtsov.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

Do the Jackets have anything interesting for Zibanejad or Strome? They're in that "oh shit" mode apparently. Weird how they're in our real division, but they're one of those teams I draw a complete blank on.

 

[Dr. Ogrodnick]

Maybe I am too harsh on Kreider?

But just look back at his career. Since the Price thing, he hasn’t been involved in a single controversy that I can think of. Not one. Has he done one thing that the opposition team might take objection against? Kreider isn’t a fighter, or has opted to not be someone that drops his gloves when necessary. But he can at least be painful to play against.

He's had some incidents past that. Someone mentioned Brodin. He's also been playing for a coach the last 3 years who preaches no penalties and punishes players for that type of aggression. Do I like Kreider's contract? No, but a lot of that has to do with the flat cap and lafreniere, neither of which were even on the radar when the Rangers signed him, and at the time it was a below market value contract.

Do I want more from Kreider? Of course. But he is still valuable even in a 3rd line role as a guy who will play all three phases of the game, pot 15-20 goals, and can slide up and down the lineup. Plus, having a veteran winger presence who has played in two conference championships and a cup final is going to have value on a team building around young high draft pick wingers.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

So Smitty for sure is coming back next season, right?

I honestly would not be disappointed if he did on a one or two year contract.

 

[LokiDog]

Do the Jackets have anything interesting for Zibanejad or Strome? They're in that "oh shit" mode apparently. Weird how they're in our real division, but they're one of those teams I draw a complete blank on.

I’d do something around Strome and Gavrikov if we were getting a center elsewhere. Gavrikov is good friends with Artemi and a hard nosed, tough to play against LD who skates very well.

 

[cwede]

seems Brodzinski re-assigned to HWP today
so maybe Richards gets a game tomorrow ..

TheAHL.com | The American Hockey League
Date Player Team Transaction
2021-05-07 Jonny Brodzinski (RW) Hartford ADD Returned on loan from N.Y. Rangers (NHL)

 

[haveandare]

I’d do something around Strome and Gavrikov if we were getting a center elsewhere. Gavrikov is good friends with Artemi and a hard nosed, tough to play against LD who skates very well.

He’d be a perfect add. I suspect they value him more than they’d value Strome but I could be wrong.

 

[RangersFan1994]

seems Brodzinski re-assigned to HWP today
so maybe Richards gets a game tomorrow ..

TheAHL.com | The American Hockey League
Date Player Team Transaction
2021-05-07 Jonny Brodzinski (RW) Hartford ADD Returned on loan from N.Y. Rangers (NHL)

finally realized he is an AHL player. he is garbage

 

[SRHRangers]

I miss partying it up at the Tunnel and Sound Factory in the late 90’s. Certain drugs like Coke and X are not that addictive.

The real addiction could be the partying kind of lifestyle. I know a lot of good eggs who still dabble a bit on rare occasions.

I don’t think Kuz would be the athlete he is if he had a full blown addiction. His teammates and staff would intervene if that was the case, because it would be that obvious, in my opinion.

I still wouldn’t look at him as a realistic trade option for us. I think there are better candidates.

Sound Factory.... Omg, the memories lmao

 

[Kovalev27]

I’m a big fan of Chytil as you know but not in the bottom 6. I wonder if you commit to This new version of Ryan Strome. Do you want more of a sand paper defensively sound 3C . I think it’s a question Drury is probably pondering after the season.

if the plan was to move on from Strome like we had thought Chytil would have gotten those mins but not so sure now

 

[haveandare]

I’m a big fan of Chytil as you know but not in the bottom 6. I wonder if you commit to This new version of Ryan Strome. Do you want more of a sand paper defensively sound 3C . I think it’s a question Drury is probably pondering after the season.

if the plan was to move on from Strome like we had thought Chytil would have gotten those mins but not so sure now

The whole center situation is kind of tenuous. You don’t want so much turnover but both top centers are older, up for significant raises, and neither are hard to play against in any true sense.

Id love to add Larkin, but are Larkin and Chytil the top two centers on a championship caliber team long term? Maybe eventually but I don’t feel super confident about it. Imo 3C needs to be someone not necessarily tough in a classic sense but hard to play against.