Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXII: “The Year of the Plague’s” last one...

[Blue Blooded]

They could have easily gone year to year with him and gotten him on a league minimum deal for at least this season.

I love that Lou is running that team and only wish that he were younger so he could do it for longer.

Matt Martin is the type of player who shouldn't ever have gotten a contract of over 2 years. This would be his 3rd consecutive 4-year extension since his ELC.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Sweet Lou out here showing everyone why he’s GM of the year

 

[duhmetreE]

All lines have to play defense, its the new NHL.

yeah... that's my point

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

people always want the nice shiny toy. I like PLD but he seems like the type that once he gets the big money, he just stops playing good hockey. i rather take my chances with Kakko and Fox. DeAngelo and Strome I would consider trading for Dubois but no way I would trade Kakko Fox or Laf for him.

I would not consider Mika for Dubois even with Mika being an UFA in 2 years

Ew who’s saying Zib for PLD? That would be a huge downgrade. The point of getting PLD is to have a killer 1-2 punch

 

[NYR Viper]

I agree this team lacks a true defensive unit. Hopefully a few of the young guys can grab those types of roles and begin to run with them. Looking at past play in lower levels, guys like Howden and Barron should be capable of playing a strong 2-way game. It may take some time, but they should be able to develop that.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

yeah... that's my point

I don't get your point, you think a line of Laf, Chytil and Gauthier will be bad defensively? I don’t agree, if there is an issue there imo its in faceoffs. Lafreniere is as good defensively as he is offensively, Gauthier and Chytil have a ton of speed and i see that line stopping a lot of plays before they get into our end. I actually liked Chytil's neutral zone pressure in the bubble, i dont see that as a weak line like you do.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Matt Martin is the type of player who shouldn't ever have gotten a contract of over 2 years. This would be his 3rd consecutive 4-year extension since his ELC.

Lou loves him some matt Martin

 

[duhmetreE]

I don't get your point, you think a line of Laf, Chytil and Gauthier will be bad defensively? I don’t agree, if there is an issue there imo its in faceoffs. Lafreniere is as good defensively as he is offensively, Gauthier and Chytil have a ton of speed and i see that line stopping a lot of plays before they get into our end. I actually liked Chytil's neutral zone pressure in the bubble, i dont see that as a weak line like you do.

there's a learning curve. Chytil and Gauthier have been benched for extended periods of time due to their 'mistakes'.

defensive zone draws... losing 70% of faceoffs is not good for defense.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

there's a learning curve. Chytil and Gauthier have been benched for extended periods of time due to their 'mistakes'.

defensive zone draws... losing 70% of faceoffs is not good for defense.

Agree about the faceoffs but I'm willing to see how Chytil looks before thinking he's the same player we saw early last year. I thought he looked like a better player in the bubble and if he can play like that and maybe a little better with some time under his belt im good with him, adding Lafreniere to his line will help as well. As for the benchings, pretty near every young player on this team has been benched. Deangelo, Lindgren, Kakko, Buchnevich, Strome, Lemieux etc etc etc, and i thought chytil responded well afterwards.

 

[NYR Viper]

At a certain point, the team is going to need to play some of these younger guys in situations and let them learn a bit. They can't rely on the top-line for every defensive zone draw

 

[TominNC]

At a certain point, the team is going to need to play some of these younger guys in situations and let them learn a bit. They can't rely on the top-line for every defensive zone draw

Not that our top guys are all that great on FO. And it'll get no better if they get Dubois who was closer to Chytil than Mika last year.

 

[duhmetreE]

Agree about the faceoffs but I'm willing to see how Chytil looks before thinking he's the same player we saw early last year. I thought he looked like a better player in the bubble and if he can play like that and maybe a little better with some time under his belt im good with him, adding Lafreniere to his line will help as well. As for the benchings, pretty near every young player on this team has been benched. Deangelo, Lindgren, Kakko, Buchnevich, Strome, Lemieux etc etc etc, and i thought chytil responded well afterwards.

You're arguing with me but you're proving my point

They get benched for mental lapses/defensive mistakes/aloofness. We just named off half of the team... That's my original point. We do not have defensive rocks like Fast that we can rely on ( minus Zibs being our work mule ). Yes, they're young and they can improve... but potential and this year are two different things. We're getting even younger/greener with Laf and probably Barron making the team. Another rookie LHD possibly as well...

 

[mas0764]

And like clockwork you are still utterly incapable of answering the questions asked of you.

No, I’ve answered it, you just don’t like the answer. I’m clearing room for the prospects who are likely to develop so I’m not tied into Buch long term at a price I can’t afford and also so I don’t lose him for nothing.

You don’t want to do that.

That’s fine. But I’ve answered it time and time again.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

So is there a chance that PLD gets traded during this season even after signing that deal?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

So is there a chance that PLD gets traded during this season even after signing that deal?

It's always possible. Tampa traded Drouin 3 months after he ended his holdout

 

[Taluss]

So is there a chance that PLD gets traded during this season even after signing that deal?

I think it really depends on how CBJ plays this season. If they play poor I can see him gone at TDL. If they play well I think they hold onto him as long as they can or until they get a deal they can’t refuse

 

[Shesterkybomb]

You're arguing with me but you're proving my point

They get benched for mental lapses/defensive mistakes/aloofness. We just named off half of the team... That's my original point. We do not have defensive rocks like Fast that we can rely on ( minus Zibs being our work mule ). Yes, they're young and they can improve... but potential and this year are two different things. We're getting even younger/greener with Laf and probably Barron making the team. Another rookie LHD possibly as well...

I'm not proving your point, i named off half the team because it was part of the process, every player gets benched, Zib included, its how you respond that makes the difference. Laf Chytil and Gauthier should be as good a third line we have had since Hayes and Miller were on the 3rd line. You feel that the line has to be a shut down line, thats 1990s thinking, its 2021.

 

[True Blue]

No, I’ve answered it, you just don’t like the answer. I’m clearing room for the prospects who are likely to develop so I’m not tied into Buch long term at a price I can’t afford and also so I don’t lose him for nothing.

You don’t want to do that.

That’s fine. But I’ve answered it time and time again.

Yawn. Cannot name even two prospects that are knocking on the door to displace Buchnevich. Pathetic.

And very poor effort on the strawman. I have clearly stated that a discussion on whether or not he is here long term is a completely different one. If you want to pivot to debating that one, fine. But don't make attempts to tie it into "there are options to replace him" or prospects who are likely to replace him soon (pssst......still have not named them). The next time you actually answer this, will be the first time. Unless of course your position is that the likes of Kravstov or Barron are ready to replace him. And again, that is FAR different than discussing wheher or not making a long term commitment to him is wise.

 

[NYSPORTS]

I've said this many times, and it always attracts a certain poster who wants to rebut it with "BUT WHO ARE THOSE YOUNG PLAYERS WHO ARE BETTER THAN BUCH? HUH???"

Yeah it's obvious we have wings to spare. Kakko, Kravtsov, Lafreniere, Kreider has a long term deal and is going no where, Panarin has a long term deal and is going nowhere, Gautier is an option, Barron is an option. Yes Panarin Kreider and Laf are all LWs, but if you have big money tied up at LW, you don't need big money tied up at RW in non superstar players. You go with support players or younger players on the opposite wing of Panarin who are not as expensive and who do the dirty work.... or you wait until you have another legit star there like Kakk0.

Buch is simply not getting paid market price on a long term extension, and that means he's eventually gone sooner or later. And if he's eventually gone, it's more important for this team to capitalize on high value in return than it is that he occupy a roster spot to try to sneak into the playoffs or shield the kids... there are other vets who can do that.

have to hope his points skyrocket. Strategically, i wonder if the return could be a #1 for the 2022 draft. This 2021 draft looks weak IMO. Could be enticing for a team to get Buch and maintain their 2021 #1.

Not sure what the correct take is to maximize the return but i do agree, Buch isn’t here long term. This cap is unforgiving and if the Rangers find themselves with enough cap space down the road after Buch is moved, something went terribly wrong with the other prospects IMO.

 

[mas0764]

Yawn. Cannot name even two prospects that are knocking on the door to displace Buchnevich. Pathetic.

And very poor effort on the strawman. I have clearly stated that a discussion on whether or not he is here long term is a completely different one. If you want to pivot to debating that one, fine. But don't make attempts to tie it into "there are options to replace him" or prospects who are likely to replace him soon (pssst......still have not named them). The next time you actually answer this, will be the first time. Unless of course your position is that the likes of Kravstov or Barron are ready to replace him. And again, that is FAR different than discussing wheher or not making a long term commitment to him is wise.

But that's the entire debate I'm making. I'm not arguing who is better than Buch right now, which is why I was making fun of how you always bring it up. It's irrelevant. I don't need to run down the list of highly touted RW prospects we have, you and I both know who they are.

The argument is, he's not going to be here long term, ergo, he either doesn't get extended to a substantial deal and walks, or, he's traded.

I'd prefer to get something for him since he is in fact a good and valuable player, so... the latter.

And to bring it back to the post that kicked this off the other day, it's funny how you always jump to "BUT WHO IS BETTER?!?!" since it's not the point of the discussion. No one is better than him right this second. I'd still trade him rather than lock him in long term to top line money like we did with Kreider (another player who will end up being overpaid for his role eventually, due to our young wing talent), or conversely, allow him to walk for nothing. That decision may very well have to be made before one of the prospects is quite ready to be a first line RW but it's still very likely to be the right decision. If you have to put a band-aid on that spot for a while, so be it. That being said he's not being traded right now.... but at the deadline? Could you get a haul? Then I'm very interested.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Bjorkstrand signing his new deal pretty much guarantees Buch is gone as soon as the deadline

Buchnevich is a good player and I want to keep him but you can’t have him at 5 million and Kreider at 6.5 long term.

Has to be one or the other and the Rangers made their choice in February

 

[mas0764]

Bjorkstrand signing his new deal pretty much guarantees Buch is gone as soon as the deadline

Buchnevich is a good player and I want to keep him but you can’t have him at 5 million and Kreider at 6.5 long term.

Has to be one or the other and the Rangers made their choice in February

Bingo.

And you can probably get a haul for Buch. He's 25 and has low end first line metrics.... really he'd be a super second liner on a competitor.

 

[duhmetreE]

I'm not proving your point, i named off half the team because it was part of the process, every player gets benched, Zib included, its how you respond that makes the difference. Laf Chytil and Gauthier should be as good a third line we have had since Hayes and Miller were on the 3rd line. You feel that the line has to be a shut down line, thats 1990s thinking, its 2021.

No, I dont think the line needs to be shutdown. IMO the bottom 6 needs to be capable to PK, forecheck and play responsible hockey. Offense is a plus. If your bottom6 is a bunch of kids that's are 'offensive minded', there may be issues in the balance of the team. You still need roles on a team. You need good defensive players/depth and most importantly, good defensive centers.

'Part of the process' is making my point. How can you say young kids making mistakes/learning/getting benched is 'part of the process' then say they'll be 'ok' defensively? If you are making mistakes and learning, as kids will, you are not 'ok' defensively. That's the point I was making and you are making but are not connecting the same dots.

Strome is average to below average.
Chytil is average to below average and green. ( he can be good but how much defensive growth will a 21 year old show? )
Howden is this boards whipping boy.

You bring up Hayes. Hayes turned into a good defensive center. How long did it take? He was what? 24? 25?

So, where's this balance? I'm not talking about offensive talent, we have that in spades. We do not have defensive minded players or players that can excel on defense. Who are we relying on? Just ride Zibs for 25+ minutes a game? Lemieux? Barron is our hope?

As I orginially stated... This forward group, overall is bad defensively. That's a balance issue. I don't even know what you're arguing.

 

[cwede]

Bjorkstrand signing his new deal pretty much guarantees Buch is gone as soon as the deadline
Buchnevich is a good player and I want to keep him but you can’t have him at 5 million and Kreider at 6.5 long term...

wow so similar
Pavel Buchnevich Apr 17 1995
247 59 88 147
Oliver Bjorkstrand Apr 10 1995
246 65 68 133

 

[MrPodz]

Hey so I know this seems like a stretch, and he was a center, but imagine a lidstrom esque bruiser line like laf-chytil-gauthier. Thats gonna be a dirty line imo.