Prospect Info: Robert Hagg [March 2014: AAV is $925k, 3-yr ELC, per Tim P.]

[JojoTheWhale]

That's actually what kills me most about this, DH. I love that Hextall doesn't overreact to variance. I just wish the underlying approach to the game on the ice was more modern. I would probably be as much of an apologist as you are if that were the case.

 

[Curufinwe]

Yup. Hextall wanted Morin to focus on defense in juniors, when Berube was the coach.

Morin played the PP in Junior, didn't he? Hextall didn't control how the Rimouski coaches used him.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Morin played the PP in Junior, didn't he? Hextall didn't control how the Rimouski coaches used him.

This is the quote I'm referring to:

"We had a lot of conversations about him throughout training camp," Hextall said. "Obviously Sam was one (player) that played very well and opened a lot of eyes.

"The biggest fear with Sam, for me, was he goes back to junior and thinks he's something he's not ... a skilled type of player. He's got some skill. He's got a big shot. But he's got to continue to play the same game that he's played here. So the coach is on board and big Sam said, 'I'm not changed.' So he knows what he is as a player."

Flyers' Samuel Morin to GM after being cut: 'Can I get to Rimouski tonight to play?'

 

[deadhead]

That's actually what kills me most about this, DH. I love that Hextall doesn't overreact to variance. I just wish the underlying approach to the game on the ice was more modern. I would probably be as much of an apologist as you are if that were the case.

Over the years, I found that various approaches work for different organizations.
The key is to develop a philosophy that you know how to execute, and execute it well.

I think Hextall knows exactly what he wants to do, it's a hybrid of the Kings approach and a more skilled offensive attack.
Kings are built around Kopitar, Doughty and Quick, and a big, physical team that wears opponents down.
Hextall has Couts, but will probably emulate Doughty by committee, and knows he'd have to be awfully lucky to land another Quick (pray for Hart!).

Look at his 1st and 2nd rd picks (the key picks, the one with the high probability of success):
Sanheim, NAK, Provorov, Konecny, Rubtsov, Laberge, Hart, Allison, Patrick, Frost, Ratcliffe.
One big "slow" player in Allison, speedster forwards in NAK, Konecny, Rubstov, Laberge, Frost, Racliffe.
Both defensemen are full sized and mobile.
That doesn't strike me as building LA East - Hextall likes speed more than people think.

And his later draft picks certainly don't focus on size, lots of skill "fliers" like Kase, Marody, Laczynski, Sushko, Cates, Lyksell.

This suggests to me he wants an attacking team, mobile defensemen, fast fowards, with a few "jolly green Giants" to screen goalies and provide protection.

Which is why I see guys like Hagg as afterthoughts, players who are filling in but will eventually be pushed aside as the prospects arrive.

 

[CapnZin]

Over the years, I found that various approaches work for different organizations.
The key is to develop a philosophy that you know how to execute, and execute it well.

I think Hextall knows exactly what he wants to do, it's a hybrid of the Kings approach and a more skilled offensive attack.
Kings are built around Kopitar, Doughty and Quick, and a big, physical team that wears opponents down.
Hextall has Couts, but will probably emulate Doughty by committee, and knows he'd have to be awfully lucky to land another Quick (pray for Hart!).

Look at his 1st and 2nd rd picks (the key picks, the one with the high probability of success):
Sanheim, NAK, Provorov, Konecny, Rubtsov, Laberge, Hart, Allison, Patrick, Frost, Ratcliffe.
One big "slow" player in Allison, speedster forwards in NAK, Konecny, Rubstov, Laberge, Frost, Racliffe.
Both defensemen are full sized and mobile.
That doesn't strike me as building LA East - Hextall likes speed more than people think.

And his later draft picks certainly don't focus on size, lots of skill "fliers" like Kase, Marody, Laczynski, Sushko, Cates, Lyksell.

This suggests to me he wants an attacking team, mobile defensemen, fast fowards, with a few "jolly green Giants" to screen goalies and provide protection.

Which is why I see guys like Hagg as afterthoughts, players who are filling in but will eventually be pushed aside as the prospects arrive.

I do like this synopsis on Hexys managing style. I do, however, think the analysis on Hagg may be outdated.

I wish I could find the article or podcast or wherever I heard this- but apparently Hextall told Hagg (back when he first started in the AHL) that if he wanted to make the flyers, he would have to play a shutdown game (physical, puck moving, zone exit passer). His 2-way game has always heavily favored that of the d zone. Hextall saw that he could be a good Dman if he changed his game. I think if Hagg stayed in his 2-way game, he wouldn't be able to play in the NHL. As a shutdown Dman he's proved valuable so far making limited mistakes.

His shot isn't anything special and neither are his hands in the offensive sense. Focusing his game on the d zone allows him to not focus on next pass plays to the ozone or the neutral zone. He's done real well next to Ghost because of this.

I don't think that he is just a spot holder anymore.

 

[deadhead]

Hagg is the 6th/7th D-man, depending on how Morin and Myers develop, and also depending on matchups.
On the road, especially the bigger West Coast teams, there's a place for a Hagg in the D-rotation.
Against faster teams, he'll have to speed up his decision making and improve his outlet passes.

Teams aren't built just around stars, how many top teams field more than two good lines, and fill out the bottom two lines with checkers and grinders?
Same on defense, good teams usually have 4 solid D-men and 2 guys who play 15 minutes a night bringing up the rear.
There's a place for guys like Hagg and Laughton, just not in the top 6 or top 4.

I don't bring the same expectations to role players as I do to potential stars.

Konecny as a 4th line checker can skate and force things, a superior version of Leier, Konency as a top 6 winger playing 17 minutes a night has to be stronger, more defensively responsible and a much better shooter (10-12%, not 6%).

Hagg shouldn't be getting top 4 minutes, and won't be once Sanheim steals his TOI by his play on the ice.
So I don't care about Hagg so much as the progress of Sanheim, Morin and Myers.

 

[Striiker]

If it were possible for Sanheim to steal time from Hagg by being the better player then their icetime would be swapped.

In reality, Hagg gets so much time because we have an incompetent coach who has proved time and time again that he likes guys that hurt the team.

Any other excuse is a complete fabrication.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Let's stop calling Hagg a 6/7. He's top 4 by every measure except actual results.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Can’t wait for the goalposts to be moved again next year when Hagg is still a top 4 defender.

 

[RANKKA]

 

[deadhead]

Hagg down to 19 minues, Sanheim up to 17 minutes.

 

[FLYguy3911]

They credited Hagg's last shift to Sanheim. He played 19:30 which was above his season average.

 

[sa cyred]

Let's stop calling Hagg a 6/7. He's top 4 by every measure except actual results.

Eh, where one plays doesn’t define where they should be playing. Because that would mean Sanheim is a 5/6/7 defender.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Eh, where one plays doesn’t define where they should be playing. Because that would mean Sanheim is a 5/6/7 defender.

...

Hagg is the 6th/7th D-man

Sanheim is the 5/6/7.

 

[sa cyred]

...


Sanheim is the 5/6/7.

Haha my fault! You don’t often quote people so didn’t know who you were responding to (and admit I haven’t really read this thread in days)

 

[Curufinwe]

Hagg got his first goal, and Sanheim had the best CF% on the team. Not a bad night for the two top 6 rookie dmen.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Haha my fault! You don’t often quote people so didn’t know who you were responding to (and admit I haven’t really read this thread in days)

I try to save people the headache of re-reading someone's posts.

 

[Hockeypete49]

Let's stop calling Hagg a 6/7. He's top 4 by every measure except actual results.

I agree with you 100% Clearly some people are basing Hagg on stats alone and they would be wrong.

 

[FatTugboatFlahr]

Damn, Pete.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

What are some of you getting him for Christmas? I hope it's an outlet pass.

 

[whitstifier]

Was expecting an extension after that big night

 

[Curufinwe]

I'd get big Sam a gift instead since he's making $70,000, and Hagg's making $832,500.

 

[Striiker]

A typical terrible pass and then this...



Talk about a "brainfart" and "egregious mistake".

 

[FLYguy3911]

Didn't even get benched. Literally was on the ice for the next faceoff. Hak broke the cardinal rule of hockey.

 

[Striiker]

Meanwhile Sanheim is benched because Hakstol doesn't like which skate he puts on first.