Rielly vs. Hyman
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Teeder Keon
Defeat does not rest lightly on their shoulders
Keep both as they are terrific players and we need more stand up , Professional, team first , talented players like them
Stellar leadership qualities and in the prime of their careers .....
Stellar leadership qualities and in the prime of their careers .....
If Rielly wants $8-9M you say....welcome back Zach did you want Morgan's locker stall or keep yours?
kevsh
Registered User
- Nov 28, 2018
- 3,885
- 5,503
I get money/cap issues is a big part of the equation, but without knowing what they are asking for I'm taking the easy way out and comparing them based purely on their contribution, age and how the team would fare without them.
My case for Reilly:
- Reilly is 2 years younger, so not a big advantage but still a plus.
- Reilly is arguably the #1 defenceman, but clearly their top LD with no one else in the organization likely to take that away from him anytime soon: After Morgan you've got Muzzin, Dermott (assume for a minute he's not taken by the Kraken) and Sandin. Muzzin is a decent second-pairing guy, Dermott is nowhere close and Sandin is likely a few years away, if ever.
- Hyman plays the least important position (LW) and if gone, certainly the Leafs will be weak on that side (Foligno won't be back), but not nearly the impact of losing your top LD.
Make no mistake I really, really hope the Leafs re-sign Hyman and agree with everyone who recognizes what he brings to the team. Losing him would be a big loss, but if I had to pick only one, again money/term notwithstanding, based on what the team would look like afterwards, Reilly is the choice.
My case for Reilly:
- Reilly is 2 years younger, so not a big advantage but still a plus.
- Reilly is arguably the #1 defenceman, but clearly their top LD with no one else in the organization likely to take that away from him anytime soon: After Morgan you've got Muzzin, Dermott (assume for a minute he's not taken by the Kraken) and Sandin. Muzzin is a decent second-pairing guy, Dermott is nowhere close and Sandin is likely a few years away, if ever.
- Hyman plays the least important position (LW) and if gone, certainly the Leafs will be weak on that side (Foligno won't be back), but not nearly the impact of losing your top LD.
Make no mistake I really, really hope the Leafs re-sign Hyman and agree with everyone who recognizes what he brings to the team. Losing him would be a big loss, but if I had to pick only one, again money/term notwithstanding, based on what the team would look like afterwards, Reilly is the choice.
Honestly Hyman and I didn't even have to think twice about it.
Matthews4Calder
Registered User
Sandin is a few years away if ever? Really. Kid has to play and given a chance. I like Morgan always have but he is not a #1 D man. Makes way too many mistakes defensively, can't quarterback a PP as he has no shot and quite honestly is not worth what he might command. Said it numerous times here and another site. Due to our cap issues and overpayment for the big 4 unless Reilly doesn't ask for the moon I would trade him in the off season. Leafs have made the mistake of losing free agents for nothing IE Bozak, JVR etc etc. Don't let that happen if Dubas can recoup some picks, prospects do it. Sandin is not as far away as you think and quite frankly brings the same intangibles as Morgan. Keep Hyman because he works his ass off not the most talented guy but deserving of a raise. Question is how much.
Cpt Maple Leaf
Registered User
- Jul 19, 2009
- 1,568
- 558
Dubas has to be checking all options before re-signing either. If there is a reasonable replacement for either at a discount, I think he has to really consider this and depending on who is available, it could even mean an upgrade. Gotta let it all play out imho.
This question is flawed IMO...
It shouldn't, and cannot be a decision of Rielly versus Hyman -- the decision as to whether or not to sign a player has to be made based on the merits of signing that player for that term.
If Hyman is willing to sign something to the tune of $4.25 to $4.5m X 5 years; then yes, sign him.... move Kerfoot (if Seattle didn't take him) and spend ~$2 - $2.5m on a forward to replace him. If Hyman wants $5m+; forget it. He's a valuable player, no doubt, but you can get hardworking, low-creativity players for a lot less than that.
Rielly is a bit more difficult question -- given that at a hometown discount of his fair market value (somewhere around $8m x 8 I'd imagine), the salary structure just may not work with being able to keep all of the Big 4 up front and Brodie/Muzzin on the backend. Whether you have Zach Hyman at $4.25m or some other similar player at $3.5m isn't going to determine whether Rielly is going to continue as the face of the D.
It shouldn't, and cannot be a decision of Rielly versus Hyman -- the decision as to whether or not to sign a player has to be made based on the merits of signing that player for that term.
If Hyman is willing to sign something to the tune of $4.25 to $4.5m X 5 years; then yes, sign him.... move Kerfoot (if Seattle didn't take him) and spend ~$2 - $2.5m on a forward to replace him. If Hyman wants $5m+; forget it. He's a valuable player, no doubt, but you can get hardworking, low-creativity players for a lot less than that.
Rielly is a bit more difficult question -- given that at a hometown discount of his fair market value (somewhere around $8m x 8 I'd imagine), the salary structure just may not work with being able to keep all of the Big 4 up front and Brodie/Muzzin on the backend. Whether you have Zach Hyman at $4.25m or some other similar player at $3.5m isn't going to determine whether Rielly is going to continue as the face of the D.
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BertCorbeau
F*ck cancer - RIP Fugu and Buffaloed
Hyman .. The Leafs have a health pipeline of potential top 4 defensemen in the system long term.
They don't have many guys like Hyman, and it's clear the difference he makes up front.
Also Hyman's contract is likely to be much more valuable than Rielly's.
They don't have many guys like Hyman, and it's clear the difference he makes up front.
Also Hyman's contract is likely to be much more valuable than Rielly's.
MR4
Registered User
- Oct 20, 2014
- 6,270
- 2,253
If cap wasn’t a thing, I’d most likely pick Rielly, but off cap prioritization & substitutes available, I think I go Hyman
Martin Skoula
Registered User
- Oct 18, 2017
- 12,509
- 17,626
Rielly's going to have a hell of a time explaining how he's 3-4 million dollars better than Brodie.
Stonehands1990
Registered User
- Apr 2, 2021
- 1,381
- 1,454
Agreed. I’m hoping to have Rielly signed for 7.0 x 8 years max and we’ll front load the bell out of it. Anything more he can walk
Depends on contracts. I'm less optimistic than most about Hymans potential contract.
I just don't see a realistic scenario how Hyman only gets contract in the low 4's like that's been thrown around on this board.
- He's paced for 30 goals, 60 points the last two seasons.
- Provides PK value, and can play the PP if required.
- Can play anywhere in the lineup and be effective.
- Provides intangibles and is the type of player every team wants to add to their lineup.
I think his contract starts at 5 minimum, and it wouldn't shock me to see it go as high as 6-6.5mil.
I just don't see a realistic scenario how Hyman only gets contract in the low 4's like that's been thrown around on this board.
- He's paced for 30 goals, 60 points the last two seasons.
- Provides PK value, and can play the PP if required.
- Can play anywhere in the lineup and be effective.
- Provides intangibles and is the type of player every team wants to add to their lineup.
I think his contract starts at 5 minimum, and it wouldn't shock me to see it go as high as 6-6.5mil.
Brain says Rielly. Heart says Hyman.
Hyman is my favorite Leaf so..
Hyman is my favorite Leaf so..
CelticDruid
Registered User
Reilly skates well, but that's about it.
Couldn't defend if his life depends on it.
I would rather that we picked up a physical defenceman that could defend and box out opposing forwards than an overpriced soft marshmallow who has struggled for the past two years.
Hyman all the way!
Grit, goals, tenacity, skating ability, and overall good defensive abilities.
You don't subtract this quality if Hyman stays, but if he leaves in favor of Reilly staying-then these qualities will be sorely missed.
Couldn't defend if his life depends on it.
I would rather that we picked up a physical defenceman that could defend and box out opposing forwards than an overpriced soft marshmallow who has struggled for the past two years.
Hyman all the way!
Grit, goals, tenacity, skating ability, and overall good defensive abilities.
You don't subtract this quality if Hyman stays, but if he leaves in favor of Reilly staying-then these qualities will be sorely missed.
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A lot of assumptions here.
A top defenceman is worth more than a winger. Harder to find, and harder to replace.
I keep Reilly over everyone but Matthews -- and maybe Marner -- and a top-notch goalie if they had one.
A top defenceman is worth more than a winger. Harder to find, and harder to replace.
I keep Reilly over everyone but Matthews -- and maybe Marner -- and a top-notch goalie if they had one.
For a player to receive a salary, some GM has to think that's the best way he can spend his money.
Who the heck is going to think that a low-skill, average-sized player, that works really hard, but doesn't necessarily "play hard" (i.e. Tom Wilson), who generally rides shotgun with 2 of the best offensive players in the league is the best way to spend $6m+ with term in a flat-cap environment?
Zach Hyman is not a unicorn. There are a lot of guys out there who do similar things to him. Very few of them have teammates like Matthews & Marner.
Alex Iafallo got $4m x 4 years
Tyler Toffoli got $4.25m x 4 years
Scott Laughton got $3m x 5 years
Adam Lowry got $3.25m x 5 years
Tanner Pearson got $3.25m x 3 years
The Brendan Ghallager comparisons aren't at all realistic. Ghallager led his team in scoring; and is a pest to boot.
Do I love my son more than my daughter. Dude.
I think a mercenary, like Dubas might even let them both go.
Remember PILAR.....
But both have been great, so let s the chat go. I don't want to go into it.
NBA, chumps make more than matthew and marner and they are okay, but wow. Things are out of whack.
Paskal Si.... Norman Powell.....
Making Absurd money.
Marner and Mattews together making less than
Norman Powell.....
I think a mercenary, like Dubas might even let them both go.
Remember PILAR.....
But both have been great, so let s the chat go. I don't want to go into it.
NBA, chumps make more than matthew and marner and they are okay, but wow. Things are out of whack.
Paskal Si.... Norman Powell.....
Making Absurd money.
Marner and Mattews together making less than
Norman Powell.....
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Previous 2 seasons prior to signing their deals:
Iafallo: 113GP, 28G, 41A, 69P, 0.61PPG (16PPP)
Toffoli: 150GP, 37G, 41A, 78P, 0.52PPG (15PPP)
Laughton: 93GP, 20G, 24A, 44P, O.47PPG (0PPP)
Lowry: 95GP, 12G, 18A, 30P, 0.32PPG (2PPP)
Pearson: 105GP, 29G, 29A, 58P, 0.55PPG (13PPP)
Hyman: 94GP, 36G, 34A, 70P, 0.75PPG (11PPP)
Gallagher: 141GP, 55G, 40A, 95P, 0.67PPG (12PPP)
Bluelines
Python FTW!
- Nov 17, 2013
- 12,349
- 4,559
Very few of them have a GM like Dubas, the dude likes to spend like he's a teen aged girl with daddy's credit card on Black Friday.
Bluelines
Python FTW!
- Nov 17, 2013
- 12,349
- 4,559
Reilly is a 5.5 maybe 6 million at most and if he wants more than you trade him.
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