Projected Better Pairing - Fox/Lindgren vs. McDonagh/Sauer?

[usekakkorightquinn]

Sauer was unbelievable. Before his concussion issues I thought he was on track to be a lot better than Girardi or Staal. I've said it many times. If he never gets concussions, we win 1 cup or 2 or 3. He was that good and our fans often forget that.

 

[Edge]

McDonagh-Sauer in 2010-11:

52.79CF%, 60.86xGF%

f*** Dion Phaneuf and his dumb face for taking this away from the Rangers.

Unfortunately for Sauer, I feel like if it wasn't Phaneuf it was going to be someone else.

He slipped to us in 2005 because of injuries, he lost a lot of time in the AHL because of injuries and flew under the radar a bit, his brother had a littany of injuries that ended his career before 30.

In some ways, part of me thinks the Sauers were in the same boat as the Lindros brothers. Their bodies were just not meant for longevity in the NHL.

 

[aufheben]

Yup the hype/rumors/trade for Adam Fox reminded me of Erixon

For sure.

 

[SickNice]

Unfortunately for Sauer, I feel like if it wasn't Phaneuf it was going to be someone else.

He slipped to us in 2005 because of injuries, he lost a lot of time in the AHL because of injuries and flew under the radar a bit, his brother had a littany of injuries that ended his career before 30.

In some ways, part of me thinks the Sauers were in the same boat as the Lindros brothers. Their bodies were just not meant for longevity in the NHL.

Yeah I agree. Especially given the style of his game and how he plays. It's same reason I knew Lindros' run here wouldn't end well - you can't change how you play and the way those guys played they were going to get banged up.

 

[Edge]

I will say this, Fox completely destroyed my expectations.

I knew he was very good. I know the price the Rangers paid was very good.

But he blew past any performance I could’ve expected.

Most people I talked to had him pegged as a second pairing guy. You talk to them now and they’ll tell you, “Yeah, this kid definitely has the potential to play on a top pair for a championship team.”

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

I think we’re seeing some revisionist history with the “Sauer is so far ahead of Lindgren” posts

let’s remember that Sauer was 23 when he made it on the roster. Lindgren made the roster as a 21 year old. Let’s see what Lindgren looks like when he’s 23.

 

[SA16]

I would take the side that has two good players on it.

 

[BroadwayStorm]

Sauer was unbelievable. Before his concussion issues I thought he was on track to be a lot better than Girardi or Staal. I've said it many times. If he never gets concussions, we win 1 cup or 2 or 3. He was that good and our fans often forget that.

oh stop. Our problem was scoring, not defense.

 

[Edge]

I think we’re seeing some revisionist history with the “Sauer is so far ahead of Lindgren” posts

let’s remember that Sauer was 23 when he made it on the roster. Lindgren made the roster as a 21 year old. Let’s see what Lindgren looks like when he’s 23.

Sauer was also a Ranger for less than 100 games. I really liked him, even going back to before we drafted him. But the legend of Sauer has kind of grown with time because it's sprinkled with what-ifs and lacks a lot of the bumps in the road that accompanies a longer career in the NHL.

It's also worth noting that combined, Lindgren and Sauer have only played about the equivalent of two full NHL seasons in their respective careers.

Even if we factor in Fox, 3 of the 4 guys in this conversation have played a combined 333 games. So it's really hard to gauge anything right now.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Sauer was also a Ranger for less than 100 games. I really liked him, even going back to before we drafted him. But the legend of Sauer has kind of grown with time because it's sprinkled with what-ifs and lacks and of the bumps in the road that accompanies a longer career in the NHL.

It's also worth noting that combined, Lindgren and Sauer have only played about the equivalent of two full NHL seasons in their respective careers.

Even if we factor in Fox, 3 of the 4 guys in this conversation have played a combined 333 games. So it's really hard to gauge anything right now.

Imagine if Girardi got hurt in 2008, he'd a god here.

 

[Fitzy]

Sauer was also a Ranger for less than 100 games. I really liked him, even going back to before we drafted him. But the legend of Sauer has kind of grown with time because it's sprinkled with what-ifs and lacks and of the bumps in the road that accompanies a longer career in the NHL.

It's also worth noting that combined, Lindgren and Sauer have only played about the equivalent of two full NHL seasons in their respective careers.

Even if we factor in Fox, 3 of the 4 guys in this conversation have played a combined 333 games. So it's really hard to gauge anything right now.

Yep.

And we are unclear on how Sauer would have handled work under Alain Vigneault. He was very much a prototypical Torts defenseman and could have very easily struggled under a different scheme.

 

[Edge]

Yep.

And we are unclear on how Sauer would have handled work under Alain Vigneault. He was very much a prototypical Torts defenseman and could have very easily struggled under a different scheme.

Or like a lot of young players, the league adjusts and sometimes the young player doesn't adjust or evolve enough to thrive.

 

[Fitzy]

Or like a lot of young players, the league adjusts and sometimes the young player doesn't adjust or evolve enough to thrive.

Yeah, I always harken back to the Dark Knight "Either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villian" with hockey careers, lol.

It'd be nice to once in a while have a long career Ranger go out with a bang rather than a whimper. I guess that's what jersey retirements are for.

 

[Edge]

Yeah, I always harken back to the Dark Knight "Either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villian" with hockey careers, lol.

It'd be nice to once in a while have a long career Ranger go out with a bang rather than a whimper. I guess that's what jersey retirements are for.

That's why championships and jersey celebrations should truly be cherished events.

It's damn hard to reach those levels and the vast majority of players never reach that accomplishment.

Lundqvist is a prime example. There's a guy with years and years of excellence. He didn't win a cup, but he'll have his jersey retired.

It makes me want to carry him as a backup, win a cup, and have our captain hand it right over to him.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

That's why championships and jersey celebrations should truly be cherished events.

It's damn hard to reach those levels and the vast majority of players never reach that accomplishment.

Lundqvist is a prime example. There's a guy with years and years of excellence. He didn't win a cup, but he'll have his jersey retired.

It makes me want to carry him as a backup, win a cup, and have our captain hand it right over to him.

What I don't understand is as a competitor why does Lundqvist want to win the cup on the bench? I know that if I never played a game I'd feel worse winning the cup than if I was never on the team. I guess he'd get 25-30 games in the regular season and that's not nothing.

 

[BroadwayStorm]

I want Henrik to win a cup as a Ranger and lift the cup before anyone else because no one in franchise history deserves it more.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

I don’t know man, maybe I’m wrong but it seems like the farther we’ve gotten from his career ending the better people remember him as.

I mean he's a guy who got consistent albeit moderate Norris trophy consideration (he was regularly finishing Top-15, not Top-5 or 3) for a bunch of years in a row.

I hope you're right that Fox will be better but to claim he will be already is pretty bold.

If anything, I actually think McDonagh is sort of underrated by Ranger fans nowadays. I think his legacy is a guy who wasn't a leader and couldn't handle the C and someone who got overrated over time.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Yep.

And we are unclear on how Sauer would have handled work under Alain Vigneault. He was very much a prototypical Torts defenseman and could have very easily struggled under a different scheme.

If they win the Cup in 2012, Torts may not have been fired after 2013.

 

[patnyrnyg]

What I don't understand is as a competitor why does Lundqvist want to win the cup on the bench? I know that if I never played a game I'd feel worse winning the cup than if I was never on the team. I guess he'd get 25-30 games in the regular season and that's not nothing.

I agree. I can't see him accepting a trade to be a back-up, even if the team has a better chance to win the Cup next year than the Rangers

 

[Igor Shestyorkin]

Sauer was really powerful but he had all the concussions. Only played about parts of 2 seasons. Staal was rock solid and had that poke move and long reach that really disarmed guys like Crosby and Ovechkin but lost his effectiveness when he lost his vision. And Girardi was a f***ing stud stay at home defender when he was young. He blocked so many shots, he was fearless. He always moved his feet and was very mobile in his own end and would blanket people. The first few years McD was a monster. As soon as they put the C on him he started to decline for us, also dragging the corpse of a banged up Girardi didnt help him. But for a period in the late 2000s we had some stud defensemen.

I think Lindgren is Girardiesque with a little bit more sandpaper, basically an undersized Sauer. But Fox is not the same kind of player as McD. McD was a complete defensemen with plus mobility and speed. Fox lacks speed but he has the moves and the brain and offensive acumen McD could only dream of. Completely different players. As a defenseman McD runs him over, but as an offensive Dman its not close. Fox is also a more calm player.

I don’t think the argument is Fox being the same as McD. That much is obvious. Fox has already displayed an elite IQ, high end stickhandling and elite passing abilities. Only thing McD has on him offensively is his shot, and I believe Fox is an underrated defensive player. But McDonagh was an absolute treat to watch one on one defensively and even when backchecking on people.

 

[aufheben]

I mean he's a guy who got consistent albeit moderate Norris trophy consideration (he was regularly finishing Top-15, not Top-5 or 3) for a bunch of years in a row.

I hope you're right that Fox will be better but to claim he will be already is pretty bold.

If anything, I actually think McDonagh is sort of underrated by Ranger fans nowadays. I think his legacy is a guy who wasn't a leader and couldn't handle the C and someone who got overrated over time.

I’ve simply never seen a defenseman who reads the ice like Fox.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Saw this earlier. Long and lots of clips, but a great write up on Fox.

 

[Larrybiv]

Not to be a wise guy or anything but, the true better pairing would have been McDonough and Fox. I mean can you just imagine?

 

[Larrybiv]

Not to be a wise guy or anything but, the true better pairing would have been McDonough and Fox. I mean, can you just imagine?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Check my username

Does he work at McDonald's now?