SillyRabbit
Trix Are For Kids
- Jan 3, 2006
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Pro Tank Thread "You said that we'd be better now, better now. But you always let us down."
- Thread starter Jack Burton
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Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
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I can’t speak on behalf of other anti-tankers, but this is what I want.....and have wanted since the start of the 2014-2015 season.
1) The Canucks to have a room full of character guys filled with a good mix of young players and vets that were either elite players at one point, or have always been renowned lockerroom leaders both on and off the ice.
2) A slow yet consistent infusion of youth into the line-up that replace vets and EARN their spots rather than it being given to them.
3) A steady increase in the quality of our prospect pool obtained from all rounds of drafting. Rebuilding a farm that Mike Gillis completely and utterly destroyed and abandoned (which is a major reason why the Canucks fell off a cliff after 2013 and why Mike Gillis hasn’t been employed since being unceremoniously fired).
4) The Canucks competing hard every night and doing whatever they can do realistically be in contention for the playoffs. IF they make it? Great! The kids get playoff experience which is crucial to their development. If they don’t make and bomb in the standings? Great! Their chances of landing a top quality prospect increases ten-fold.
That’s what I’ve always wanted for this team since our rebuild started in 2014 when we traded Luongo.
Tanking and bombing in the standings is not the end all and be all.
Compete hard all year, have the right vets in the room to hold the kids accountable, get the kids practicing the right habits both on and off the ice, and let the chips fall where they may.
Great prospects can be obtained from any part of the draft. Case in point - Brock Boeser. Furthermore, the lottery system can unexpectedly reward teams that don’t deliberately tank. New Jersey and Philly from 2017 say hi. Carolina from last year says hi.
By selling off all/most vets, only having PTO vets, and bombing in the standings, a team runs a major risk of demoralizing the youth on the team while getting said youth to engage in bad on ice and off ice habits.
Rebuilds take time. 5-7 years. Sometime between 2019-2021, I expect to see some promising things from this organization.
Play as hard as you want, but get high picks in the end. The kind that lead to a Pettersson or Quinn Hughes. You can’t build a strong future from where we are today picking 11th or 12th in the draft, or hoping for lucky strikes like Boeser as 23. We’re more likely to miss on those (Pastrnak in 2014) than hit the majority of times. I do agree we need to continue to build up the prospect pool for depth but you absolutely need talents like Pettersson at the core of a Cup contender and the fastest and surest way to find those is at the top of the draft. The key with tanking is to make those picks count and not blow them on guys like Yakupov or Juolevi. It’s not perfect but for a team in Vancouver’s situation - which isn’t even tanking by choice - it’s the best strategy available.
Given the draft lottery odds I just want the team to play hard every night. We will end up with a high pick in any event. The odds of getting the first overall aren’t that great no matter where you finish.
That’s true but it’s not entirely about getting 1st OA. There are still increased odds to picking #2 and #3, plus if you get the worst luck and drop 3 spots it still leaves you higher up in the order.
It’s not about expecting to win the #1 pick, it’s about setting yourself up with the best odds to pick as high as possible.
Besides, asking the team to play hard and losing a lot of games aren’t mutually exclusive things. They can co-exist nicely in a world where we have an atrocious defense and sketchy goaltending.
Outside of 14-15 when it was lead by holdover prospects and vets, our farm team has been pretty mediocre.
Elias GOATtersson
Registered User
- Jan 8, 2011
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It’s been said a thousand times. Being 31st overall isn’t just about the possibility of a first overall pick. Every pick in subsequent rounds is virtually a late n-1th round pick (i.e. their 2nd round pick is basically a late 1st, etc), which is incredibly valuable.
For sure. On your last para especially I see us getting a high pick no matter what. So I’m just going to cheer for the team, hope the young guys improve both in the NHL and elsewhere and expect a good effort every night.
Pettersson alone may be worth tuning into the games. Haven’t been this excited about a rookie since Bure! And that’s a long time.
Agree re: Pettersson and tbh it will be easier THIS season to be happy about a win as it is likely to be the product of our younger players having great games than in past when it was often a big game from the Sedins or Ryan Miller in net. Those were the wins that were hardest to reconcile with wanting a high pick to facilitate a rebuild. This season I’m still generally hoping for (and expecting) a low finish, but if Pettersson, Brock, Horvat, and perhaps Goldobin or a call up (Dahlen, Gaudette) help drive some wins, I won’t mind that either.
Ironically the first pick of the 2nd round has had a strangely awful success rate relative to the 2nd round average.
But yes, it is 100% a huge advantage. Especially just securing the best chances to stay Top-3.
Bankerguy
Registered User
- Apr 28, 2013
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Obviously landing 1OA and scoring Hughes would be Huge for this organization (see what i did there 
)
However... there is high end talent in spots 2 through 5
Kakko, Cozens, Podkolzin all look great. First liner player great. I think this draft is better than last years at the higher end.
Kirby Dach at 5th overall is probably a step behind the other 4 but man he looks like such a sure bet...
If the Canucks tank this year and trade-away some older players and score another 2nd or 3rd, that would be so ideal.
)However... there is high end talent in spots 2 through 5
Kakko, Cozens, Podkolzin all look great. First liner player great. I think this draft is better than last years at the higher end.
Kirby Dach at 5th overall is probably a step behind the other 4 but man he looks like such a sure bet...
If the Canucks tank this year and trade-away some older players and score another 2nd or 3rd, that would be so ideal.
Rebuild does not have to take 5-7 years if the GM is anything more than a gibbering lunatic in a straight jacket.
Look at the Leafs, rebuild started 2015 when Kessel was dealt, 2 years after they are back in playoffs, and now they are still trending up.
EDIT: also, what kind of f***ing rebuild team has 20 million tied to 5 useless piles of garbage for 4 years down the road?
Look at the Leafs, rebuild started 2015 when Kessel was dealt, 2 years after they are back in playoffs, and now they are still trending up.
EDIT: also, what kind of f***ing rebuild team has 20 million tied to 5 useless piles of garbage for 4 years down the road?
Billy Kvcmu
Registered User
I just think it’s really funny that I got labeled as Benning supporter even though l’ve been on the tank and anti- Benning for 3 years already, that guy was firing shot blindly
Melvin
21/12/05
I got labeled a Benning supporter when I joinedl, because I disagreed with CanaFan about something. RobertKron accused me of being one of Abbadons accounts.
People should probably chill on the us vs them stuff.
I actually don't mind if people put up reasonable argument that Dim Jim isn't just a drooling idiot sitting behind the controls of Springfield Nuclear. Keyword here is "reasonable". If someone say hey he did well trading in Dahlen for us and he hit the mark with BB6 and EP40, I will absolutely agree with them. Hell I'm even willing to give the dear leader a pass on Kesler trade if it comes down to the details and circumstances.
Instead what I see mostly are "oh JV is totally better than Nylander" type of useless drivel, stupid bullshit "facts" made up on the spot, and constant discredit of any and all sources that provide sound examples of Dim Jim's monumental idiocy.
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Jack Hughes would be great, but I'd prefer if we could somehow get a top defenseman wherever we end up picking. The Canucks need D so badly. Unfortunately, this draft doesn't seem top-heavy with D.
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
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The Leafs rebuild did not start in 2015, lmao.
You do realize that they haven’t won a playoff round since 2002 right?
The Leafs started rebuilding slightly at or before Sundin left them......to you know....play with us? 9.5 years ago?
leafs failed their first rebuild when they thought phaneuf and kessel as the core will carry them forward.
they realized how awful the team is and decided "ok f*** it" and traded away their core, hoarded up picks, and with careful planning and some luck, they achieved in 3 years what Dim Jim couldn't even pretend to dream to do in 5.
stampedingviking
Registered User
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
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LOL.
It doesn’t work like that mate.
Leafs haven’t won a playoff round since 2002, and they kept trying to make a push for the cup until.....what? (2008ish?). Shortly before Sundin left (although my memory is getting foggy).
The Canucks began their rebuild the first year they missed the playoffs after a long time (2014).
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y2kcanucks
Better than you
Actually it does work like that. The Leafs initial rebuild was around Kessel and Phaneuf, and was more of a retool than a rebuild. They were awful. Then Shanahan came in and decided to blow it up. That was the successful rebuild.
But you can keep piping that stat about them having not won a playoff series since 2002 as if it means anything.
Yes, it does.
What is a rebuild? It's when you toss out the current core and replacing it with new core and younger talents. Simple as that.
Just because you say it "doesn't work like that, mate" does not make it true.
Look it up anywhere, Leafs recent rebuild process is hailed as success by almost everyone.
How about finding some sources to back up your ri-f***ing-diculous bullshit claims? Is there anyone who thinks Leafs' current roster and state of the team is the direct result of what you are claiming as the 2002 rebuild?
Melvin
21/12/05
Oh my goodness are people still trying to make that ridiculous claim? Yes, successful rebuilds typically span over fifteen different management regimes. Of course. I guess we can fire Benning mid rebuild then. Perfect.
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