GDT: Preseason Game 5. Kraken @ Oilers beer leaguer. Streaming on Oilers+ at 7 pm

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

The thing is Lavoie is 24 and has already played over 200 AHL games. I don't think he necessarily needs to play more big minutes at the AHL level to progress. He needs to practice and play against NHLers and get used to NHL speed. Even if he's not in the starting 12 forwards I think you keep him up and rotate him in, especially considering his 775K cap hit.

I think your argument makes sense for a guy like Philp way more than Lavoie.

I believe the Oilers will want to accrue cap so they can address their needs at RD on or before the TDL. Not putting Kane on LTIR means he is our 13th F and they only go with 12 healthy forwards.

That means Lavoie has to displace someone in the top 9 which I don’t see happening. Therefore he has to bring a 4th line game to the rink day in and day out without being on special teams. I don’t see him beating out Podkolzin on 4LW. On 4RW he might beat Perry but I highly doubt the team farms out Perry if they go with 12F so it’s moot.

If Philp makes the team Ryan probably shifts to RW displacing Perry as Ryan is a core PKer and ability to play C.

If they do go with 13F + Kane I think Philp is ahead of him because he’s a sizeable right shot C and can PK. So he might have to beat Philp for the 13F job and that will be tough given the need for right shot centers.

Finally even if he makes the team to have him play 6-7 minutes a night on the 4th line or be a bench warmer is wasted on a young player as we’ve seen so many times in the stunted development of many an Oiler forward.

Just my thoughts. 5 games into preseason is pretty meaningless as we’ve seen before. I’d be curious to see how he plays against full NHL lineup in a late preseason game tomorrow and Wednesday.

Where I think the organization sees him (if he continues impressing) is a 1st callup in case of injury to a winger. And yes I think he clears waivers.

 

[powerserge]

I believe the Oilers will want to accrue cap so they can address their needs at RD on or before the TDL. Not putting Kane on LTIR means he is our 13th F and they only go with 12 healthy forwards.

That means Lavoie has to displace someone in the top 9 which I don’t see happening. Therefore he has to bring a 4th line game to the rink day in and day out without being on special teams. I don’t see him beating out Podkolzin on 4LW. On 4RW he might beat Perry but I highly doubt the team farms out Perry if they go with 12F so it’s moot.

If Philp makes the team Ryan probably shifts to RW displacing Perry as Ryan is a core PKer and ability to play C.

If they do go with 13F + Kane I think Philp is ahead of him because he’s a sizeable right shot C and can PK. So he might have to beat Philp for the 13F job and that will be tough given the need for right shot centers.

Finally even if he makes the team to have him play 6-7 minutes a night on the 4th line or be a bench warmer is wasted on a young player as we’ve seen so many times in the stunted development of many an Oiler forward.

Just my thoughts. 5 games into preseason is pretty meaningless as we’ve seen before. I’d be curious to see how he plays against full NHL lineup in a late preseason game tomorrow and Wednesday.

Where I think the organization sees him (if he continues impressing) is a 1st callup in case of injury to a winger. And yes I think he clears waivers.

Philp is waivers exempt so that's good.

 

[McDoused]

I don’t see Lavoie making the team. He doesn’t penalty kill and won’t be on the PP. He won’t displace Janmark or Brown with Henrique as I believe that line is set in stone.

That leaves the 4th line where he might get 6-7 minutes a night where he will just rot and is Classic Oilers, putting a rookie scorer on the 4th line and barely play them killing any confidence they have. I sense the new management won’t mismanage assets the way our past 2 regimes have.

Better to send him to the AHL and use him as an early call up in case of injury to the top 9 wingers. I doubt he gets claimed in waivers as every team has 1 or 2 Lavoie’s that they also will be waiving.

I don't get why everyone in the bottom 6 has to PK? Janmark, Brown, Henrique, Podkolzin and Ryan all PK. You can also play Arvidsson, Nuge and others. I think we are overvlauing the importance of a #5/6 pker.

Lavoie hits and scores goals. We need that in our bottom 6.

 

[Senor Catface]

I haven't focused much on the mega-tweeners. Was Stonehouse cut?

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I don't get why everyone in the bottom 6 has to PK? Janmark, Brown, Henrique, Podkolzin and Ryan all PK. You can also play Arvidsson, Nuge and others. I think we are overvlauing the importance of a #5/6 pker.

Lavoie hits and scores goals. We need that in our bottom 6.

And he has size to win board battles and can fight if the need arises. If Podkolzin was good enough for us to trade for him, Lavoie has been even better IMO. Derek Ryan was quiet this whole preseason until yesterday because he saw Philp and O'Reilly coming for his job. He won't keep playing like that.

 

[McFlyingV]

I don't get why everyone in the bottom 6 has to PK? Janmark, Brown, Henrique, Podkolzin and Ryan all PK. You can also play Arvidsson, Nuge and others. I think we are overvlauing the importance of a #5/6 pker.

Lavoie hits and scores goals. We need that in our bottom 6.

Nuge already is a regular PKer and was one of our most used PKers last season. Ryan as well. Philp seems quite capable if they keep him up as well. No reason Lavoie can't play 4th line and get some PP2 minutes. With Henrique, Arvidsson, Skinner, Lavoie, and Ekholm/Nurse they can find some PP minutes for these guys throughout the season.

People keep calling Lavoie a young forward that needs playing time, but he's played 200 AHL games, he's 24 (that's not young for a forward). There isn't much more to develop in the AHL for this player. Rather give him a chance and see what he can do in the NHL and if he plays well in a lesser role you can move him up the line up when he earns it.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

In a perfect world we'd see a Podkolzin-Philp-Lavoie 4th line. Size, speed, hockey IQ and a scoring threat. I don't mind Ryan as the 13th forward, the problem is that Perry is all but guaranteed a spot.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I don't get why everyone in the bottom 6 has to PK? Janmark, Brown, Henrique, Podkolzin and Ryan all PK. You can also play Arvidsson, Nuge and others. I think we are overvlauing the importance of a #5/6 pker.

Lavoie hits and scores goals. We need that in our bottom 6.

KK wants players to have roles as roles create definition, accountability and create ice time. Arvidsson is slated to be on the PK and it sounds like Nuge may be taken off the PK at least to start the year.

Lavoie has properties that others have as well. He has to displace Podkolzin (don’t see it) or Perry (don’t see it) and beat Philp clearly at the same time. He might even do that in the next 2-3 games but I doubt it.

I see him as being a 1st call up unless we go with an extra F and he beats Philp, neither which I see happening.

 

[CROTT]

I believe the Oilers will want to accrue cap so they can address their needs at RD on or before the TDL. Not putting Kane on LTIR means he is our 13th F and they only go with 12 healthy forwards.

That means Lavoie has to displace someone in the top 9 which I don’t see happening. Therefore he has to bring a 4th line game to the rink day in and day out without being on special teams. I don’t see him beating out Podkolzin on 4LW. On 4RW he might beat Perry but I highly doubt the team farms out Perry if they go with 12F so it’s moot.

If Philp makes the team Ryan probably shifts to RW displacing Perry as Ryan is a core PKer and ability to play C.

If they do go with 13F + Kane I think Philp is ahead of him because he’s a sizeable right shot C and can PK. So he might have to beat Philp for the 13F job and that will be tough given the need for right shot centers.

Finally even if he makes the team to have him play 6-7 minutes a night on the 4th line or be a bench warmer is wasted on a young player as we’ve seen so many times in the stunted development of many an Oiler forward.

Just my thoughts. 5 games into preseason is pretty meaningless as we’ve seen before. I’d be curious to see how he plays against full NHL lineup in a late preseason game tomorrow and Wednesday.

Where I think the organization sees him (if he continues impressing) is a 1st callup in case of injury to a winger. And yes I think he clears waivers.

The only thing about putting Lavoie on waivers is that the Oilers have already lost two NHL ready prospects this offseason. Sure with Savoie and Jarventie (and Filip returning) for a redundant McLeod (with resigning Henrique) and a suspect in Bourgault (And Chassion). It wouldn’t be the be all end all. But, the Oilers do need depth/support players on entry level deals to help put them over the top. Can’t bank on finding that veteran that wants to sign cheap every year.

O'Rielly And a healthy Akey are promising, but both still probably a couple years away.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

The only thing about putting Lavoie on waivers is that the Oilers have already lost two NHL ready prospects this offseason. Sure with Savoie and Jarventie added for a redundant McLeod (with resigning Henrique) and a suspect in Bourgault (And Chassion). It wouldn’t be the be all end all. But, the Oilers do need depth/support players on entry level deals to help put them over the top. Can’t bank on finding that veteran that wants to sign cheap every year.

I doubt Lavoie gets picked off waivers. Every team has a guy or two like Lavoie who is just about there but is blocked or other circumstances. With many teams also wanting to manage roster limits and not crowd their own near ready prospects.

For Lavoie to be claimed a team needs to keep him on the NHL roster and most teams have their top 9 locked in already by now and have plenty of 4th liners as well.

Just don’t see it unless he really has a monster final 3 preseason games in which case he might beat Philp here anyway making waivers a moot point. But it’ll take a great showing the rest of the way.

I’m excited he’s showing well, and hope he’s in our top 9 next year if he doesn’t make it this year and continues on the trajectory.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I doubt Lavoie gets picked off waivers. Every team has a guy or two like Lavoie who is just about there but is blocked or other circumstances. With many teams also wanting to manage roster limits and not crowd their own near ready prospects.

For Lavoie to be claimed a team needs to keep him on the NHL roster and most teams have their top 9 locked in already by now and have plenty of 4th liners as well.

Just don’t see it unless he really has a monster final 3 preseason games in which case he might beat Philp here anyway making waivers a moot point. But it’ll take a great showing the rest of the way.

I’m excited he’s showing well, and hope he’s in our top 9 next year if he doesn’t make it this year and continues on the trajectory.

Last season I agree, this season he is a year older and is showing well. He could be the next Frank Vatrano, a guy that goes to a poor team and pots 20+

 

[McDoused]

KK wants players to have roles as roles create definition, accountability and create ice time. Arvidsson is slated to be on the PK and it sounds like Nuge may be taken off the PK at least to start the year.

Lavoie has properties that others have as well. He has to displace Podkolzin (don’t see it) or Perry (don’t see it) and beat Philp clearly at the same time. He might even do that in the next 2-3 games but I doubt it.

I see him as being a 1st call up unless we go with an extra F and he beats Philp, neither which I see happening.

I guess we will agree to disagree here. I have no issue with Knoblauch having roles for guys. I think that's a big part of why Janmark and Brown were so successful last year. I just don't get Oiler fans fascination with the PK. Not everyone in the bottom 6 needs to kill penalties.

I have no problem putting Perry as our 13th forward or waiving him to make room for Lavoie. Perry doesn't kill penalties, throw hits or bring speed into the lineup.

 

[Mr Positive]

Nuge already is a regular PKer and was one of our most used PKers last season. Ryan as well. Philp seems quite capable if they keep him up as well. No reason Lavoie can't play 4th line and get some PP2 minutes. With Henrique, Arvidsson, Skinner, Lavoie, and Ekholm/Nurse they can find some PP minutes for these guys throughout the season.

People keep calling Lavoie a young forward that needs playing time, but he's played 200 AHL games, he's 24 (that's not young for a forward). There isn't much more to develop in the AHL for this player. Rather give him a chance and see what he can do in the NHL and if he plays well in a lesser role you can move him up the line up when he earns it.

Plus we are one of the oldest teams in the league. We need to be giving young guys chances at the NHL level to try to develop someone who might be able to replace someone like a Henrique or even a Hyman someday.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Plus we are one of the oldest teams in the league. We need to be giving young guys chances at the NHL level to try to develop someone who might be able to replace someone like a Henrique or even a Hyman someday.

Lavoie has the potential to be a 20-30 goal scorer in the NHL especially with our playmakers. We will likely need replacements for guys like Skinner and Arvidsson and we can't put all of our eggs into the Savoie basket.

 

[McShogun99]

Last season I agree, this season he is a year older and is showing well. He could be the next Frank Vatrano, a guy that goes to a poor team and pots 20+

I'd rather waive Perry over Lavoie. Perry can just pull a Spezza and say that if any team claims him then he will retire.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I'd rather waive Perry over Lavoie. Perry can just pull a Spezza and say that if any team claims him then he will retire.

I would as well. I have seen nothing from him this preseason that tells me that he is still NHL caliber. I would hate for us to waive and lose Lavoie just to give Perry 20 games to show that he's still a NHL player and be shown that he isn't.

 

[McDNicks17]

I guess we will agree to disagree here. I have no issue with Knoblauch having roles for guys. I think that's a big part of why Janmark and Brown were so successful last year. I just don't get Oiler fans fascination with the PK. Not everyone in the bottom 6 needs to kill penalties.

I have no problem putting Perry as our 13th forward or waiving him to make room for Lavoie. Perry doesn't kill penalties, throw hits or bring speed into the lineup.

Yeah. I don't think they'll be hurting for PKers. They've still got their top four PKing forwards from last year and they've got Henrique and Pod to cover the scraps that Foegele and McLeod saw.

 

[FlameChampion]

I guess we will agree to disagree here. I have no issue with Knoblauch having roles for guys. I think that's a big part of why Janmark and Brown were so successful last year. I just don't get Oiler fans fascination with the PK. Not everyone in the bottom 6 needs to kill penalties.

I have no problem putting Perry as our 13th forward or waiving him to make room for Lavoie. Perry doesn't kill penalties, throw hits or bring speed into the lineup.

We will see how this organization thinks. Philip and Lavoie have outplayed Perry.

They have been making some moves to add young talent in the system so hopefully they appreciate it.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I guess we will agree to disagree here. I have no issue with Knoblauch having roles for guys. I think that's a big part of why Janmark and Brown were so successful last year. I just don't get Oiler fans fascination with the PK. Not everyone in the bottom 6 needs to kill penalties.

I have no problem putting Perry as our 13th forward or waiving him to make room for Lavoie. Perry doesn't kill penalties, throw hits or bring speed into the lineup.

That’s the thing, if the Oilers only go with 12F there is little room for Lavoie especially considering Philp at 4C.

And make no mistake, Lavoie is not going to displace Janmark or Brown on the 3rd line so it’s 4th line opportunity. Without special teams where does he get his minutes?

As for the bottom 6 and the PK, that’s how minutes on ice are accrued when you have a minute munching top 6 like we have. Players can’t usually be effective playing 5-7 minutes in small parts, and it kills young players.

So when your top 6 is going to be on the PP and get the majority of the minutes 5v5 with line 3, you need to have roles for your bottom 6 or they simply fall out of games more often than not.

Last season I agree, this season he is a year older and is showing well. He could be the next Frank Vatrano, a guy that goes to a poor team and pots 20+

Could be. But we’re in the cup window and I think the coaches are banking on known commodities with veteran experience now. But as an injury call up in the top 9 we could see a light at the end of the tunnel for him easier than burying him on the 4th line.

 

[Jarvi]

Nuge-McD-Hyman
Skinner-Drai-Arvy
Podkolzin-Henrique-Brown
Janmark-Ryan-Lavoie

Send down Philp if he is waiver exempt, Ryan hasnt played off the team and its just a numbers game. First call up.

Idk the cap but send Perry down if we need to in order to accrue cap space. Perry is paid big money for what he brings, with that shouldn't come a guaranteed roster spot too. It would be insane to throw out a 2nd round pick who is showing well, all for the corpse of Corey Perry. Big, young, RH shot scoring winger who has progressed in his career? This is the exact type of player that gets poached off of SC contender teams when they try and keep their vets around over their youngsters when they are beating at the door of the big club. We don't owe Perry anything, we didn't win and he didn't show well all playoffs, he can ride the bus and share some of his leadership in the A.

 

[McHelpus]

Podz - Philp - Lavoie
Hoffman - Ryan - Perry

Will be fun to see how those lines compete for a spot.

 

[JeffSkinner53]

Podz - Philp - Lavoie
Hoffman - Ryan - Perry

Will be fun to see how those lines compete for a spot.

I sincerely hope Perry is 13th forward. Dude moves like a turtle out there. Hoffman-Ryan-Perry is gonna get beaten a lot, too old and slow.

 

[JeffSkinner53]

Yo can it be opening night already. I'm ready to overreact after every game.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

Nuge-McD-Hyman
Skinner-Drai-Arvy
Podkolzin-Henrique-Brown
Janmark-Ryan-Lavoie

Send down Philp if he is waiver exempt, Ryan hasnt played off the team and its just a numbers game. First call up.

Idk the cap but send Perry down if we need to in order to accrue cap space. Perry is paid big money for what he brings, with that shouldn't come a guaranteed roster spot too. It would be insane to throw out a 2nd round pick who is showing well, all for the corpse of Corey Perry. Big, young, RH shot scoring winger who has progressed in his career? This is the exact type of player that gets poached off of SC contender teams when they try and keep their vets around over their youngsters when they are beating at the door of the big club. We don't owe Perry anything, we didn't win and he didn't show well all playoffs, he can ride the bus and share some of his leadership in the A.

I think Perry has been guaranteed a spot on the roster no matter what.

I’m not sure many young players like Lavoie have been poached off Stanley Cup winners as you describe. I tried thinking of who got claimed in waivers off cup winners Florida, Vegas, Tampa and Colorado, and none come to mind.

Most cup winners usually are poaching vets like Perry enroute to winning cups.

 

[Jarvi]

I think Perry has been guaranteed a spot on the roster no matter what.

I’m not sure many young players like Lavoie have been poached off Stanley Cup winners as you describe. I tried thinking of who got claimed in waivers off cup winners Florida, Vegas, Tampa and Colorado, and none come to mind.

Most cup winners usually are poaching vets like Perry enroute to winning cups.

Well run orgs don't let their valuable assets hit waivers to potentially lose them for nothing. Just like how multiple teams were apparently eyeing us up over our now gone RFA'S, there is teams watching to see what gets left off the main roster of the top teams in the league.

I'm not worried about someone else "poaching" Perry. He won't play higher than 4th line unless something drastic happens, he was no good in the playoffs, and he playys the least valuable position in which we have good depth . He is fine to keep as a mentor and depth, but if you are losing anyone else for him, your doing it wrong. Idgaf if he has some guarantee, we aren't gonna ice a worse roster over Corey f***ing Perry's feelings.