Pre-WWII Draft 1st Round - Montreal Victorias vs. Regina Capitals

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
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Montreal Victorias

Coach: Dick Irvin
Syd Howe-Mickey MacKay-Charlie Conacher
Herbie Lewis-Duke Keats-Gordie Drillon
Harry Smith-Marty Walsh- Archie Hodgson
Graham Drinkwater-Bruce Stuart (A)-Charlie Liffiton
Herb Russel(l)-Herb Jordan

Harvey Pulford (C)-Eddie Shore
Frank Patrick-Rod Flett
Walter Smaill-Art Duncan
Joe Power

Charlie Gardiner (A)
Frank Stocking

PP1: Mickey MacKay-Marty Walsh-Charlie Conacher
Frank Patrick-Eddie Shore

PP2: Harry Smith-Duke Keats-Gordie Drillon
Walter Smail-Art Duncan

PK1: Herbie Lewis-Mickey MacKay
Harvey Pulford-Rod Flett

PK2: Syd Howe-Archie Hodgson
Graham Drinkwater-Eddie Shore


Vs.


Regina Capitals

DchMzLK.jpg


Coach Jack Adams

Gordon Roberts - Russell Bowie - Alf Smith
Dubbie Kerr - Frank Fredrickson - Babe Dye
Percy Galbraith - Dolly Swift - Haviland Routh
Buzz Boll- Rat Westwick - Alf Skinner

Sprague Cleghorn - Ebbie Goodfellow
Art Ross - Jack Marshall
Jack Laviolette - Bobby Rowe

Harry Holmes
Bouse Hutton

Spares:
F: Jack Findlay
F: Art Gagne
D: Alex Smith

PP1
Gordon Roberts - Russell Bowie - Babe Dye
Sprague Cleghorn - Ebbie Goodfellow

PP2
Dolly Swift - Frank Fredrickson - Alf Smith
Jack Marshall - Haviland Routh

PK1
Percy Galbraith - Rat Westwick
Sprague Cleghorn - Ebbie Goodfellow

PK2
Frank Fredrickson - Buzz Boll
Art Ross - Jack Marshall

@rmartin65
@jigglysquishy
 
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rmartin65

Registered User
Apr 7, 2011
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I'm bummed to see this matchup, as it means I have to go against one of my favorite teams early. That top line is one of my favorite in the draft- Bowie and Alf Smith are about a perfect a duo as I can imagine.

Here's to a good series, @jigglysquishy . I'll try to have some thoughts on the series by Wednesday.
 

jigglysquishy

Registered User
Jun 20, 2011
8,505
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Regina, Saskatchewan
The way I see it.

Capitals are stronger down the middle (Bowie>Fredrickson>MacKay>Keats>Walsh>Swift>Westwick>Stuart). Victorias are stronger on the wings. Victorias have stronger depth.

Defense is close (Shore>Cleghorn>Goodfellow>Pulford>Ross>Patrick>Marshall>Flett), but I do think the Capitals are a bit stronger.

I prefer Holmes to Gardiner (and we voted that way in the pre-merger project), but honestly, anyone outside Vezina is hard for me to give a wow factor to.

Irvin was the better coach than Adams.

Overall, both are strong teams that made ample use of the research in the pre-merger project. It's close and I'm curious to see how it shakes out.
 

rmartin65

Registered User
Apr 7, 2011
2,883
2,506
The way I see it.
This looks pretty similar to the way I see it too, just a couple of minor disagreements on my end-
Capitals are stronger down the middle (Bowie>Fredrickson>MacKay>Keats>Walsh>Swift>Westwick>Stuart). Victorias are stronger on the wings. Victorias have stronger depth.
Outside of me thinking that Stuart was better than Westwick (I have really soured on Westwick over the past ~year), I agree. I'll also add that I don't know if you are getting full value out of a guy like Swift, since I don't think that he and Routh (who I still maintain is a center) are a great pairing.

Defense is close (Shore>Cleghorn>Goodfellow>Pulford>Ross>Patrick>Marshall>Flett), but I do think the Capitals are a bit stronger.
I think you undersell Flett- I didn't have the time to do a deep dive into the Manitoba league that Flett was playing in, but just going through the SC games and a handful of other games leads me to believe that he was a very important piece on those Winnipeg Victorias teams. I collected quotes for a rough bio here.

A couple of my favorites quotes:

“Flett proved the usual tower of strength at point”

“Higginbotham at cover point is simply in his glory. The man that passes him will have to be very, very smart; suppose, though, for an instant that he is passed, the one who passes him has in Flett, the Vics’ point, a man who can and will check anything that comes his way”

“Flett and Merritt were simply impregnable, and it is freely admitted in Montreal that their equals have never been seen”

“Merritt, in goal, displayed all his old form of last year, while Roddy Flett was not to be caught napping, and he is very sour on the puck”

“‘Roddy’ Flett is a Manitoban by birth and is twenty-three years of age. He has ever been a lover of sport from the time he first commenced to toddle. As a football player it is doubtful if Manitoba has his peer as a fullback on the association field. At lacrosse he has also made his mark, played with the old Winnipegs in the palmy days. He has curled some, played baseball, and was always recognized as a good base slider, and he has also quite a reputation as a Rugby football player. In rowing he is one of Manitoba’s hard, and will probably be one of the seniors for Henley next year. He has been playing hockey about four years, but he took to the game like a duck to water, and to-day he holds the enviable position of being probably the best man at point in the Dominion. He has been east twice with the boys, and on both occasions gave his opponents good cause to remember him”

"Roddy’ Flett, as point, has not a peer in Canada. He played the star game of the team last night, his work throughout the whole game was almost perfect. He was indefatigable in his efforts. He was here, there and everywhere, and always there when wanted first. He stopped many a deadly rush on goal last night, and spoilt many a combine. He was not caught napping at any stage of the game, and when he was called upon to fill cover point position, he was of inestimable value to the forward rank while playing in that position”

“Rod Flett is ‘the power behind the throne’, which means that he comes immediately after Johnstone in the path of the Stanley cup defenders. When you see a handsome man with a black moustache who skates gracefully and always looks you square between the eyes you may reckon that it is Flett. When you watch the match you won’t see any splutter under his red tunic. Neither will you see his skates in the air and his stick travelling on the ice for he has a grip of steel and has a faculty of keeping his feet something after the fashion of the terrible turk. What you will most likely see is the puck rising suddenly into mid air and you will hardly notice that the young man who ‘rose’ it has as much as bent his back. Its strange how he does it but he does”

“So far as Rod. Flett is concerned, of course he cannot be improved upon in any city. He is as good now at point as ever he or perhaps any hockey player for many years to come will be”

“‘The greatest point player in Canada’ is an appellation often bestowed on Rod Flett, and probably no man in hockey today would say that it was too high a title. For five years he has plyed his position through all the battles of the Victoria team and always with great credit to himself. He is most original in his methods of play and brilliant as a puck lifter. To see him relieve a hot scrimmage around his goal is a treat to any admirer of the game. His play is always characterized by good judgement, ad he probably is the best example of a man who uses the least amount of physical energy to the greatest possible advantage. This is artistic, scientific play, and in this lies the secret of his strength. He makes no aimless or unnecessary moves and never miscalculates his play. In his hand the duty of defending the Winnipeg goal against the rushes of the Shamrocks may be safely allowed to rest”

“Roderick M. Flett needs no introduction to the sporting public for he has been an active follower of hockey and other athletic sports for several years. He is the point player of the champions and their captain. Rod is the only one of the champions now in the game who played when they first won the cup from the Victorias of Montreal in 1896. He has been playing with the Victorias since he started with them a young lad in 1894. As a defence player he has no superior in Canada to-day, combing as he does brawn with brain. He is a man of splendid physique, and weighs when in condition about 180 pounds”

I prefer Holmes to Gardiner (and we voted that way in the pre-merger project), but honestly, anyone outside Vezina is hard for me to give a wow factor to.
Wrong Gardiner; Herb Gardiner, the defenseman, was definitely worse than Holmes (at least, in my opinion), but Charlie Gardiner, the goalie, was a stud. He's the second best goalie in this thing, IMO, after only Vezina.

Overall, both are strong teams that made ample use of the research in the pre-merger project. It's close and I'm curious to see how it shakes out.
 

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