Dreger: Pittsburgh in on Brassard

[edguy]

Brass for Sheary+Gus+1st still makes the most sense to me.. if you need an AHL replacement goalie we can give you Dreidger too.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Brass for Sheary+Gus+1st still makes the most sense to me.. if you need an AHL replacement goalie we can give you Dreidger too.

Gus isn't in the A, so a replacement isn't needed.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think both sides for the most part agree on Sheary, Gustavsson and a 1st for Brassard. It seems like a very solid and fair deal. Maybe some Senators fans don't want to take back Sheary and some Penguins fans don't want to trade Gustavsson, but I think it's even and a majority of people realize this.

 

[jay caufield forhead]

Counter: Karlsson and Brassard for Schultz, Sheary, Sprong, Gustavsson, Hunwick, 2018 1st and 2019 2nd

i like shultz better than tanger

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Brass for Sheary+Gus+1st still makes the most sense to me.. if you need an AHL replacement goalie we can give you Dreidger too.

That's a fair deal that works for both teams, I'd say.

 

[KIRK]

Brass for Sheary+Gus+1st still makes the most sense to me.. if you need an AHL replacement goalie we can give you Dreidger too.

I suspect Dorian wants more, whether it's that deal or something comparable.

At least that's how I read the Dreger tweet . . . begging someone to step up, lest he deal Brassard to the boogeyman (Pittsburgh) and (in theory) tilt things in the Pens favor.

So, whatever JR is offering, it's not what he'd like. The problems for Dorian, as noted, are (a) he needs someone else to step up and (b) waiting until the summer to move him means potentially a lower return and extra out of pocket dollars for ownership until then.

JR won't offer more. That's not his style. He makes a big offer that, from his perspective, is fair. He doesn't lowball. And, that offer is it.

Questions really are if Dorian finds another partner or, failing that, decides to deal or roll the dice on doing better in the summer (when Brassard's value will be less and you'd hope more bidders drive the price back up).

That's a fair deal that works for both teams, I'd say.

If that was all Dorian wanted, then you know perfectly well the deal would be done already.

 

[DJB]

Hopefully we dont get Sheary. Hes Cory conacher all over again. Crosby has made him a lot of money

 

[Empoleon8771]

Hopefully we dont get Sheary. Hes Cory conacher all over again. Crosby has made him a lot of money

Cory Conacher never had a pace of 70 points in a season. That comparison doesn't make any sense. Crosby also isn't good enough to elevate a Conacher equivalent player into that level of production.

Sheary is a complementary middle-6 forward who can put up big numbers with top end players. You put him on an average 2nd line with average linemates for a year, I think he'd fall in between 40 and 45 points.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

If that was all Dorian wanted, then you know perfectly well the deal would be done already.

I don't. HF value and GM value are often pretty different. Maybe JR's hesitant to give up Sheary, or likes Gus better than Sprong.

Either way, it's nice to find some common ground with an opposing fanbase.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Dreger has said there were double digit teams interested in Brassard, so it's unlikely Dorion will retain on Brassard when so many teams interested. Phanuef was retained because we end up saving 5.5 million in the end.

It is a different dynamic. It's not retaining because Ottawa has to, it's Pittsburgh saying "we'll beat any offer, and then toss you an additional asset in exchange for you making this happen by retaining 20 percent".

 

[DJB]

Cory Conacher never had a pace of 70 points in a season. That comparison doesn't make any sense.

That was quick for someone to take the bait lol

Conacher although not at a 70 point pace did put up good numbers in Tampa riding talented players to do so.

The comparison is more so that than whether Conacher or Sheary is the better player. Sens fans still have nightmares about that trade

 

[Empoleon8771]

That was quick for someone to take the bait lol

Conacher although not at a 70 point pace did put up good numbers in Tampa riding talented players to do so.

The comparison is more so that than whether Conacher or Sheary is the better player. Sens fans still have nightmares about that trade

I will add, I think Sheary's talent level is irrelevant, because I'd be downright shocked for the Senators to keep him if they acquired him. Why would a team trying to shed money want a somewhat expensive complimentary piece? I imagine he'd be traded within a day if he was going to Ottawa for Brassard, he has decent value after all.

Sheary makes $3 million a year flat I believe, so why would Ottawa keep him? He seems like the exact kind of player that would be flipped after a trade, like the Streit situation from last year.

 

[DJB]

I suspect Dorian wants more, whether it's that deal or something comparable.

At least that's how I read the Dreger tweet . . . begging someone to step up, lest he deal Brassard to the boogeyman (Pittsburgh) and (in theory) tilt things in the Pens favor.

So, whatever JR is offering, it's not what he'd like. The problems for Dorian, as noted, are (a) he needs someone else to step up and (b) waiting until the summer to move him means potentially a lower return and extra out of pocket dollars for ownership until then.

JR won't offer more. That's not his style. He makes a big offer that, from his perspective, is fair. He doesn't lowball. And, that offer is it.

Questions really are if Dorian finds another partner or, failing that, decides to deal or roll the dice on doing better in the summer (when Brassard's value will be less and you'd hope more bidders drive the price back up).



If that was all Dorian wanted, then you know perfectly well the deal would be done already.

There is no doubt that Dorion is likely asking for more and why shouldn't he right? Hes hoping someone blinks and pays the high price when in reality something will likely work out if the Sens and one other team both slightly budge closer together.

Should be an interesting week for sure

 

[3074326]

Hopefully we dont get Sheary. Hes Cory conacher all over again. Crosby has made him a lot of money

Conor Sheary was going to blow away Derick Brassard's career best season last year. You don't just luck into that kind of production. Honestly, I think the prices in here are a little steep. Derick Brassard has one 20+ goal season. He has one 60+ point season.

Over the course of his career, he's mostly been a 15-20 goal, 40-45 point player.

 

[DJB]

I will add, I think Sheary's talent level is irrelevant, because I'd be downright shocked for the Senators to keep him if they acquired him. Why would a team trying to shed money want a somewhat expensive complimentary piece? I imagine he'd be traded within a day if he was going to Ottawa for Brassard, he has decent value after all.

Sheary makes $3 million a year flat I believe, so why would Ottawa keep him? He seems like the exact kind of player that would be flipped after a trade, like the Streit situation from last year.

I concur and to be honest he helps the Pens more than the Sens so you guys should keep him. If we make a deal i expect Hunwick is the cap dump headed our way.

However if we do get Sheary i would think we would look to flip him

 

[KIRK]

It is a different dynamic. It's not retaining because Ottawa has to, it's Pittsburgh saying "we'll beat any offer, and then toss you an additional asset in exchange for you making this happen by retaining 20 percent".

That's not really how JR works.

JR makes what he thinks is a fair offer, and that's it. He could've squeezed Shero in the Staal deal. He was Toronto's only real option on Kessel. Both times, he didn't squeeze. He said 'here's what the guy is worth to me', and that was his offer.

I really do think he made Dorian a fair offer, and Dorian wants more.

The problem is nobody is offering more, what he can get this summer for 1 playoffs with Brassard likely is less than what JR is offering, it will cost 650K to find out, and that 2.5M July 1 bonus isn't something I can see Melnyk wanting to pay.

Maybe someone else steps up. Maybe Dorian moves someone else at comparable salary.

That said, it's pretty clear he and JR are playing chicken.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

That was quick for someone to take the bait lol

Conacher although not at a 70 point pace did put up good numbers in Tampa riding talented players to do so.

The comparison is more so that than whether Conacher or Sheary is the better player. Sens fans still have nightmares about that trade

Fortunately, that bet is hedged by Sheary arguably being the 3rd most valuable asset coming back, in good part to make the cap work. It's not like he's the centerpiece of the deal.

 

[DJB]

Conor Sheary was going to blow away Derick Brassard's career best season last year. You don't just luck into that kind of production. Honestly, I think the prices in here are a little steep. Derick Brassard has one 20+ goal season. He has one 60+ point season.

Over the course of his career, he's mostly been a 15-20 goal, 40-45 point player.

Helps playing with Sid there is no denying that.

Interestingly when i scout pkayers especially ones on a line all together i always tend to value the guys that in my mind "stir the drink" and im a bit leery of the other guys on that line with big prodiction as a result.

Crosby is clearly that guy that stirs the drink which makes me hesitate on Sheary

 

[Shaffer]

Helps playing with Sid there is no denying that.

Interestingly when i scout pkayers especially ones on a line all together i always tend to value the guys that in my mind "stir the drink" and im a bit leery of the other guys on that line with big prodiction as a result.

Crosby is clearly that guy that stirs the drink which makes me hesitate on Sheary

Sheary’s stats are padded. He’s been rough all season. Simple explanation

 

[KIRK]

There is no doubt that Dorion is likely asking for more and why shouldn't he right? Hes hoping someone blinks and pays the high price when in reality something will likely work out if the Sens and one other team both slightly budge closer together.

Should be an interesting week for sure

Agree 100%. But, I think Dorian has 2 things working against him:

1. Whatever he can get now for Brassard likely is worth more than what he'll get this summer.
2. That 2.5M July 1 bonus doesn't exactly let him be patient, unless you think Melnyk will be okay paying it.

JR isn't a **** GM. He's not going to try to take advantage of the situation. Whatever he's offering is what Brassard is worth to him in the abstract.

As I said, maybe someone else steps up, maybe Dorian decides to take his chances at the draft, or maybe he moves someone else now or at the draft.

You never know what's real for sure. I've heard Dorian's ask is a little more than anything discussed in this thread. I don't know what JR's offer is, but I suspect given his MO it's one of the deals that fans of both teams have suggested they could see as happening.

Yep, gonna be an interesting week . . .

 

[OCPenguin]

I think both sides for the most part agree on Sheary, Gustavsson and a 1st for Brassard. It seems like a very solid and fair deal. Maybe some Senators fans don't want to take back Sheary and some Penguins fans don't want to trade Gustavsson, but I think it's even and a majority of people realize this.

LOL ... cool, you arranged a fictional deal on a website. I'm pretty sure our GM laughs at you and everyone else who thinks this will happen in real life.

 

[SensFactor]

I see Dorion asking for alot for brass. Personally I would not trade him for picks and prospects. The real need for the Sens is a defensemen that can play with Karlsson. A smart, sturdy Dman is what Dorion should be targeting.

 

[KIRK]

Helps playing with Sid there is no denying that.

Interestingly when i scout pkayers especially ones on a line all together i always tend to value the guys that in my mind "stir the drink" and im a bit leery of the other guys on that line with big prodiction as a result.

Crosby is clearly that guy that stirs the drink which makes me hesitate on Sheary

Perfectly fair with one caution: Sheary stinks with Malkin. Oil and water. And, our other centers aren't Duchene. They aren't even Pageau. So, while I doubt that Sheary would be the guy he was when he was killing it with Sid, I think he'd be better with Ottawa's centers than he's been with Pittsburgh's bottom six centers.

 

[DJB]

Agree 100%. But, I think Dorian has 2 things working against him:

1. Whatever he can get now for Brassard likely is worth more than what he'll get this summer.
2. That 2.5M July 1 bonus doesn't exactly let him be patient, unless you think Melnyk will be okay paying it.

JR isn't a **** GM. He's not going to try to take advantage of the situation. Whatever he's offering is what Brassard is worth to him in the abstract.

As I said, maybe someone else steps up, maybe Dorian decides to take his chances at the draft, or maybe he moves someone else now or at the draft.

You never know what's real for sure. I've heard Dorian's ask is a little more than anything discussed in this thread. I don't know what JR's offer is, but I suspect given his MO it's one of the deals that fans of both teams have suggested they could see as happening.

Yep, gonna be an interesting week . . .

Yes your GM is not a rookie. Hes intelligent and will hold firm. Dorion is holding out hope a Columbus or the Blues step up their offer. I still suspect something gets done on Brassard there is a lot of incentive especially that bonus.

 

[DJB]

Perfectly fair with one caution: Sheary stinks with Malkin. Oil and water. And, our other centers aren't Duchene. They aren't even Pageau. So, while I doubt that Sheary would be the guy he was when he was killing it with Sid, I think he'd be better with Ottawa's centers than he's been with Pittsburgh's bottom six centers.

Yup sometimes chemistry simply isn't found between players for whatever reason. I dont doubt Sheary would be an upgrade to our top 6, hes just not a guy id be personally targeting if i was Sens GM. Hes a good player but not a great one i suppose