Salary Cap: Pens Salary Cap: Free Agency, everyone panic!!! Geno talk to the Geno thread only please

[Zirakzigil]

Off season time. New thread time apparently cause @Ugene Magic doesn’t like high page counts.

So how about them Malkin and Letang UFAs? Maybe we should sign one or both.

Geno thread. Keep Geno talk here:

Rumor: - Geno where art thou?

With all the Geno rumors and news, time for its own thread. Keep the Geno talk here please.

hfboards.mandatory.com

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[Peat]

I mean, you're exactly right, Peat, except that I feel that model only really only works that way for a younger team. If Sid and Geno were, again, 27-29 then it'd be a perfectly great plan. The problem is, our older players need younger blood and paying UFAs or generously fair deals for bottom 6/ 3rd pairing guys instead of cheaping out there means we have less to spend where it's needed most and will have the best impact--in the top 6, the first pairing, and in net.



To put it another way, I feel the major problem with this club over two GMs now is a steadfast refusal to adapt to the reality of aging stars.

I don't disagree they need more help, but I think the basic principle that it get a lot easier through the roster when someone(s) in the top 6 is undercosted remains true. Besides, more or less by definition younger blood = cheaper in this league.

I'd also that I don't think we've really been hugely cheaping out. You look at the guys getting ice time like the 2nd guy on a top pairing and you see plenty of guys around Dumo money - Connor Murphy, Pesce, Ceci (lol), Ekholm, Gavrikov is a bit cheaper. We're set to pay 5m+ each for our three most expensive wingers, that should get you three good top six wingers which should have you most of the way there. Like if they need more than three genuinely quite good top six wingers, it's not that they're old and need help, it's that they're done and it's time to pack up. The problem isn't the money per se, it's that Dumo is declining, Zucker's been a big miss...

And we don't really have the assets to change it. Yeah if we had less money tied up in certain guys, we could be more aggressive in free agency, but free agency is generally how you find out you've got too much money tied up in certain guys. Really this team needed to be targeting the right guys in trade, picking up Sam Reinhart and Jacob Middleton and blah blah and not shitting picks and prospects on never replacing Bonino/Zucker and Kapanen.

Which, tbh brings me to my disagreement over this teams major problem. I think Rutherford was very aware of what was coming and tried very hard to make the team younger and pick up talent with upside from elsewhere to try and transition while staying competitive. However he mostly failed, and in doing so spent a ton of assets and signed/took on some pre-covid contracts that has left Hextall with no room to move. And much as I enjoy blaming Rutherford at times, I've yet to see many teams accomplish "lose all our veteran bargains and replace them with equal cheaper younger players despite paying a ton of assets to make a cup team".

And cheap young talent is the problem I see. If you don't have it, you just don't have the options and cap efficiency to get things done imo.

 

[Turin]

K now sign Malkin for 4 million over 7 years, trade Zucker and sign Forsberg and Rakell. What

 

[SomeDude]

K now sign Malkin for 4 million over 7 years, trade Zucker and sign Forsberg and Rakell. What

You forgot trade Jarry and our pick to Arizona to draft Cooley and then offer sheeting Oettinger. It's not like we're asking for much here, Hextall. Get it done.

 

[Turin]

You forgot trade Jarry and our pick to Arizona to draft Cooley and then offer sheeting Oettinger. It's not like we're asking for much here, Hextall. Get it done.

Then DeSmith for picks and sign Fleury. This isn’t hard sleepy

 

[ChaosAgent]

I think of the players making significant salary:

Dumo and Marino could get you positive value
Jarry gets you significant value but you gotta get a 1G. Maybe MAF lol.

Petts would be a money-for-money swap.
Zuck takes a significant bribe.

Do we count Blueger and McGinn?
If so Blueger lands a 2nd-3rd and McGinn costs a mid-sized bribe.

Anyone think McGinn + Poulin gets us out of McGinn's deal?

 

[Big Poppa Pump]

With Letang now signed at $6.1 million, the Penguins currently have $15.3 million in cap space with this lineup:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rust
XXXXX-XXXXX-XXXXXX
Zucker-Carter-XXXXXX
O'Connor-Blueger-McGinn
Zohorna-XXXXXX

Dumoulin-Letang
Matheson-Marino
Pettersson-Ruhwedel
Friedman

Jarry-DeSmith

If Malkin is actually willing to do $6 million a year on a 4 year deal, you might be able to get really close to affording all of Rakell, Kapanen and Heinen without even trading Pettersson. With trading Pettersson, you can actually do a lot with your middle-6. You'd have about $12.5 million for 3 spots.

Nobody wants Kapanen
Heinen I could live with, but only if he never sees L1 or L2 ever again

 

[Extra Texture]

If a sieve like Georgiev returned 2 3rds and a 5th we should trade Jarry for a haul. Sign MAF. Get the band back together and let them ride it out one 1st round exit at a time.

Cant believe the Avs picked him up. But honestly, I thought he was clearly the "irrational whipping boy" of the HF RAngers crowd, with all of them bagging on him just because.

Last year it seemed like the guy was pretty solid. And honestly, if he platoons with Francouz, I feel like that will be fine for the Avs. Especially if the cap savings mean they can return more of their roster from last year.

I wonder if Colorado was in the MAF conversation at all.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I don't think you'd have to add to move McGinn. I think a lot of teams would be happy to have him... I just don't know how how much the Penguins actually need him considering there are bigger fish to fry. Seems like a luxury player.

 

[SomeDude]

Cant believe the Avs picked him up. But honestly, I thought he was clearly the "irrational whipping boy" of the HF RAngers crowd, with all of them bagging on him just because.

Last year it seemed like the guy was pretty solid. And honestly, if he platoons with Francouz, I feel like that will be fine for the Avs. Especially if the cap savings mean they can return more of their roster from last year.

I wonder if Colorado was in the MAF conversation at all.

When you have a D as stacked as Colorado, you can get by with Dollar Tree off-brand goalies.

 

[Deport Ogie]

I think of the players making significant salary:

Dumo and Marino could get you positive value
Jarry gets you significant value but you gotta get a 1G. Maybe MAF lol.

Petts would be a money-for-money swap.
Zuck takes a significant bribe.

Do we count Blueger and McGinn?
If so Blueger lands a 2nd-3rd and McGinn costs a mid-sized bribe.

Anyone think McGinn + Poulin gets us out of McGinn's deal?

McGinn is the sort of player teams are always interested in....I don't think you expect a huge return for him or anything but I can't see it taking a bribe to offload him.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

When you have a D as stacked as Colorado, you can get buy with dollar tree off-brand goalies.

Yeah but even then if Colorado manages to win again next year or even make the SCF with flippin' Georgiev and Francouz then I don't ever want to hear about how a team NEEDS to spend a mint on goaltending in order to compete ever again.

 

[SomeDude]

Yeah but even then if Colorado manages to win again next year or even make the SCF with flippin' Georgiev and Francouz then I don't ever want to hear about how a team NEEDS to spend a mint on goaltending in order to compete ever again.

As I said, if you have guys like Makar, Toews, Girard, Byram, Manson, EJ, etc etc on your blueline then you can put almost any average goalie back there with no issue. If your D looks like......ours.....you might need to invest in the goalie position.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The team is already getting massive cap savings with what Rust and Letang have taken. Trying to make massive roster changes that involve gutting a ton of money seems unnecessary.

Move out Pettersson for sure, and move out Zucker if you can truly get an elite piece by doing so. But beyond that, I really don't see the point. If you can end up with this going into next year, you're well set going into the year:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rust
Rakell-Malkin-Trocheck
Zucker-Carter-Heinen
O'Connor-Blueger-McGinn
Zohorna-depth guy

Dumoulin-Letang
Matheson-Marino
POJ-Ruhwedel
Friedman

Jarry-DeSmith

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

As I said, if you have guys like Makar, Toews, Girard, Byram, Manson, EJ, etc etc on your blueline then you can put almost any average goalie back there with no issue. If your D looks like......ours.....you might need to invest in the goalie position.

Whadda ya mean?!? You don't like Letang and a giant bucketload of expensive wallpaper paste as your defense?

 

[Zbynek]

I don't think you'd have to add to move McGinn. I think a lot of teams would be happy to have him... I just don't know how how much the Penguins actually need him considering there are bigger fish to fry. Seems like a luxury player.

According to NHL 22 McGinn is dead last of every single Penguin in trade value. That being said I think he could be dumped for a 5th to the right team.

 

[ChaosAgent]

McGinn is the sort of player teams are always interested in....I don't think you expect a huge return for him or anything but I can't see it taking a bribe to offload him.

Then we should do it.

I'm looking at all routes/pathways to bring back Geno, Rakell, and another impactful L2 guy - C, Wing or either. If you save $1-$1.5M on the Ginn, do it

 

[SomeDude]

Whadda ya mean?!? You don't like Letang and a giant bucketload of expensive wallpaper paste as your defense?

That bucket isn't so giant after Pettersson gets done eating it.

According to NHL 22 McGinn is dead last of every single Penguin in trade value. That being said I think he could be dumped for a 5th to the right team.

According to NHL 03, Ross Lupaschuk develops into a franchise D-man. That being said, he did not.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

According to NHL 22 McGinn is dead last of every single Penguin in trade value. That being said I think he could be dumped for a 5th to the right team.

He's just one of these coach's players, ya know? There will always be a team out there that is sure they can benefit from his "terrific two way game and penalty killing" or whatever. This is why I will always be opposed to letting another team develop these guys and get their best cheaper years only for someone like the Penguins to come swooping in during FA and offer them decent money over multiple years only to find out that... yup... they're just another average third line player.

 

[Deport Ogie]

Then we should do it.

I'm looking at all routes/pathways to bring back Geno, Rakell, and another impactful L2 guy - C, Wing or either. If you save $1-$1.5M on the Ginn, do it

I'm on board. I don't think McGinn is useless or anything, I probably wouldn't even say he's overpaid but on THIS team at THIS time he's overpaid for the role. That more than anything makes him an obvious target.

If I had my way McGinn, Zucker, Kap, and Dumo would be the obvious offloads. I'd keep Pettersson over Dumo.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

If we could actually get a second or third-round pick for Blueger, that would be amazing.

McGinn brings something we need. Yeah he is not a great fit because of Sullivan, but we have to live with that because we are already butter soft as is. Other players with McGinn's skill set may be worse under Sullivan. But hey, if somebody offers Hextall something interesting (not a 5th), go for it.

 

[EVGENIMERLIN]

The team is already getting massive cap savings with what Rust and Letang have taken. Trying to make massive roster changes that involve gutting a ton of money seems unnecessary.

Move out Pettersson for sure, and move out Zucker if you can truly get an elite piece by doing so. But beyond that, I really don't see the point. If you can end up with this going into next year, you're well set going into the year:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rust
Rakell-Malkin-Trocheck
Zucker-Carter-Heinen
O'Connor-Blueger-McGinn
Zohorna-depth guy

Dumoulin-Letang
Matheson-Marino
POJ-Ruhwedel
Friedman

Jarry-DeSmith

That top 6 is Primo

 

[3ladesof5teel]

According to NHL 22 McGinn is dead last of every single Penguin in trade value. That being said I think he could be dumped for a 5th to the right team.

McGinn was coveted when he left Carolina, I dont think he would be that difficult to get rid of. There are plenty of NHL GM's that would find value in a player like him

That top 6 is Primo

It would be one of the better top 6s in the NHL

 

[SEALBound]

That bucket isn't so giant after Pettersson gets done eating it.


According to NHL 03, Ross Lupaschuk develops into a franchise D-man. That being said, he did not.

In NHL 98, the Penguins had three goalies - Barrasso, Wregget, and Lalime. Wregget had the highest rating, Barrasso 2nd, and Lalime 3rd. If you boot Barrasso off the roster, Lalime became the starter, and it boosted the overall rating of goaltending despite the lower individual rating.

Never understood it.

Also, Rob Neidermeyer had a higher rating than Jagr. Odd.

 

[Empoleon8771]

 

[DrDangles]

I really hate the idea of losing McGinn considering how soft this team in. We should be adding more grit to this lineup, not shipping it out.