Salary Cap: Pens '23-'24 Salary Cap Thread: "Mandrake, do you recall what Clemenceau once said about hockey"

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This team (arguably) only has one.

I don't think there's much argument there, personally. Smith/Raks/Rust are a big bucket of vanilla slime.

Also what's up with people wanting to move Ned? I would absolutely move the other one wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy first. Did the team give Jarry some batshit trade clauses I forgot about or is the logic that his contact sucks so bad nobody will take it?
 
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Dubas

"Are my moves the problem like the previous GM's before me or is it the coach that keeps misusing them the problem? No, no...upper executives told me he's not the problem..."



I don't think there's much argument there, personally. Smith/Raks/Rust are a big bucket of vanilla slime.

Also what's up with people wanting to move Ned? I would absolutely move the other one wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy first. Did the team give Jarry some batshit trade clauses I forgot about or is the logic that his contact sucks so bad nobody will take it?
Are we back to blaming goalies for the incompetent zone defense and coaching?
 
You don't think European scouts are still going there to watch games?
No, we're not allowed into Russia without an explicit invitation letter and as far as I know all of those are suspended while the war is going on-- we can't get tourist visas, let alone working visas. Plus, if you have citizenship and are of draftable age, you can be mobilized (though highly unlikely) into the hamburger mill.

I'd be really suspicious of any US/NA scout that claims to have seen much KHL hockey first hand, and doubly so of any Euro.
 
Are we back to blaming goalies for the incompetent zone defense and coaching?

It's nothing personal. I don't like/trust goaltenders in general. And Jarry has never given me enough reason to change my mind. Turn and burn on those guys. Just like coaches and bottom six junk.

Goaltenders are here one day and nowhere to be found the next. I'd just rather pay a guy ~2M to do roughly the same job. Is it all Jarry's fault? No. Does he help much? Also no. Does his track record indicate that he's some stud being held down? Also also no. Hell I don't even know how much "stud goaltenders" even exist.
 
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I can't stand the narrative of, "should the Penguins be sellers or buyers?"

They need to be better. Full-stop. Addition by subtraction in some cases, so sellers. Adding legitimate young talent via trades, including high draft picks, so buyers.

If Crosby, Malkin, Letang and Karlsson want to be Penguins, then they will accept the moves if they improve the team. They are all smart people, so they know this roster is just not good enough. They also know that the GM has precious few assets to work with.

Whatever happens, this team CLEARLY needs to get YOUNGER. These are not the 2002 Detroit Red Wings. This team cannot compete as presently constructed. So, trading away Pierre-Olivier Joseph (the second/third-youngest player on the team) is nonsensical. Start with veterans, please. And sure, if Guentzel wants to stay and the contract does not damage the future of the team, you can re-sign him too. Top scoring wingers are hard to find. This team (arguably) only has one. But, if you can improve the top six by actually trading Guentzel, then go ahead. I think it makes more sense to try to move the other top-six options: Rakell, Smith and of course Rust (which is tricky because of the contract language in his deal). It also makes too much sense to move Eller, who should have value, Nieto (Edm nearly signed him last summer) if healthy and Ruhwedel (I doubt he has value beyond what Mike Sullivan sees, but perhaps somebody else thinks like him). Nedeljkovic is also a potential trade chip, but timing is always important when moving a goaltender.

If this team got younger, chances are they get better. The veteran core has to believe, and of course the coach is a non-believer, but Dubas has a chance to do some good things here.

Don't eff it up.
No one wants four more years of Rakell at $5M let alone another year at $5M for Smith without one of their crappy overpaid and likely older players coming back…Rust isn’t going anywhere for at least another year…we do have to get younger and Jake is really the only way to do it successfully, meaning with something useful coming back
 
If there has ever been a player more concerned about his legacy than Sidney Crosby in the NHL, I'm not sure I can think of him.

Dude won't even drink beers in pictures lol.
And never forget he idolizes Stevie Y. Couple that with a rigid philosophy of routine/repetition, insane self-discipline, and incorruptable moral fiber and your're right. He ain't going anywhere. At least not for the next 2.5 seasons. MAYBE if Geno bags it and Kris wants to play in Canada, Sid has a change of heart for the 2027-28 season, but I wouldn't bet on it.
 
I always liked pests and shit-stirrers more than straight goonage. Goons honestly don't move the needle much on the game IMO. Especially the modern game.
How about a hybrid? @Honour Over Glory mentioned Jaime Benn yesterday. I hate that dirty prick, but man, he'd be a hell of a Penguin, even on L3. We've not had anyone with that combination of skill, size, and dickishness in God knows how long? Not Jimmy Neal, that's for sure, though he sometimes tried.
 
How about a hybrid? @Honour Over Glory mentioned Jaime Benn yesterday. I hate that dirty prick, but man, he'd be a hell of a Penguin, even on L3. We've not had anyone with that combination of skill, size, and dickishness in God knows how long? Not Jimmy Neal, that's for sure, though he sometimes tried.
Mate you missed the point.

Dallas for example has Robertson, Hintz, Johnston as their top line and Pavelski is with Steel and Benn on the third. Yeah skilled youth is nice to have and use in that way but the Pens have some but won't use them in that way, ever. They have old players being used in ways to keep them productive and fresh. Meanwhile the Pens....

Imagine if Sullivan used Puustinen correctly. Or gave Poulin a shot over useless nobodies like Harkins and White.
 
It's nothing personal. I don't like/trust goaltenders in general. And Jarry has never given me enough reason to change my mind. Turn and burn on those guys. Just like coaches and bottom six junk.

Goaltenders are here one day and nowhere to be found the next. I'd just rather pay a guy ~2M to do roughly the same job. Is it all Jarry's fault? No. Does he help much? Also no. Does his track record indicate that he's some stud being held down? Also also no. Hell I don't even know how much "stud goaltenders" even exist.
Ned and Jarry to me have been fine. I think the usual metrics most trash goalies with are the ones that show well enough that Jars and Ned aren't the issue. The Pens defensive play and lack of support by the forwards on defense.
 
as much as i would like to see Geno moved to wing, Geno never was/ is not now/or ever will be the type of winger Sid wants to play with on a regular basis. so that thinking needs to stop.:teach2:

Malkin and Sid together is less effective than people think.

Malkin needs to move to wing, but it should be with a strong two-way center who doesn't need the puck on his stick.

Malkin and Sid has not been worked on and tried at this stage of their careers enough. Historical data is just that. Sid is no longer that fast.

Sid - might not get what you want, but get what you need. This double grinder stuff is whatever. He's still good enough to perform but lets not fool ourselves here - Sid from 10 years ago gets these numbers from guys like Rakell (but worse) regularly. Sid in 2024 leans a bit on Jake and Rust. He could absolutely lean on someone like Malkin to push the net (with a much bigger frame) or look for one timers. This isn't Kessel we're talking about here.

My first choice for the past few Summers was to bring someone to anchor that line 2 with Geno and help create. But if that's not going to happen, I wouldn't think twice of shifting him up. We simply don't have the offense (no surprise to anyone).
 
It is so cool that our coaching staff won't even change the one thing they can change so that it's not historically awful. Real leadership, you love to see it.
I don't know that I agree with taking Malkin or EK off of pp 1, but they should absolutely take Malkin off the half/wall point and try working him down low or something.

He's just too slow now to play up top like that, and him and EK are bungling everything.

Put Sid up there instead and let Malkin work the goal line and see if anything changes. Malkin's passing and hands could still be an asset down low.
 
I don't know that I agree with taking Malkin or EK off of pp 1, but they should absolutely take Malkin off the half/wall point and try working him down low or something.

He's just too slow now to play up top like that, and him and EK are bungling everything.

Put Sid up there instead and let Malkin work the goal line and see if anything changes. Malkin's passing and hands could still be an asset down low.
When you are connecting at 13.25%, the second worst in the league, you do whatever you have to do. Reconfigure it, take players off of it, whatever. It's wild to me that the coach is not only out of ideas all together, but doesn't even sound interested in fixing it.
 
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It’s crazy Hextall and now Dubas are just cool with signing players for Sullivan to ruin.

Like he makes any Gms moves look awful but they are content with keeping him.
Yea, I don't think Hextall was as bad as we think. Maybe a bit too patient but I think they were trying to acquire JT Miller at the deadline last season and panicked when it didn't happen and acquired Granlund. Horrible trade. But Sullivan definitely has a negative impact on our GMs.
 
Yea, I don't think Hextall was as bad as we think. Maybe a bit too patient but I think they were trying to acquire JT Miller at the deadline last season and panicked when it didn't happen and acquired Granlund. Horrible trade. But Sullivan definitely has a negative impact on our GMs.

Ya and dont get me wrong granlund was awful but just look. He is back to a 60pts pace in San jose. He was a 20pt pace here and used horrendously
 
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