Post-Game Talk: Pens 2, Oilers 1: The Junior Player Edition

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

This is not a 9-4 team. This is more likely a 4-9 team getting incredible goaltending.

It's fun to win, but it sucks to know that winning gives Johnston, Tocchet, Kunitz and Scuderi another day on this team. We will not do anything of significance with those four in this organization. We also still need a #2/3 defenseman, badly. Letang's been garbage this season, Maatta as well. Cole is exactly what figured he was, a bottom pairing guy who looked good compared to the dumpster fire around him down the stretch last season. And well, Scudjoy is Scudjoy. Fleury isn't gonna be able to win it for us all season and in the playoffs.

I also cannot understand the usage of Sprong. The kid's shot is lethal, he's got the wheels to keep up, and he's not terrible outside of the offensive zone. Staple him to the 3rd line with Perron and Bonino and call it a day. That line's solved for the rest of the season. Keep Fehr in the top-6, move Bennett up to the top-6, scratch Kunitz;

Bennett/Hornqvist - Crosby - Bennett/Hornqvist
Fehr - Malkin - Kessel
Perron - Bonino - Sprong
Plotnikov - Cullen - Wilson

 

[ColePens]

+ Dumo: As stated in my first post

+ Bonino/Cullen: These two guys are doing exactly what we needed Sutter to do. Bonino was winning crucial faceoffs and played a great 2 way game. I actually like how he plays behind the net, too. He uses his backside so well to defend the puck and create space. As for Cullen.. that dude doesn't look anywhere near 39 years old.

+ Sid/Geno: This is a weird one. I thought both guys didn't force plays and looked good. I know nothing flashy happened but I really did like that they weren't out there looking frustrated or forcing plays. Geno's defensive play is through the roof right now.

+ Plots/Sprong: It's sad how this organization continues to use young players, but these two are consistently forcing themselves into the line up with their play, YET it has to be injuries to keep them in. It sucks. I want to see these guys get 10+ minutes a night and get chances. They deserve it and we need talent like this. I loved what these guys did tonight and we need more of it.

- Powerplay movement: I don't have to keep writing the same stuff... do i? The lack of movement is bad and it will haunt this team for as long as they all stand in their spots and refuse to move. It's stupid. It's beyond stupid.

- Overall records vs. Eye Test: I am very pleased with the overall record, but I am not fooled by the idea that we are as good as our record. I hate the following:
* Puck support on breakouts (we need to discuss this as a whole one day)
* Powerplay
* Offensive scheme
* The amount of turnovers the offense produces
* The players have still not bought in.

But our record is getting better and I can't complain too much. Similar to DB... you can see the car crash a mile away, but you cannot stop it.

- Letang, Cole, Maatta, Scuds: All played horrible hockey tonight. Turnovers, mistakes, mental errors. You name it. Poor play.

- Dupuis: RETIRE. I'm serious. This is real life and your family needs you as a father, husband, and the head of the house. Quit trying to be a tough guy. One blood clot and you are ****ing dead. It's not some joke. It's not some game.

We win but we continue to be so goddamn boring.

Zzzzzzzzzzzz....

I don't think that's just the Pens. That's the league in general. The games are getting harder and harder to watch. I love the sport, but the league is right back to where they didn't want to be.

 

[ColePens]

This is not a 9-4 team. This is more likely a 4-9 team getting incredible goaltending.

Lange made a little jab at our record and made mention that he thinks the goalie has had to steal the show and be a top 3 star of the game in all of our wins. That's not necessarily a good team win if the goalie has to stand on his head.

 

[Zen Arcade]

Driving home after the game... PB and Lange gave a lot of credit to Dumo and Bonino. I'm excited to hear that because both guys played tremendous hockey games. IMO, Dumo played like a top 4 defender. What a terrific game by #8.

Lange and Bourque were praising Dumoulin all night, Lange even went as far as to say he was the Pens' best player tonight.

 

[Son Goku]

Lange and Bourque were praising Dumoulin all night, Lange even went as far as to say he was the Pens' best player tonight.

I wouldn't disagree dude was an animal.

 

[Winger for Hire]

I was confused by that. The awful, uninspired Pittsburgh Penguins are 9-4 sitting tied for 2nd in the division with Washington and just two points behind the Rangers. They've got the best GAA in the league and the offense & PP are finally starting to show some signs of life. Not only that, but 3 of their 4 losses were to the two best teams in the league - one to Montreal (1st, 25 points) and two to Dallas (2nd, 22 points).

This is exactly why you don't jump the gun and fire your coach 3 games into the season. This team, with it's lack of flashiness, is re-learning how to win hockey games. I see some people complaining about how this buys Johnston more time before being fired, but that's exactly what it should do because not only does he have this team winning hockey games but also playing a much more sound game fundamentally.

Sounds kinda like a Blysma argument

 

[hooverdam]

These wins are a paper tiger built on luck and goaltending. When (not if, when) those run out, it's going to get very ugly.

I wonder if the people who are satisfied with this team just check out the standings, breathe a sigh of relief at the win column, and don't actually watch the games. This team is a chore to sit through. There is nothing particularly good or fundamentally sound about the defense; they're playing simple, uninspired swamp hockey because that's all that two of three pairings are capable of. They'll go nowhere like this.

 

[radapex]

But our record is getting better and I can't complain too much. Similar to DB... you can see the car crash a mile away, but you cannot stop it.

The thing I keep in consideration is this: you can't teach offense like you can teach defense. You've either got it or you don't. There is plenty of offensive firepower on this roster, and Johnston has spent the first month of the season teaching them defensive responsibility. What I see is Johnston setting this team up the right way for a long playoff run. I think they're still a couple pieces away from being able to brand them a true contender, but they are definitely moving in the right direction.

They need at least one more top 4 defender. Doing this will not only help defensively, but should help bolster the transition game and give Johnston a little more confidence as far as opening up offensively goes.

They also need to get the PP figured out. And, to their credit, it has been looking better lately.

I get that they're playing the blandest brand of hockey imaginable right now, but I really do see the potential benefits down the road. The payoffs could be huge, and I'm willing to see where we are come mid- to late-February before I'm ready to ship Johnston out.

 

[Headshot77]

Part of me is worried that the flaws in our system will lead to a mid or late season collapse. Part of me is just happy we keep winning. I'm so conflicted.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Question, if Maatta continues to struggle, do you consider sending him down to the AHL to get his confidence back?

 

[BHD]

I missed the second half of the game. Dumo stood out though.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

Part of me is worried that the flaws in our system will lead to a mid or late season collapse. Part of me is just happy we keep winning. I'm so conflicted.

Wins are nice. Enjoy them, because you won't see them late in the season or in the playoffs.

 

[WayneSid9987]

I don't think it's as dire as HF Pens makes it out.

I find that they played DB stretch pass hockey for so long that they are having it totally beaten out of them and re-learning using 5 guys with support.

I don't like that they don't mix in more stretch the zones type of hockey though like the Rangers employ. With speed sprinkled all throughout the lineup now with 4 lines that can score, you really are doing a disservice to this roster by not implementing some form of that. I dunno, maybe thats the plan if they can get the 5 man/with support thing ever figured out, they'll throw in that stuff too.

Roster decisions/holes and top 6 chemistry issues aside.

 

[Get To Our Game]

How did Plotnikov get Steve Downie status with the refs? Has he gotten the benefit of a single call all season? I can only imagine that he came over with some type of reputation. Because it's beyond the 'Russian rookie has to earn it' point.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

I don't think it's anywhere near "Downie status," but more of a "I have no idea who this guy is, so I'm not gonna give him the benefit of the doubt" thing.

 

[radapex]

Wins are nice. Enjoy them, because you won't see them late in the season or in the playoffs.

I think you will, because by that time I think Johnston will have allowed his forwards to open up more offensively. What we're seeing right now is very much a teaching phase. He's teaching the forwards to be responsible defensively by having them focus on it game after game after game. When he feels confident enough that they're not going to blow that responsibility in the name of offense, he'll loosen the reigns and let the stars shine.

Roster-wise, were still a couple pieces away from being a true contender (IMO) but that's out of MJ's hands. It's up to Rutherford to address those issues at or before the deadline.

 

[Jacob]

How did Plotnikov get Steve Downie status with the refs? Has he gotten the benefit of a single call all season? I can only imagine that he came over with some type of reputation. Because it's beyond the 'Russian rookie has to earn it' point.

Rookie + foreigner that can't argue with the refs. It's a losing combination amongst the officiating fraternity.

 

[ColePens]

The thing I keep in consideration is this: you can't teach offense like you can teach defense. You've either got it or you don't. There is plenty of offensive firepower on this roster, and Johnston has spent the first month of the season teaching them defensive responsibility. What I see is Johnston setting this team up the right way for a long playoff run. I think they're still a couple pieces away from being able to brand them a true contender, but they are definitely moving in the right direction.

They need at least one more top 4 defender. Doing this will not only help defensively, but should help bolster the transition game and give Johnston a little more confidence as far as opening up offensively goes.

They also need to get the PP figured out. And, to their credit, it has been looking better lately.

I get that they're playing the blandest brand of hockey imaginable right now, but I really do see the potential benefits down the road. The payoffs could be huge, and I'm willing to see where we are come mid- to late-February before I'm ready to ship Johnston out.

I think it's the inability to adjust as MJ talked about from the beginning. The PP is exactly case in point. That will haunt us at the wrong time. And our announcers will be like "Oh but the PP just got unlucky!" Or... "But those youngsters need to get the puck deep instead of turning it over" (after clearly ignoring Kunitz/Dupers turn the puck over 300 times.

Now I want to start a discussion on our breakout support. We never have guys funneling to the puck from the weakside. It's weird. There are plenty of times where the weak side winger should support for a board chip, but we don't. It really bugs me because if the initial breakout doesn't work, it's a huge breakdown and we are defending an oddman rush. I would LOVE to see more area passes with speed up the ice/support up the ice instead of what the Pens are doing.

The powerplay and breakout are 2 big components that constantly need changed because they keep trying to put a bandaid over it instead of the big change it needs.

How did Plotnikov get Steve Downie status with the refs? Has he gotten the benefit of a single call all season? I can only imagine that he came over with some type of reputation. Because it's beyond the 'Russian rookie has to earn it' point.

Dude... that's a good call.

 

[ColePens]

Question, if Maatta continues to struggle, do you consider sending him down to the AHL to get his confidence back?

His confidence isn't an issue. It's his feel/speed. It will be a random day in January and it will all click and we won't even notice it until like 10 oldschool Maatta games happen and we realize how damn good the kid is.

It's not helping that he's paired with Scuds. #4 forces EVERY puck to Maatta to make hte pass. The kid needs to be the 2nd guy in the pairing to get his legs back and not controlling every single breakout.

Scuds gives him the puck under fire, too. He cannot like playing w/ Scuds. No way.

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

For those who believe that this 9-4 record is a product of quality hockey and not tremendous fortune...you will be in for a rude awakening if and when the playoffs roll around.

The Penguins have totally neutered 87 and 71's offensive games. Checking only gets tighter and scoring gets lower in the playoffs. This team struggles to score more than 2 against terrible teams in regular season games. How do you think this will work when they enter a 7 game series against a contender?

And this defense looks "good" now because of smoke and mirrors. Everybody not named Dumolin has ranged from average to absolutely terrible. If you expect this process from the first 13 games to produce the same results over the next 13 games, or the 13 games after that, I think you are fooling yourself.

This team is like the Avs from a few years ago. They are getting killed in the possession game most nights and they are being bailed out by a goalie playing out of his mind and some timely goals. This is an illusion, it is no winning formula.

 

[Zen Arcade]

I love that Scuderi drew two penalties tonight. Just let him go, he'll give you the puck in a second or two.

 

[Jacob]

I agree we might not be a 9-4 team and things still need to be done to get Crosby going but I don't think we're a 4-9 team or anything that extreme. Maybe like an 8-5 team or 7-6.

Yeah, our wins have been overly reliant on goaltending, but we've also been winning despite Crosby not producing and the PP being anemic. If that changes we'll be better than a 9-4 team.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

I kinda feel like the Pens are this girl right now.

Well yeah, I did win a beauty contest. That means something.

Right?

RIGHT??!?

Oh **** it, don't hate me because I am beautiful.

 

[The Greatest 101]

At least two WBS defensemen are better than Scuds currently.I'm not joking.

 

[ColePens]

At least two WBS defensemen are better than Scuds currently.I'm not joking.

There are two guys in the presser waiting to get their shot and were told it would be a rotation.

<insert rotation wheel here>