GDT: Pens’ Black & Gold Game (7 p.m., CEC | Free admission | TV: ROOT)

[BeauKnows19]

And here's Megna's awesome shoot out goal
http://video.penguins.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=912&id=193479&cmpid=pit-twt-penguins

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

With Martin... I think my biggest issue is his lack of determination on the ice. He casually does everything. Whether it's good or bad. It just throws me off. Play with some desperation.

No kidding. The best description I could use for Martin would be:

Urgency never changes to suit the situation.

Which is probably why he gets eaten up in the playoffs when everything is ramped up.

That was my initial reaction. Creating offense single-handedly without needing Sid/Geno? Umm.. yes please.

Whenever he makes the line-up, he's gonna add a dimension we've been waiting for since...jesus, I don't know. Hossa?

Do you think Errey's "Butter Hands" will stick with, Sutter?

Haha, gotta love Errey.

I would agree with that for sure. But I know hearing an interview with Sutter over the summer, he is determined to prove his offensive side. (whether he has it in him, I dunno, I guess we will see.) In the interview, he mentioned several times that he knows what his current role is, but that hopes to show he is a lot more than a 3rd line center. He sounded very much like Jordan Staal from a few years ago. He sees himself as a top 6 eventually. And while he was glad to be on the team, he sounded like a guy who wants to move up to a greater offensive role in the future. Then stated he knew his role here, considering the guys in front of him, and would do his best in that role, but he thinks he has offensive ability. He sounded like a confident guy. Definitely has ambitions beyond being a 3rd line shutdown center his whole career.

Love the confidence. Hope he comes out with a chip on his shoulder.

Of course, he's a Sutter, so he's already got genetics on his side when it comes to work ethic.

 

[dogthateats]

Whenever he makes the line-up, he's gonna add a dimension we've been waiting for since...jesus, I don't know. Hossa?

During the game some of the plays Beau did reminded me a lot of Hossa. This team really misses offensive creativity outside of 3 or 4 players.

 

[ObsessedCreative*]

And here's Megna's awesome shoot out goal
http://video.penguins.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=912&id=193479&cmpid=pit-twt-penguins

t'was sick!

 

[#66]

Yeah, I just shake my head when people say Engelland has speed issues - he doesn't. He just doesn't. He skates very well for a physical defenseman, and can rush the puck out of danger pretty well too.

Sometimes players get a label they just can't shake. Look at Scuds. Everyone was beating up his skating even when he went to two finals. Then when the Pens got Zib, it was an upgrade over Scuds because he was more mobile... it wasn't.

 

[MonsterSurge]

For the record...I wasn't knocking Engelland's skating.

 

[M0NTY26]

Sutter seems like captain material. He's young and new to the team, but he just comes across as a leader. It's good to know that we lost one guy like that, but replaced that leadership in the same deal.

 

[malkovsby]

Sometimes players get a label they just can't shake. Look at Scuds. Everyone was beating up his skating even when he went to two finals. Then when the Pens got Zib, it was an upgrade over Scuds because he was more mobile... it wasn't.

agreed 100%, and engellend plays simple hockey within his role and skill level..if he could block shots like scud i would love it..the way scuderi shut down the lanes coming out of the corners brought a smile to my face every time

 

[hctopcheds11]

Based on everything I'm reading, defense is still a concern. Personnel wise, I'm just not excited about our top-4.

 

[mgd525]

I think Engle will be the suprise this year. I think he should be on the 2nd pairing.

Paul Martin cant bring anything to this team. Nothing....You can't have a top 4 d man unwilling to take a hit to make a play, you just can't. I'm quite pissed off we have to go through another season of watching Martin dodge checks while getting 5 million to do so. He's so easy for forwards to play against.

Despres tonight didn't play well.

Strait and Bortuzzo looked pretty solid. I really want Burt on this team.

Orpik-Letang
Nisky-Engle
Burt-Strait/Martin


It's really risky but other than Strait's first NHL game hes made the simple plays and you dont notice him. Which is a wonderful thing with this defense.

I think Burts ready. It's really risky going with a defense this young but in all honesty we know what we have in Martin. Lets see what these kids have.


It would be great to bring in a top 4 d man but ffs no d man we bring in can play in this system for whatever reason unless they have been in it for a few years.

 

[Captain Hook]

Everything for me was a plus. I was there. Except....

Paul Martin. Basically every part of his game. I was embarrassed for him.

edit: He needs cut/bought-out/sent on a one-way train to Elsewhere, USA/CAN.

Paul Martin wasn't that bad tonight. People are just complaining to complain about the guy.

 

[mgd525]

Paul Martin wasn't that bad tonight. People are just complaining to complain about the guy.

He wasn't that bad tonight I agree. Sadly our expectations these days for him are satisfied if he doesn't play terrible. He's Wade Redden, he has alot of talent but no heart.

 

[Captain Hook]

He wasn't that bad tonight I agree. Sadly our expectations these days for him are satisfied if he doesn't play terrible. He's Wade Redden, he has alot of talent but no heart.

That's true.

He is soft, finesse or whatever else you want to call him but that's who he's always been and yet he was still a very effective player in New Jersey for years doing it. He just hasn't been as successful here doing it.

I still want to get an extended look with him and Orpik as a shutdown pair though. Maybe he'll find his niche with that.

 

[theicebox]

Paul Martin wasn't that bad tonight. People are just complaining to complain about the guy.

He wasn't that bad tonight I agree. Sadly our expectations these days for him are satisfied if he doesn't play terrible. He's Wade Redden, he has alot of talent but no heart.

I disagree. I stand by my opinion.

I. He was pulled from the BLACK team powerplay. Would not shoot. Differed to everyone. No confidence. Interesting, since basically every offensive d-man was on the white team.

II. He was getting beat defensively by career AHLers.

III. He would not use his body on the boards.

The man makes 5 million dollars. My whole section at the scrimmage was furious about him. Despres, Morrow, Bortuzzo, and Strait all showed potential... potential that is being blocked by the enigma named Paul Martin.

I am sorry. I am a fan of this team, I just do not understand how Shero can watch, and not say "**** me, what the **** was I thinking", every time he watches Martin play. I am not angry at Martin, I am embarrassed for him.

He has reached the pinnacle of his profession through mediocre performance. For a 5 million cap hit, or a 500,000 cap hit, I want a team player who shows emotion about his team. That doesn't happen in this case. End rant.

 

[Captain Hook]

I. He was pulled from the BLACK team powerplay. Would not shoot. Differed to everyone. No confidence. Interesting, since basically every offensive d-man was on the white team.

He isn't a PP guy. I think that's pretty obvious.

II. He was getting beat defensively by career AHLers.

I didn't notice him get beat a lot at least not for quality scoring chances. I saw Despres get beat a couple times by Sutter and Ulf's kid get beat along the wall by Bennett. I can't remember a goal happening as a result of Martin though. The one big mistake he made was on a miscommunication where he reversed the puck but the player he expected to be there left that area and it led to a scoring chance but not a goal.

III. He would not use his body on the boards.

Not his game. He's never played physical that way.

I agree he's overpaid and been a disappointment but I don't feel he deserved much criticism for tonight's game.

 

[mgd525]

The man makes 5 million dollars. My whole section at the scrimmage was furious about him. Despres, Morrow, Bortuzzo, and Strait all showed potential... potential that is being blocked by the enigma named Paul Martin.QUOTE]

That's my feelings at this point. All he is doing is taking up a roster spot when we have solid prospects ready for the NHL.

 

[Captain Hook]

I didn't think Despres or Morrow showed much tonight. Both looked shaky. I think they'll be going back to WBS to work on some things.

Strait and Bortuzzo looked solid and are likely to make the team.

 

[theicebox]

He isn't a PP guy. I think that's pretty obvious.

That is kind of my point. Neither were the majority of the defensemen on his team, yet he was pulled in favor of the other options, who all make 10-20% of his salary. That should make him embarrassed.

He will get his chance, but I doubt he proves his critics wrong. If hockey was war and players soldiers, I would not want to go into battle with Martin.

On the bright side, I was impressed with our offensive prospects. We may be in excellent shape. We have our centers, and potentially enough young wingers (Bennett + Megna + Tangradi + Uher, etc), with a ton of blue chip D prospects. Therefore, I am a happy camper. If anything, I feel more comfortable with Shero's drafting philosophy after the scrimmage.

 

[JTG]

I didn't think Paul Martin did that bad at all.


I don't know if anyone here will remember, but when we got him I said that he'd be the whipping boy in no time. There is absolutely nothing the guy could ever do correct to satisfy the yinzer faithful at this point. He could honestly play like Lidstrom and people would still come out with the posts that they are now.

"OMFGZ, did you see how bad Paul Martin looked in a scrimmage that represented the first hockey game he's played in in 8 months!!!!!!11!!!!1"

I think what gets incredibly mixed up is a guy not playing the game the way you want him to does not mean he's a ****** hockey player.

 

[theicebox]

He could honestly play like Lidstrom and people would still come out with the posts that they are now.

I hope he does.

 

[JTG]

It wouldn't matter. Yinzer faithful are at the point now where they got the blinders on. They need to see no more. They can be seen posting on HF and calling into radio talk shows saying like, "Paul Martin has sucked for 2 years!!!!"

Paul Martin has sucked for about 40 games....50 games max. He was actually a gigantic reason we won as much as we did 2 years ago when our forward group was decimated. He had a great part of last season sandwiched by 2 ****** parts.

 

[Captain Hook]

That is kind of my point. Neither were the majority of the defensemen on his team, yet he was pulled in favor of the other options, who all make 10-20% of his salary. That should make him embarrassed.

The coach may have just wanted to take a look at other guys on the PP. He knows what Martin can and can't do in that area.

He will get his chance, but I doubt he proves his critics wrong. If hockey was war and players soldiers, I would not want to go into battle with Martin.

Agreed.

On the bright side, I was impressed with our offensive prospects. We may be in excellent shape. We have our centers, and potentially enough young wingers (Bennett + Megna + Tangradi + Uher, etc), with a ton of blue chip D prospects. Therefore, I am a happy camper. If anything, I feel more comfortable with Shero's drafting philosophy after the scrimmage.

I like what I saw from Bennett. The slick goal and he also had a pretty nice hit on the forecheck.

Tangradi was not that noticeable. He made a few subtle plays but needs to do a lot more if he wants any chance of sticking with Neal and Malkin.

The Megna shootout goal was unreal. He showed a lot of skill with that and has lots of speed too.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

It wouldn't matter. Yinzer faithful are at the point now where they got the blinders on. They need to see no more. They can be seen posting on HF and calling into radio talk shows saying like, "Paul Martin has sucked for 2 years!!!!"

Paul Martin has sucked for about 40 games....50 games max. He was actually a gigantic reason we won as much as we did 2 years ago when our forward group was decimated. He had a great part of last season sandwiched by 2 ****** parts.

But as soon as he has a good stretch they'll say they always loved him.

See: Gonchar, Sergei

 

[mgd525]

I didn't think Paul Martin did that bad at all.


I don't know if anyone here will remember, but when we got him I said that he'd be the whipping boy in no time. There is absolutely nothing the guy could ever do correct to satisfy the yinzer faithful at this point. He could honestly play like Lidstrom and people would still come out with the posts that they are now.

"OMFGZ, did you see how bad Paul Martin looked in a scrimmage that represented the first hockey game he's played in in 8 months!!!!!!11!!!!1"

I think what gets incredibly mixed up is a guy not playing the game the way you want him to does not mean he's a ****** hockey player.

That's not true at all. His first season with the penguins he played great. He wasn't physical and still soft. You could over look it then because his skating,positioning,angles and stick were all great. Currently, he can still skate. He's awful. It's a new season he will get his chance to some way do a 180 and get back to being a really good player. I just really don't think he will.

I'm not sure how if you can't stand a soft as butter d man that turns the puck over, can't play defense any longer for whatever reason makes you a yinzer.

Some people make me laugh throwing out the yinzer **** like their better than everyone else that roots for the penguins/steelers ect.

 

[alcanalz]

JTG nailed it on the head and what I've been saying for a couple years now, but I don't want to get in to another Martin-fest here so I'll leave it at this: can some of you guys just go in to the season and give him an honest chance? He was super solid for us in year one, and bad for us in year two. It's year three, wipe the slate clean and let's see what happens. It's annoying for everyone to go in to any thread and see pages full of Martin-bashing deserved or not.

I can honestly say I have no idea which D are going to be kept up. I don't think Beau will regardless of how well he's played. It's not like this team is desperate for his offensive creativity.

Always liked and wanted to keep Jeffrey up. Adams has done so much for this team I feel it's unlikely he won't be on the fourth line to start, so perhaps that leaves Jeffrey as the thirteenth man. With all our injury luck, I would never hope for someone to get hurt, but I almost hope someone will so Jeffrey can get a dozen or so games on the second or third line or something. He deserves the shot.