Rumor: Pagnotta: Keep an eye on DAL/NSH/VGK/CHI if Marner is shopped

[Magic Mittens]

Toronto doesn't go for Harley 1-for-1 with Marner and if you think they do you're stupid. Vegas does whatever they want lol.

You wouldn't trade Marner for a young Defenseman who's already playing on the top pairing for Marner? Harleys next deal will be alot less then Marner, so you'd be saving cap space also.

If Jim Nill made this trade, I'd drive to his house a punch him straight in his face

 

[Hattrick Kane]

Look at the first time Karlsson got traded. Multiple time Norris winner, 27-28 years old. Literally a top 5 defenseman in the world. Almost dragged the Senators to a cup appearance the year before.

#4 defenseman in Demelo, middle six forward in Tierney, two good but not blue chip prospects in Norris and Balcers and a second and first round pick (Which became Stutzle because the Sharks unexpectedly stunk, very lucky for the Sens)

This is the type of return Leafs fans need to expect. Teams will simply not give away the high value players and picks Leafs fans are clamouring for here. Asking for Harley or Vlasic is delusional.

 

[Soundgarden]

Cant see Nashville doing Schenn dirty like that a year after signing him

Schenn really isn't that good, if that gets it done we'd consider ourselves lucky we didn't have to part with any of our youth.

I think the consensus on the press board is we'd be cool with parting with Saros + some combination of Tomasino/Fabbro/1st etc.

 

[redwings25]

I want to see a marner bedard and kane line. Would be the softest line in nhl history. Even if they all got 120 points they would somehow be like -50 +/-

 

[jaric1862]

The two teams that just make too much sense are Seattle and Utah.

 

[Uncle Scrooge]

I'd love to see Marner on the Preds. He's the type of forward they really haven't had, well basically ever.

Forsberg could use some help in the production department.

 

[Phion Keneuf]

Marner
For
Saros + Tomasino + Fabbro

Proposed that about a month ago, and still think it makes the most sense for both sides. Would love Evangelista instead of Tomasino and/or a 1st included as well but don’t think it’ll happen

 

[Cancuks]

If it's Vegas then Pietrangelo and Barbeshev for Marner is my guess now that Berube is in Toronto.

 

[WingsToPick4th]

Wings last missing piece is a 100 point super star winger.

Could offer 2024 #15OA + Michael Rasmussen + William Wallinder for Marner at his full hit

 

[Hostile Offer]

CHI would have to do a pretty hard sell-job to get Marner to waive to come here. Its possible, but I dont think its likely.

Only one year left on the contract. Handshake deal that Marner is traded to a contender if the Hawks are out of it by the TDL. I doubt they can sign him to an extension though.

 

[eojsmada]

Dallas has no reason to get Marner, they're in the WCF with a wide open window.

Nashville makes no sense, because they are still re-tooling with a new GM and losing all those assets to get one player would be the same mistakes they made getting Duchene and Ryan Johansen and Trotz, I would think, would not make the same ugly mistake his predecessor did.

I think Vegas and Chicago make the most sense of the four listed only because Chicago has viable assets they would be willing to part with in order to help solidify their offensive depth and help out Bedard. And Vegas is always constantly re-tooling and will have continued uncertainty with Stone's back.

 

[belair]

Montour is a) Not really what the Leafs need, and b) likely to get massively overpaid based on a major outlying year last year.

Larsson comes in at just $4m, and while it is unfortunately only for 1 year, him being 32 probably makes it easier to keep his cap hit down with a longer term, frontloaded, bonus laden deal.

As for Oleksiak, I would agree with you on that, I think Larsson and Borgen are the more logical targets.

With respect to Burakovsky, his numbers have completely plummeted since leaving Colorado, and he's often injured. I'm sure Seattle would like to ship him in a Marner deal, just as I'm sure the Leafs wouldn't be interested in comitting valuable cap resources to him.

As for Wright, yes, he does appear to be ready to battle for a spot in the lineup next year... but the lack of upward trajectory is massively concerning. When looking at a player who's 18-19-20, the most important thing is that they're growing every year. Wright was a standout player in his draft class and was probably the best on-ice 17-18 year old that season. He's been somewhat stagnant in these crucial development years.

The Leafs also have Minten, who would likely be competing for the exact same spot in the lineup / ice time, and Cowan; who's stock has obviously been massively on the rise over the last year.

I'd question the use of the word "marquee" here, to be fair.

- Wright is a guy who's stock has been on somewhat of a freefall since being the draft.
- Larsson's a really good defenceman on a really good contract, but he's only got 1 year left and is 31 years old.
- Bjorkstrand is a 55-60 point player. On a good team, he's should be a 2nd line winger.

Maybe you've got a higher opinion of Wright than I do. Personally, I'd have no problem ditching Wright, and to be honest, I'd almost certianly consider 8th overall better than him. Seattle's 2025 1st, maybe Wright's better than that, but not much IMO. Maybe it's not Larsson but Borgen as the Leafs take the downgrade to try and stay younger / cheaper.

edit: Before chiming in that "Marner has only 1 year left, why doesn't that impact his value when it does for Larsson?"...

It's because Marner is the marquee piece in the deal and has full say as to where he's going. If he's going to Seattle, it's likely because he's interested in resigning there, and may have an extension be part of the negotiation. It's REALLY hard to have two players on opposing sides of a deal negotiate extensions to make the deal work. Larsson also only has a 10-team NTC, so Toronto may not be somewhere he wants to stay.

#1 Larsson will not be moved by Seattle. Their top pair is untouchable because there's no one there to replace them. Robbing Peter to pay Paul.

#2 Seattle wouldn't move the #8 without Marner signed to an extension and that isn't possible, so that dream needs to die. Marner will be moved when there's an extension possibility, because it does impact his perceived value. Substantially.

#3 I understand we won't agree on the pieces I've laid out, but I feel all three returning to Toronto would be beneficial to their short, medium and long-term needs. All three of the players mentioned are twenty-something players who will be under team control for the next three plus years.

The Leafs need to maintain a competitive roster. But moving player of that caliber, you should be looking at trying to get the younger asset. Extend the competitive window. Trading for thirty-somethings at any position does the opposite.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

If it's Chicago it's got to include Seth Jones, which I won't lie a top 3 of Rielly, Jones and McCabe is a solid top 3.

I just don't know how you convince Marner to go to Chicago, yes They have Bedard, and that will attract players but it's going to be a LONG LONG time before they are competitive

 

[BB88]

Some pretty rough takes here. Theodore is good, but Marner is easily worth more. We need a partner for Rielly on the top pair, both play a similar game. Leafs Pass.

Harley > Marner? A rookie defender who had a solid season at 22? We value things much, much differently. Hintz + Harley is terrible for Dallas, but don't go thinking Marner couldn't get either one (and then some in return).

Agreed on Schenn.

Chicago's offer is a laugh. Leafs pass.

You have to add the contracts into consideration of value

Marner will be a 12M player, Hintz is signed for 8.45Mx7 contract and Harley will at best be making half of Marners salary

& No, Marner simply wouldn’t bring back a similar aged 1C in return.
With Johnson& Stankoven they are neither in no rush to break up a 10 year top pairing of Harley- Heiskanen for a winger

 

[bobholly39]

Someone walk me through how the hell Vegas would even be in consideration with their cap issues?

It's Las Vegas.

Make sense now?

 

[Bruce Granville]

But he will no longer be treated like a god...

Maybe like an ace of spades? Or at least a king of diamonds? Queen of hearts? Or will end up as a jester of the whole club?

 

[francis246]

Leafs fans are gonna be very underwhelmed with the return.

Marner holds the cards, and the other team has to pay him big money.

No we won’t, if PLD could get the return he got while openly saying he only wants to be a hab, the return for Marner who’s a better player will be greater. If Marner agrees to be traded a contract extension will be negotiated. His value around the league is still high. Marner wants an 8 year deal and teams will happily pay him that. He’s still a star player who will draw at the gate.

 

[francis246]

if im Toronto I’m thrilled to get either one of Harley or Hintz, both is a pipe dream

Marner has a NTC which diminish his value. I think Toronto can fetch a 1st + solid roster player. Three others offers seems in the good ball park.

When has an NTC or NMC ever diminished the value of a player. 75% of the league has one. Some of you guys just say shit to say shit

 

[BB88]

No we won’t, if PLD could get the return he got while openly saying he only wants to be a hab, the return for Marner who’s a better player will be greater. If Marner agrees to be traded a contract extension will be negotiated. His value around the league is still high. Marner wants an 8 year deal and teams will happily pay him that. He’s still a star player who will draw at the gate.

Again, he’s not coming with a cap hit that’s going to be easy to fit in

He’s going to bring back a strong return but he’s a ”soft” winger with a massive cap hit

You can see what LA tried with PLD trade and it’s still an awfull trade

 

[francis246]

Again, he’s not coming with a cap hit that’s going to be easy to fit in

He’s going to bring back a strong return but he’s a ”soft” winger with a massive cap hit

Who cares about his cap. Teams don’t care about the cap hit. Toronto can retain and teams can send cap back to Toronto.

You know what teams care about? That Toronto will pay his bonus on July 1st and Marner will be making less than a million in real money. Teams will be ALL over that. The cap isn’t really that much of a hurdle especially since his real money is like $900,000

 

[BB88]

Who cares about his cap. Teams don’t care about the cap hit. Toronto can retain and teams can send cap back to Toronto.

You know what teams care about? That Toronto will pay his bonus on July 1st and Marner will be making less than a million in real money. Teams will be ALL over that. The cap isn’t really that much of a hurdle especially since his real money is like $900,000

What a quality post

”Who cares about the cap” well about every team in the league and Toronto will not pay a single dime on his future contract if traded

So better luck next time

 

[waitin425]

Marner to Chicago for 2nd overall.

Leafs draft Cowans buddy Dickinson.

Leafs have new cap space to re-sign Domi and Bertuzzi.

Also space to go UFA huntin on D. Pesce?

 

[seanlinden]

#1 Larsson will not be moved by Seattle. Their top pair is untouchable because there's no one there to replace them. Robbing Peter to pay Paul.

#2 Seattle wouldn't move the #8 without Marner signed to an extension and that isn't possible, so that dream needs to die. Marner will be moved when there's an extension possibility, because it does impact his perceived value. Substantially.

#3 I understand we won't agree on the pieces I've laid out, but I feel all three returning to Toronto would be beneficial to their short, medium and long-term needs. All three of the players mentioned are twenty-something players who will be under team control for the next three plus years.

The Leafs need to maintain a competitive roster. But moving player of that caliber, you should be looking at trying to get the younger asset. Extend the competitive window. Trading for thirty-somethings at any position does the opposite.

Call me crazy, but Seattle isn't going to let Adam Larsson, no matter how good he's been for them, get in the way of acquiring Mitch Marner, if indeed Marner is willing to go there, etc.

Your assertion that the Leafs need to get something that helps them both now and in the future is correct, but with the 3 pieces you've laid out, are missing the "meaningful" or "positive" contributions. These guys literally "check boxes", without any consideration of whether a team like Toronto would even want them, even if it was free.

Burakovsky is a cap dump at this point, and likely holds negative value. If the Leafs are looking to spend $5.5m on a winger, they would be better off simply re-signing Tyler Bertuzzi.

Shane Wright is a guy who's development has nearly flat-lined since the draft 2 years ago. That's a massive red flag for a player's long term upside, and he looks a lot more like a future Alexandre Daigle than Patrice Bergeron. Toronto has Fraser Minten, who they would probably prefer to get the spot in the lineup.

The prospect you've included, maybe he's appealing, maybe he's not, but he's a prospect... and we have not addressed anythign in terms of meaningful contribution to the Leafs in the now or short term.

If Marner goes, the base, base requirement for any deal is that the Leafs have to get back at least one "top half of the lineup" player with a good contract situation. Can be a right shot defenceman with size, can be a #2 centre, or can be a 50-60 point winger; although I think the winger would be the least desirable of the 3 options.

Burakovsky and Wright do not meet any of those criteria. The Leafs offer for Burakovsky & Wright should probably be Nick Robertson; recognizing that Burakovsky is negative value, and Wright's value is more than Robertson's.... not Mitch Marner.

 

[francis246]

What a quality post

”Who cares about the cap” well about every team in the league and Toronto will not pay a single dime on his future contract if traded

So better luck next time

Who said anything about Toronto paying anything on his future contract?

We are talking about the one year he has left. Toronto will be paying the bonus on that contract. That’s what teams care about, real money. Every team can make the cap work if they want to. What most teams can’t always afford is to pay a huge bonus plus the salary to a player. Thats why Marner’s contract is very attractive to teams. Toronto will take care of the bonus for this season and the club he is traded to will only have to worry about 900,000k in REAL money which is chump change to them. Most teams will figure out how to make Marner fit under their cap if all they have to do is pay him less than a million in real money. All of Toronto’s contracts are structured this way so those star players are easier to trade at the end of their contracts and doesn’t diminish their value.

Please learn and understand the business of contracts.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

I'm suprised that Leafs fans think Marner will just roll over and die and wave the NMC just to help the team out if they make him feel *unwanted* enough. If anything wouldn't he try to stay in spite and leave as a ufa? Maybe it ticks him off and he wants to be a villain now