Alexander Ovechkin Discussion Thread

[TheBig08]

So Ovehckin during 2006-2007, 2010-2011, 2011-2012, 2015-2016, 2023-2024 had a drastic drop off in production so I was wondering if anybody could tell me why that was.

In 2005-2006 his stats were 81 GP, 52 G, 54 A, 106 P then he just dropped down to 82 GP, 46 G, 46 A, 96 points then 2007-2008 he went back up to 82 GP, 65 G, 47 A, 112 P. Thats not a bad drop off its just that he had just got 106 points then got 112 the next season. I also don't feel like there was a reason expect he his number went down a little bit but if there is a reason let me know.

Then 2009-2010 his stats were 72 G, 50 G, 59 A, 109 P which put him on pace for 82 GP, 57 G (could have possibly scored 60 goals), 67 A (could have possibly got 70), 124 P (could have possibly got 130) then he just suddenly drops to 79 GP, 32 G, 53 A, 85 P in 2010-2011 then drops off even more to 78 GP, 38 G, 27 A, 65 P then just goes back up to 48 GP, 32 G, 27 A, 56 P which put on him on pace for 82 GP, 55 G (could have possibly scored 60 goals), 41 A, 96 P (could have possibly got over 100) so what happened to him during 2010-2011 and 2011-2012.

Then 2015-2016 he has 79 GP, 50 G, 21 A, 71 P then drops off to 82 GP, 33 G, 36 A, 69 P during 2016-2017 then just go backs up to 82 GP 49G, 38 A, 87 P during 2017-2018 so what happened to him during 2016-2017?

2023-2024 drop off I feel like that was just him declining but if there is a reason for that let me know.

Also whatever the reasons are for his declines if he didn't have them how would of those seasons gone meaning is there awards he would have won and what would his stats be.

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[rmartin65]

Can we just get a general Ovechkin discussion thread for a while?

 

[TheBig08]

Can we just get a general Ovechkin discussion thread for a while?

I turned this into one. Are you still going to join the discussion?

 

[WarriorofTime]

Caps changed systems, he got a bit older.

 

[rmartin65]

Sure. I think Ovechkin was/is more susceptible to major swings than other super(super super super) stars because he was more unidimensional as an offensive producer, especially as he aged.

 

[Michael Farkas]

The original title was really quite something haha

I know I'll sound off the PR team's alarm with this, but I don't mind...I can't speak to 2007, nor should that really be considered such a huge dip...it's probably just that their power play wasn't as good. Likely just "noise" or whatever folks say to explain away stuff they can't or don't want to explain...that's me right now haha

But on the whole, he's a bit of an early peaker from an athletic standpoint...talking about the physical development arc. So basically anything towards the end of and after the typical athletic prime, is a product of those diminishing returns. Based on what you can see and what I've heard around the league, I don't think it's any secret that Ovechkin isn't exactly a TB12 adherer...so, extending his athletic prime wasn't really in the cards haha

Ovechkin was a straight up menace to defend in his early years. Like, we don't see it from the side angle of games really, but galloping Ovechkin taking that arc towards the net in 2008 or whatever is one of the most intimidating things in history probably. It's a huge galloping stride, obviously he has hands, the shot is an all-timer...he can release it at any point in his stride, at any point in his hand placement. So, it's really difficult for everyone...

But as the athletic prime wore down, some of that intimidation factor went with it...even though he was always bottom of the list for defending, he used to take these little circles in the defensive zone and jump clears and weak-side plays...but as the years grew on, that energy and mobility went down, so he started flat-footed more and more...and since Washington usually made the mistake of "get the puck to Ovechkin first" as part of their breakout routine (and not have hardly any other multi-line puck carriers around him...Kuznetsov being a prime exception, when he checked in for work), so it became a little bit easier to defend him off the rush.

I imagine the statistics will bear this out, if not, shame on me...but around the end of his athletic prime there should be a shift from ES goal production being handed off to PP goal production. It's because his rush tactics were adapted to and he had a little to counter it with. He's not the strongest passer in stride relative to the greats, a lot of his best passing work actually came from driving back his defender and creating space and speed behind the puck. Again, as we get through his mid-20's, defenders are more and more likely to hang in there and "take the charge" so to speak. So, his best assist generator (outside of rebounds, I suspect...but it's hard to square it with him rarely shooting for rebounds...he shot to kill, so maybe that was his best assist "weapon", so to speak) was sort of sputtering.

Ovechkin never had to be the most efficient player because he had overwhelming physical gifts and an overwhelming technical skill that was sort of environment-agnostic, so again, there's an adaptability piece that's sort of missing from him and you can see him less and less able to overcome it as he fell out of the age of athleticism. Even rudimentary defenders like Dan Girardi and Rob Scuderi types were able to just sort of hang in there at ES against him. They ate ****, but that was enough to beat him (or tie him or slightly lose to him, whatever doesn't get me nitpicked by the firm haha) at ES...and if he went post and in on the power play, they won. If he went post and out, you won.

I did a fairly lengthy breakdown of a little play here from 2012: Ovechkin just won his 9th Rocket. Does this change how you view him?

In short...

Ovechkin is now well outside the dot. And the defenseman has regained control of the situation because he owns the dot line, Ovechkin offered no real speed differential, no gap to exploit, and as a result...

...is a pretty fair summation of it.

Now and for the last several years, I mean...what can you even say...? He can still throw the puck in the net whenever he wants, which is crazy. But it's prettyyyyyyyyyyyy.........not pretty to watch. He never really added much to his game as his athletic prime faded. So, there weren't a lot of places to go. Everything just more or less attritioned except his shot. So, you get what you get.

And I'm saying this over the course of the career, not with specific drips and drabs, which might have been your original intent...like, sure, Adam Oates taking his shot out of the interior and all that, that has an effect...but Ovechkin's career has been a finished product to me for half a decade now and it all sort of tracked how I expected it to track MINUS the fact that he was still gonna be able to always shoot the puck past goalies in the back nine of his career. 35, 40? Sure, on talent alone. But 50 and leading the league into his mid 30s or whatever it was...? That's the part I didn't see coming, and for many, that's a pretty big exception - fair enough.