Orr Vs Gretzky

[orrisGod]

Gretzky :1984-85 Edmonton Oilers NHL (G)80 (Gls)73 (A)135 (pts)208 (pm)52 (+/-) +98

Orr: 1970-71 Boston NHL (G)78 (Gls)37 (A)102 (Pts)139 (pm)91 (+/-) +124

the +124 is a nhl record. this is by an defenseman. not a forward. this means orr was on the ice for 15 of his teams 207 goals against that year or 7% of his teams goals against. gretzky this year, which was his best +/- year was on the ice for 110 of his teams 298 goals against or 36%. they both averaged an incredible amount of on ice team but orr was on the ice more because of penalty killing situations. now i contend , had bobby orr had access to the medical advances of today that perhaps wayne may have been chasing orrs numbers and not gordie howes.

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[BRONX_MADNESS*]

Totally agree, Wayne was a great player but he isn't touching Bobby

Orr>>>>>>>Gretzky

 

[Bruins420]

Bobby Orr the Great One

orr this shouldn't even be up for discussion gretzky played until he was 40 and knew nothing about the other part of hockey called dfense and if orr got the protection that gretzky got from the league this board would be filled with more GRetzky sucks posts.
Orr was just hitting his stride when he got injured at 28!!!! he tried to come back but couldn't.

 

[espo*]

Ah,it's pretty close folks.

Number 1 and 1a however you want to rate em.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

Orr should have been better. He probably would have taken the all time assists record, but Gretzky woulda broken it. No way would Borque have the defensive scoring title. Be crazy to think what he coulda done in the high flying 80's.

But alas, tis not to be. The second greatest might have coulda been. (Gardiner being #1)

 

[Steveorama]

I saw them both play and I am very comfortable saying that a team of Orrs would beat a team of Gretzkys. Orr was absolutely superhuman and he could play both ways and he could fight, too. If Orr had stayed healthy, I know this would be a slam dunk.
Orr is the only player I ever saw who consistenly looked like a pro playing against amateurs...he was that good.

 

[God Bless Canada]

Orr should have been better. He probably would have taken the all time assists record, but Gretzky woulda broken it. No way would Borque have the defensive scoring title. Be crazy to think what he coulda done in the high flying 80's.

But alas, tis not to be. The second greatest might have coulda been. (Gardiner being #1)

The high-scoring 80s wouldn't have happened if not for Orr. A big reason for the production is that thanks to Orr, teams were more comfortable in allowing their players join the rush. It added a new dimension to teams' offence.

A lot of really good offensive defencemen owe their careers to Bobby Orr.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

The high-scoring 80s wouldn't have happened if not for Orr. A big reason for the production is that thanks to Orr, teams were more comfortable in allowing their players join the rush. It added a new dimension to teams' offence.

A lot of really good offensive defencemen owe their careers to Bobby Orr.

What I meant is that if he was healthy, he woulda played his 30's in the 80's. He could have reaped the benefits of his own innovation.

 

[Boris Le Tigre]

I'll take orr... not taking anything away form the great one, who's close behind...
simply amazing for a defencemen to carry those stats... art ross, are you kidding me

 

[Ogopogo*]

Gretzky :1984-85 Edmonton Oilers NHL (G)80 (Gls)73 (A)135 (pts)208 (pm)52 (+/-) +98

Orr: 1970-71 Boston NHL (G)78 (Gls)37 (A)102 (Pts)139 (pm)91 (+/-) +124

the +124 is a nhl record. this is by an defenseman. not a forward. this means orr was on the ice for 15 of his teams 207 goals against that year or 7% of his teams goals against. gretzky this year, which was his best +/- year was on the ice for 110 of his teams 298 goals against or 36%. they both averaged an incredible amount of on ice team but orr was on the ice more because of penalty killing situations. now i contend , had bobby orr had access to the medical advances of today that perhaps wayne may have been chasing orrs numbers and not gordie howes.

Another chance to bash Gretzky, eh?

Wayne is the greatest forward of all time, Orr is the greatest defenseman. There is no point bashing either so, why do you do it?

 

[reckoning]

Ah,it's pretty close folks.

Number 1 and 1a however you want to rate em.

Totally off-topic, but I love your avatar

gretzky played until he was 40 and knew nothing about the other part of hockey called dfense and if orr got the protection that gretzky got from the league this board would be filled with more GRetzky sucks posts.

Does that post remind you guys of anybody?

 

[espo*]

Totally off-topic, but I love your avatar


Does that post remind you guys of anybody?

Thanks,i put a lot of work into it!!! I'm real proud of it and i like to think it injects a daily dose of honesty into HFBoards

 

[God Bless Canada]

What I meant is that if he was healthy, he woulda played his 30's in the 80's. He could have reaped the benefits of his own innovation.

Thanks for the clarification. I completely agree.

Anyways, who was the better player? Orr. Nobody has ever dominated all aspects of the game like Bobby Orr. Everyone remembers the offensive flair and the all-time great skating. But he was excellent defensively, a master shot-blocker, a physical player, and when the situation called for it, a very good fighter. Very, very strong.

IMO, for a forward to be as good as Orr, (using the 80s Oilers as an example) he would have to combine Gretzky's offensive ability, Messier's physical play and Kurri's defensive ability.

Gretzky's the best offensive player ever, the smartest player ever, and I would say he had the best career ever, with all his records and accolades. But Orr was the better player.

 

[BNHL]

Ah,it's pretty close folks.

Number 1 and 1a however you want to rate em.

Sorry but that is totally inaccurate,there is Orr then there is everybody else. Orr worked both ends of the ice with a combination of virtuosity and fearlessness that Wayne simply did not possess.He controlled the game with unequaled skill and defended himself with a frightening ferocity. He played a very physical game and as Gerry Cheevers said "he should have won the Vezina"!

 

[mcphee]

Thanks for the clarification. I completely agree.

Anyways, who was the better player? Orr. Nobody has ever dominated all aspects of the game like Bobby Orr. Everyone remembers the offensive flair and the all-time great skating. But he was excellent defensively, a master shot-blocker, a physical player, and when the situation called for it, a very good fighter. Very, very strong.

IMO, for a forward to be as good as Orr, (using the 80s Oilers as an example) he would have to combine Gretzky's offensive ability, Messier's physical play and Kurri's defensive ability.

Gretzky's the best offensive player ever, the smartest player ever, and I would say he had the best career ever, with all his records and accolades. But Orr was the better player.

That's exactly how I've always felt about it. They're also great examples of how it's a team game and they only won when part of a great team.

 

[Vermicious knid]

Ah,it's pretty close folks.

Number 1 and 1a however you want to rate em.

I agree.

 

[espo*]

Sorry but that is totally inaccurate,there is Orr then there is everybody else. Orr worked both ends of the ice with a combination of virtuosity and fearlessness that Wayne simply did not possess.He controlled the game with unequaled skill and defended himself with a frightening ferocity. He played a very physical game and as Gerry Cheevers said "he should have won the Vezina"!

Eventhough i'd take Orr with a gun to my head i'll have to respectfully disagree that you think it's Orr so clear cut.99 owns about every conceivable offensive record there is and has close to 3,000 points.He was the most dominant athlete of the 1980's(not just hockey player) and dominated his sport on a level for so long in such a manner that few athletes have in modern athletic history.His run in the game of hockey is absolutely stunningly dominant by anyones measuring stick.


It's close...................very,very close.I mean bag hair close.

I never thought i'd see the day wayne gretzky,WAYNE FREAKING GRETZKY, was under-rated..................but i sincerely feel he is around here. Don't ask me how a guy who dominated this game like he did for so long could ever get under-rated by hockey fans but i think he has been now that he has'nt played for a few years.


That's how i honestly feel.

 

[orrisGod]

the person who is underrated is orr. orr shunned the spotlight. he didnt have a hollywood wife or request to go to tinsel town. there was no reason for wayne to ever leave edmonton except money. his point totals would have been greater and he would have won more cups in edmonton where he should have stayed. he got greedy, bought the commisioners cup of poison and walked away from the one team he really needed to stay on, the oilers.

 

[Ol' Jase]

the person who is underrated is orr. orr shunned the spotlight. he didnt have a hollywood wife or request to go to tinsel town. there was no reason for wayne to ever leave edmonton except money. his point totals would have been greater and he would have won more cups in edmonton where he should have stayed. he got greedy, bought the commisioners cup of poison and walked away from the one team he really needed to stay on, the oilers.

Thanks, kid. I never knew Gretzky left. I was under the impression he was pretty much sold to LA to help with Peter Pocklington's massive debt problems.

Thanks for correcting me. So wrong for all these years...

Oh, and Gretz was a PKer, as well.

 

[orrisGod]

first, not i'm not a kid and i watched bobby orr score the goal on mothers day 1970. secondly, maybe you need to do a little reading and a little research. if pocklington was selling to highest bidder than you and i both know the rangers have an unlimited cash flow. wayne wanted to go to hollywood. the pocklington stuff is partially true but as you learned mcnall was equally as stupid finacially and went to jail over it. the fact of the matter is gretzky could have stayed in edmonton and should have. the pocklingon garbage is oilers fans rationale of it so they can be at peace with it. at leasr when orr left boston it was because he got screwed by his agent. again, documented fact.

 

[Ol' Jase]

first, not i'm not a kid and i watched bobby orr score the goal on mothers day 1970. secondly, maybe you need to do a little reading and a little research. if pocklington was selling to highest bidder than you and i both know the rangers have an unlimited cash flow. wayne wanted to go to hollywood. the pocklington stuff is partially true but as you learned mcnall was equally as stupid finacially and went to jail over it. the fact of the matter is gretzky could have stayed in edmonton and should have. the pocklingon garbage is oilers fans rationale of it so they can be at peace with it. at leasr when orr left boston it was because he got screwed by his agent. again, documented fact.

You're saying this is documented? Where?

I would say it is your research on this matter that needs some improvement.

 

[pappyline]

You're saying this is documented? Where?

I would say it is your research on this matter that needs some improvement.

Orr being screwed by Eagleson is well documented. Read Russ Conway's book " Game Misconduct" Orr was offered part ownership of the Bruins but eagleson never informed him.

 

[Ol' Jase]

Orr being screwed by Eagleson is well documented. Read Russ Conway's book " Game Misconduct" Orr was offered part ownership of the Bruins but eagleson never informed him.

I know the fact about Orr being screwed by Eagleson is true and well documented. I was refering to the bolded part about Gretzky.

 

[pappyline]

I know the fact about Orr being screwed by Eagleson is true and well documented. I was refering to the bolded part about Gretzky.

Sorry, I misunderstood your comment.

 

[DKH]

Gretzky :1984-85 Edmonton Oilers NHL (G)80 (Gls)73 (A)135 (pts)208 (pm)52 (+/-) +98

Orr: 1970-71 Boston NHL (G)78 (Gls)37 (A)102 (Pts)139 (pm)91 (+/-) +124

the +124 is a nhl record. this is by an defenseman. not a forward. this means orr was on the ice for 15 of his teams 207 goals against that year or 7% of his teams goals against. gretzky this year, which was his best +/- year was on the ice for 110 of his teams 298 goals against or 36%. they both averaged an incredible amount of on ice team but orr was on the ice more because of penalty killing situations. now i contend , had bobby orr had access to the medical advances of today that perhaps wayne may have been chasing orrs numbers and not gordie howes.

saw Orr's entire career with 50-80 games from my parent's lodge seats, saw Gretzky probably 30 times- no contest, Orr. Bobby Schmautz played with both in their prime and not sure about on the record but off, he'd laugh at who was better. One was protected like the last living Eagle, the other hunted every game. Soon the debate will be Crosby vs Gretzky, and Orr will left alone as the single greatest defenseman and a different type of player and position than the others.