Rumor: Nylander like Matthews unextended. Nothing to see here.

[Golden_Jet]

Not a lot of time with Matthews excerpt on the PP.

Disagree
Bunting Mathew’s Nylander line played the most time together over any line according to moneypuck. That was one of the staples in the season, until later in the year.
So how many goals did those 2 get together?

NHL Lines Advanced Stats

The Best Offensive and Defensive Lines in the NHL

moneypuck.com

 

[notDatsyuk]

I never say thats mean nothing... i said the only good streche nylabder really had last 3 year is those 4 game...he played a solid half of series in 3 year and he should be considerate like a good playoff player?

Nylander high had been really high but his down was pretty trash too... the best word to describe nylander in playoff is rollercoaster...

Matthews/Marner high never been extremely high but they was constant on both side of the ice...

Right. Last three playoffs he led the team in goals, PP goals, and ES points, and tied for assists, ES goals and GWG, despite averaging between 4 1/2 and 5 1/2 minutes less ice time.

 

[notDatsyuk]

right, a PPG 35+ goal scorer is a 3rd liner ...he'd still bloody be the #1C on 50% of the teams in the league today

Half his goals and points were on the PP, and he had the worst +/- among forwards. 3C and PP. At his current contract, I'm not sure there are many teams that would take him.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I wouldn't be so sure if I were you.


I don't think that's true either and I don't like labelling players "good playoff player" or "bad playoff player", it's never that simple.

What I would say is this - during the regular season, M&M have both been much better than Nylander but in the playoffs over say the last 3 years, that gap shrinks considerably. Maybe the massive pay gap between these guys is justified re. Nylander during the regular season, for a guy like me who cares a lot more about the playoffs then record breaking Novembers etc., the massive pay gap is not justified.

Based on performance in the last 3 playoffs, I'd probably go something like this:
8 million - Nylander
9 million - Marner
10 million - Matthews

Based on expectations which are in turn based on their cap hits, Nylander has earned his money and more while M&M have underperformed expectations by a 2-3 million each and that's why when there is talk of trading Nylander, so many people react by saying why not keep Nylander and trade Marner instead?

JMHO.

And Why would that be

 

[notDatsyuk]

Disagree
Bunting Mathew’s Nylander line played the most time together over any line according to moneypuck. That was one of the staples in the season, until later in the year.
So how many goals did those 2 get together?

NHL Lines Advanced Stats

The Best Offensive and Defensive Lines in the NHL

moneypuck.com

That link shows Jarnkrok-Matthews-Marner with the most, and Bunting-Matthews-Marner second. Kerfoot and Tavares were Nylander's most frequent linemates.

 

[Gary Nylund]

And Why would that be

Can you be more specific - why would what be?

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Can you be more specific - why would what be?

You said you wouldn't be so sure if you were me.

Why would that be?

What makes you think it's even possible that gutting the franchise would be anything but stupid?

 

[Golden_Jet]

That link shows Jarnkrok-Matthews-Marner with the most, and Bunting-Matthews-Marner second. Kerfoot and Tavares were Nylander's most frequent linemates.

Now change it to regular season not playoffs.

You’ll see Bunting-Mathew’s-Nylander with the most minutes together.
TBH I thought you would have realized that, watching the games.
So now that we solved that, can you now answer how many goals they got together?

 

[Gary Nylund]

You said you wouldn't be so sure if you were me.

Why would that be?

What makes you think it's even possible that gutting the franchise would be anything but stupid?

The original quote wasn't "gut the franchise", it was this:

"Leafs will live on if they move Matthews, marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly, ..."

First of all, I took the quote to mean it's not the end of the world if they move one of those players, not necessarily all of them. As in Moving Marner isn't the end of the world, moving Nylander isn't the end of the world etc. Mind you Matthews, Marner and JT can't be moved now anyway unless they agree to be moved so it's kind of a moot point anyway.

Big picture though I think is that this core has achieved f*** all, there is zero reason to believe that the next few years will be any better (we've spent so many futures that it's not realistic to think we can add at the TDL again like we did last year) so let's face the facts, understand that we need to go in a different direction and not waste several more years overpaying this core and watching them fail.

Or to put it another way, not moving on from some (or even all) of these core pieces might be the stupid move because we're never winning anything with them anyway.

 

[Gabriel426]

Here is the thing I don’t get from the so called board, if they only care profit and image….does it matter to have AM, MM, Willie and others. Bc Leafs will sell out nomatter what, fans will buy jerseys for whoever is the best Leaf. If that’s their goals, they really don’t need to overpay for AM or whoever. Yet they keep willing to pay them despite their market value are lower.

 

[mydnyte]

Half his goals and points were on the PP, and he had the worst +/- among forwards. 3C and PP. At his current contract, I'm not sure there are many teams that would take him.

what do you say about Drais and his 32 PP goals and 1/2 his points also being on the PP ...and he's only a +7 playing with McD
he should be +50 except he completely sucks defensively

 

[ACC1224]

Here is the thing I don’t get from the so called board, if they only care profit and image….does it matter to have AM, MM, Willie and others. Bc Leafs will sell out nomatter what, fans will buy jerseys for whoever is the best Leaf. If that’s their goals, they really don’t need to overpay for AM or whoever. Yet they keep willing to pay them despite their market value are lower.

People have been confusing incompetence with indifference for as long as this board has existed.
Of course they want to win, they just aren't very good at it.

 

[francis246]

We gotta trade Willy. The leafs screwed this bad. Just listening to the SDP most recent podcast and they try and go through every scenario. I don’t see how the Leafs make this work. Especially if Matthews won’t sign before Willy.

They should have traded Marner before July 1st.

 

[Gary Nylund]

We gotta trade Willy. The leafs screwed this bad. Just listening to the SDP most recent podcast and they try and go through every scenario. I don’t see how the Leafs make this work. Especially if Matthews won’t sign before Willy.

They should have traded Marner before July 1st.

Why would Matthews refuse to sign before Willy?

 

[Gabriel426]

We gotta trade Willy. The leafs screwed this bad. Just listening to the SDP most recent podcast and they try and go through every scenario. I don’t see how the Leafs make this work. Especially if Matthews won’t sign before Willy.

They should have traded Marner before July 1st.

Maybe trade both of them as they are asking for too much.
What’s the worst that can happen? Missing the playoffs?
Save all the cap space, develop second tier players and go hunting when #97 is available.

Why would Matthews refuse to sign before Willy?

It was implied or reported by someone in the medias that AM wants to sign after Willie in order to ask for more. Like if Willie is signs at 10mil, AM will ask for more and vice versa.

 

[francis246]

Why would Matthews refuse to sign before Willy?

Because Matthews wants to see Willy’s number for some reason. Everyone is reporting that the Matthews deal is unlikely to be done before Willy.

That’s what pisses me off about Auston and he always gets a pass from this fanbase. If Auston gave a real shit about being a leader and setting a tone. He’d sign and take a bit less so that Willy would buy in and take less. But he ain’t going to do that.

 

[myleafs]

They're not even worried about getting ripped off.

They're worried about not ripping the team off enough. It's concerning to see the franchise degraded like this. The players have been given all control.

At first I thought Matthews was waiting for Nylander to sign so he knew Nylander wasn't getting traded.

Then I realized how stupid that sounded. Even if they signed Nylander they can still trade him after Matthews signed. So it's clearly about maximizing their return.

Nylander clearly doesn't need the money.

Neither does Matthews for that matter. And yet that's what this is all about, the money. If these guys don't stop playing their game of one-upmanship with their bank accounts, the team should end it for them by trading Nylander.

Nylander might not believe it, but he CAN be replaced.

If the narrative regarding 34 is actually along the lines of you offerred me 13.7 for 5 yrs but if the cap goes up I wanna be making 14.7+ in 3 yrs sooo, Im just gonna wait til you give me more now, he is quickly losing me as someone who wants to root for him.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

The original quote wasn't "gut the franchise", it was this:

"Leafs will live on if they move Matthews, marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly, ..."

First of all, I took the quote to mean it's not the end of the world if they move one of those players, not necessarily all of them. As in Moving Marner isn't the end of the world, moving Nylander isn't the end of the world etc. Mind you Matthews, Marner and JT can't be moved now anyway unless they agree to be moved so it's kind of a moot point anyway.

Big picture though I think is that this core has achieved f*** all, there is zero reason to believe that the next few years will be any better (we've spent so many futures that it's not realistic to think we can add at the TDL again like we did last year) so let's face the facts, understand that we need to go in a different direction and not waste several more years overpaying this core and watching them fail.

Or to put it another way, not moving on from some (or even all) of these core pieces might be the stupid move because we're never winning anything with them anyway.

They don't need to spend like that at the TDL again because now there top 6 is an actual top 6, not a top 4.5

Now that Bertuzzi and Domi are here, Jarnkrok can start on the 3rd line where he belongs, Knies can start the 3rd line and get comfortable before being top 6.

There is admittedly a hole at 3C.

Adding McCabe last year makes the need to add a big piece to the defense significantly less.

This year they need a couple filler pieces

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Because Matthews wants to see Willy’s number for some reason. Everyone is reporting that the Matthews deal is unlikely to be done before Willy.

That’s what pisses me off about Auston and he always gets a pass from this fanbase. If Auston gave a real shit about being a leader and setting a tone. He’d sign and take a bit less so that Willy would buy in and take less. But he ain’t going to do that.

There's just zero leadership or initiative from any of them. Auston can't set the tone because he thinks he's worth a certain amount more than Nylander, so God forbid he signs first. Nylander thinks he got screwed on his deal compared to Auston and Mitch, so to hell with signing first again because he doesn't want to be that far behind them on their next deals.

So we've got a bunch of primadonnas who all have an inflated sense of worth who are terrified they'll get screwed compared to their teammates. This mindset is antithetical to a conducive winning environment. There's no "let's make this work" mindset, no will to sacrifice a million or two for the good of the team. It's all me me me me me.

 

[myleafs]

Just sign a reasonable contract already or gtho. Same goes for Matthews and eventually Marner.

Wish these guys showed as much grit and determination in the playoffs as they do negotiating contracts. They’d run through a brick wall for an extra 500k but not for ua Cup

This ...like how hard should this be? Waiting til the other signs?...what if the cap goes up?....jesus....taking something fair and being stinking rich at the same time shouldnt be so difficult. Lets go mfkrs or otherwise like you said....GTFO

 

[IPS]

There's just zero leadership or initiative from any of them. Auston can't set the tone because he thinks he's worth a certain amount more than Nylander, so God forbid he signs first. Nylander thinks he got screwed on his deal compared to Auston and Mitch, so to hell with signing first again because he doesn't want to be that far behind them on their next deals.

So we've got a bunch of primadonnas who all have an inflated sense of worth who are terrified they'll get screwed compared to their teammates. This mindset is antithetical to a conducive winning environment. There's no "let's make this work" mindset, no will to sacrifice a million or two for the good of the team. It's all me me me me me.

f***ing pathetic is what it is.

Do you think Makar is whining that Mackinnon is making however much more than him? Doubt it. That team is all on the same page about winning and nothing else.

 

[Confucius]

Because Matthews wants to see Willy’s number for some reason. Everyone is reporting that the Matthews deal is unlikely to be done before Willy.

That’s what pisses me off about Auston and he always gets a pass from this fanbase. If Auston gave a real shit about being a leader and setting a tone. He’d sign and take a bit less so that Willy would buy in and take less. But he ain’t going to do that.

Lol and William has stated he will only sign a discount if Mathews does, which obviously means Mathews has to sign 1st. How else would William know if Mathews took a discount?

I’m backing William in this one.

 

[IPS]

Does winning and leaving a good legacy behind mean nothing to these kids?

It clearly means something to a lot of other players around the league, yet here it seems like that's irrelevant the only thing that matters is getting the biggest piece of the money pie possible.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

f***ing pathetic is what it is.

Do you think Makar is whining that Mackinnon is making however much more than him? Doubt it. That team is all on the same page about winning and nothing else.

You think Point cared to haggle that he was worth a certain amount more than Stamkos? Or argued that Kucherov signed his contract 3 years prior and that times had changed so he was actually worth $10 million and not the same $9.5 million that Kucherov was making?

This also ignores that most of these upper-echelon players making similar money to our core have performed far better and have achieved better results in the playoffs. MacKinnon has a Cup and has a 1.29 point per game average in the playoffs. McDavid has a 1.53 point per game average in the playoffs. Matthews comes in at 0.88 points per game in the post-season. But for whatever reason we're supposed to accept that he's going to make more than these guys despite coming up far less clutch and being nowhere near as dominant in the playoffs as those two. We should thank Auston for the privilege of signing him to a $13+ million contract that will be 3-5 years in length because he'd rather maximize his career earnings instead of just signing here for 8 years like every other franchise player in this league.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

They cycle up and down like most teams do. Look at the lottery winning Hawks.

Yeah I understand the cycle of life when it comes to NHL teams. Watching Toronto bottom out was not at all enjoyable.

I think that Nylander should be moved. If they can't use him in a trade to round out the roster, then he can be used for assets (prospects and picks). I don't want to see TOR use him as an Own-Rental, and I don't want to extend him.