Norris or Pinto

[BUCKLE UP]

Who's the more important player to the future of this team?

Last year I would have argued Pinto, but this season we're getting glimpses of pre-injury Norris.

Click to read more...

 

[Tuna99]

Norris doesn’t get many Assists, his career high is 20A and this season he has 6A in 20GP. Also been a negative player his entire career going back to the USHL.

Pinto I’d like to see with better wingers. He hasn’t been impact, invisible most games.

I voted Norris just because he’s been better this season and way more impact but also he’s had better wingers

 

[bicboi64]

Pinto is more important because he might have a better contract than Norris and provide similar production. I was going to say Pinto because of better health but the last few weeks have me doubting that

 

[PlayOn]

Norris has shown more offensive upside throughout his career and he’s a 200 ft player too so it’s hard to vote against him at this point.

It can obviously change. Last year Pinto would have annihilated him in this poll. I think ultimately the answer is both of them if they both play to their potential.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Close.

 

[Big Muddy]

A question I’ve pondered is the whole injury risk scenario which is often discussed when Norris’s future is the subject.

If Norris finishes the year having played 82-games (or close to 82 games) and scores 60 points, do people start to worry a lot less about re-injury? Or is this a permanent fear?

Have other players who have had these surgeries (from the same surgeon to make things even more interesting) re-injure themselves within a few years and those player's careers are washed out? That seems to be the sentiment for many people.

 

[NinjaSens]

Voted Pinto due to handedness and contract. With Stutzle being a lefty, it is important to have a right handed centre.

 

[bicboi64]

A question I’ve pondered is the whole injury risk scenario which is often discussed when Norris’s future is the subject.

If Norris finishes the year having played 82-games (or close to 82 games) and scores 60 points, do people start to worry a lot less about re-injury? Or is this a permanent fear?

This is completely irrational on my part, but it feels permanent for me because of how many injuries we've been hit with this year. If he made less money, the fear would be mitigated

 

[Xspyrit]

I would vote BOTH if there was the option

We need BOTH as our Top-9 has severe holes. Perron is supposed to be a good stop gap but now it's not even sure he will be. Amadio was brought to be a Top-9 option too but frankly, I don't want him in my Top-9. Cousins and Gregor are obviously not Top-9 forwards at this point too. Gaudette... it depends, definitely has goal scoring ability.

Tkachuk - Stutzle - Batherson
?????? - Norris - Giroux
Greig - Pinto - ??????

We can't afford to trade any forward if we're not getting back as many or more Top-9 forwards.

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

People are hardcore overthinking this. One guy here is on pace for a 30 goal season while being a solid two-way centerman, and is a staple on the 1st PP, and the other has 3 points in 20 games and is a -7 on the year. It's a very clear choice that Josh Norris is far more important to this team than Shane Pinto.

 

[Big Muddy]

This is completely irrational on my part, but it feels permanent for me because of how many injuries we've been hit with this year. If he made less money, the fear would be mitigated

I think you are saying it's a permanent fear because I see the idea of injuries this year as tangental or not really related to the subject. That’s OK btw. I was asking the question. I don’t know if that idea is totally solid because I’m not a surgeon and I don’t have any info on the subject.

Are you saying that if the Senators retain, that’s another angle and would help the Senators get a better return? Because what I typically see is comments saying we’ll get nothing (or next to nothing in return).

 

[Micklebot]

People are hardcore overthinking this. One guy here is on pace for a 30 goal season while being a solid two-way centerman, and is a staple on the 1st PP, and the other has 3 points in 20 games and is a -7 on the year. It's a very clear choice that Josh Norris is far more important to this team than Shane Pinto.

Pinto's regression this year has been pretty wild, the question would be far more interesting if he was closer to living up to expectations

 

[PlayOn]

People are hardcore overthinking this. One guy here is on pace for a 30 goal season while being a solid two-way centerman, and is a staple on the 1st PP, and the other has 3 points in 20 games and is a -7 on the year. It's a very clear choice that Josh Norris is far more important to this team than Shane Pinto.

If this poll came out in February, someone would’ve said:

People are hardcore overthinking this. One guy here has reinjured his shoulder for the third time, might never play again, was centering the third line at times, and was taken off PP1 while the other guy is centering the first line while being PPG. It’s a very clear choice that Shane Pinto is far more important to this team than Josh Norris.

Don’t quote my dates or statistics bc it’s really offhand, but you get the point. Things are fluid and players step up and struggle at different times. I voted Norris but they’ve both had ups and downs.

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

If this poll came out in February, someone would’ve said:

People are hardcore overthinking this. One guy here has reinjured his shoulder for the third time, might never play again, was centering the third line at times, and was taken off PP1 while the other guy is centering the first line while being PPG. It’s a very clear choice that Shane Pinto is far more important to this team than Josh Norris.

Don’t quote my dates or statistics bc it’s really offhand, but you get the point. Things are fluid and players step up and struggle at different times. I voted Norris but they’ve both had ups and downs.

Sure, if the question was asked during the one 3 month stretch of hockey where there were serious concerns about Norris's long term health in hockey, then yeah Pinto might've won this poll.

Outside of that stretch, Norris has been more important historically and currently. This is not a serious question.

 

[bicboi64]

I think you are saying it's a permanent fear because I see the idea of injuries this year as tangental or not really related to the subject. That’s OK btw. I was asking the question. I don’t know if that idea is totally solid because I’m not a surgeon and I don’t have any info on the subject.

Are you saying that if the Senators retain, that’s another angle and would help the Senators get a better return? Because what I typically see is comments saying we’ll get nothing (or next to nothing in return).

If we retain, I think loads of teams could afford to take a risk on Norris, but don't think that whatever we get in return would be too useful.

A healthy Norris is super valuable to the team, but I think if the opportunity presents itself to move his whole cap hit and get some other pieces (quality healthy RD) or the right combo of young players/picks than I'm fine with moving him.

Would be a much more interesting convo if Pinto didn't have a next-level regression. I fully expect Pinto to be back to his usual self and continue his development next season in a contract year lol

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Considering how he's looked so far this year, it's pretty hard to argue Norris isn't far more valuable atm. Wtf happened to Pinto?

 

[PlayOn]

Sure, if the question was asked during the one 3 month stretch of hockey where there were serious concerns about Norris's long term health in hockey, then yeah Pinto might've won this poll.

Outside of that stretch, Norris has been more important historically and currently. This is not a serious question.

The question has basically been asked since these two were both in the league. I don’t think there’s a debate around who has been more valuable to this point, but the question of who has more upside isn’t really all that new. I don’t think a bad 12 game stretch by Pinto is going to kill the debate.

 

[Beech]

Neither.

one is overpaid, teh other is underperforming

Both are injury prone.

What appeared to be our 2/3 Centremen for the next 10 years, as recently as 3 years ago, is fizzling.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

If both are 100% healthy and playing their game, it's Norris by a mile.

But....we're still not 100% confident on that shoulder yet.

 

[Big Muddy]

If we retain, I think loads of teams could afford to take a risk on Norris, but don't think that whatever we get in return would be too useful.

A healthy Norris is super valuable to the team, but I think if the opportunity presents itself to move his whole cap hit and get some other pieces (quality healthy RD) or the right combo of young players/picks than I'm fine with moving him.

Would be a much more interesting convo if Pinto didn't have a next-level regression. I fully expect Pinto to be back to his usual self and continue his development next season in a contract year lol

Re: your 2nd paragraph

If people think the risk of re-injury is omnipresent, and other GMs think the same way, then how are we going to get the right combo of young players & picks?

I agree that it would be nice if we did that kind of return, but you said in your 1st paragraph that the return wouldn’t be too useful.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Green has clearly chosen Norris, and admittedly Norris has played better than Pinto.

Pinto has a more valuable toolset if he can put it all together.

Strategically, it might make more sense to trade Pinto right now because he could probably return another good young player in a different position of need. I don't think there would be a market with Norris based on his contract and injury issues.

I could justify trading Norris if they knew that his shoulder still could be an issue, but outside of that I don't think they should trade either center. I don't think they can trade Pinto because if Norris gets hurt again, Greig or a random winger because our 2C. Greig is not ready for that.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Pinto's regression this year has been pretty wild, the question would be far more interesting if he was closer to living up to expectations

Pinto was doing fine while having very strong metrics prior to injury. He hasn't been the same since, maybe he was rushed? Mental concerns? I think he'll figure it out, he's too talented and intelligent to not.

 

[Micklebot]

Pinto was doing fine while having very strong metrics prior to injury. He hasn't been the same since, maybe he was rushed? Mental concerns? I think he'll figure it out, he's too talented and intelligent to not.

Ya, he may have come back at less than 100%, usually health is the most likely explanation for a drastic fall off.

I think Pinto will rebound, but until then, it's hard to argue Norris hasn't been more important to the team. I suppose you could frame the question as what''s more important, Pinto playing to his abilities, or Norris playing to his,

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Ya, he may have come back at less than 100%, usually health is the most likely explanation for a drastic fall off.

I think Pinto will rebound, but until then, it's hard to argue Norris hasn't been more important to the team. I suppose you could frame the question as what''s more important, Pinto playing to his abilities, or Norris playing to his,

Plus Pinto is also snakebitten af, even before his injury. He's generating a lot of quality chances, it'll come. But Norris is definitely the better goalscorer.

 

[DrEasy]

Ya, he may have come back at less than 100%, usually health is the most likely explanation for a drastic fall off.

I think Pinto will rebound, but until then, it's hard to argue Norris hasn't been more important to the team. I suppose you could frame the question as what''s more important, Pinto playing to his abilities, or Norris playing to his,

So Pinto, Zub, Sanderson, Perron, and possibly Brady (took a maintenance day early in the season) and Norris (no sign of the one-timer, except for one instance) are all at less than 100%. Hard to play competitive hockey or to assess your team where your key players are all limping.