Nathan MacKinnon, on par with the best in business?

[Coffey]

Gretzky - 4
Mario - 2
The Dawg - 1
McWeiner -0

Guess what that number is. Hmmmm

You can always tell what kind of person you're talking to when they denigrate McDavid with some shitty toddler-like nickname.

Gretzky - 4
Mario - 2
The Dawg - 1
McWeiner -0

Guess what that number is. Hmmmm


Hart/Lindsay > losing a Cup

Playoff award > Regular season award

Or does that change with narrative.

 

[benfranklin]

You can always tell what kind of person you're talking to when they denigrate McDavid with some shitty toddler-like nickname.


Playoff award > Regular season award

Or does that change with narrative.

Only when you win. A loser Conn Smythe is a glorified paper weight. McJesus would agree with that one.

 

[hangman005]

You can always tell what kind of person you're talking to when they denigrate McDavid with some shitty toddler-like nickname.


Playoff award > Regular season award

Or does that change with narrative.

Look I think your giving toddlers a little too much credit, I think they would have peaked at McPoopyhead

 

[soothsayer]

Not since 2023...which the whole premise of this thread.

Who would you rather have?

1.68 ppg taking 25 games to lose the Cup
Who the f cares ppg taking 20 games to win the Cup

Every fan and their mother takes the Cup every time.

O I missed the part we were looking at career stats and not the premise of the thread, current best player in the world.

Wait, haven't you been referencing MacKinnon's 2022 cup win when talking about their comparison from 2023 and on?

 

[Coffey]

Only when you win. A loser Conn Smythe is a glorified paper weight. McJesus would agree with that one.

He would.
But still doesn't change the fact that McD carried his non-Makar team to game 7 in the finals, while Mackinnon fizzled out against the Stars.

A better player would have beat the Stars, just like McDavid did.

 

[Regal]

Wait, haven't you been referencing MacKinnon's 2022 cup win when talking about their comparison from 2023 and on?

The comparison clearly starts at the 2022 playoffs but obviously that made McDavid pissy from the playoffs loss so he started strong in 2022-23 while MacKinnon was riding high without a care, so we need to ignore that section of time in the comparison. I mean, it’s obvious.

 

[Coffey]

The comparison clearly starts at the 2022 playoffs

Nope, it's been clear many times over, that the comparison starts on Jan 1, 2023.

 

[Regal]

Nope, it's been clear many times over, that the comparison starts on Jan 1, 2023.

Shhh

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

You can always tell what kind of person you're talking to when they denigrate McDavid with some shitty toddler-like nickname.

and he called Mackinnon "The Dawg" spelt "D-A-W-G" for extra bad-assery
like he's his bro some something

 

[benfranklin]

He would.
But still doesn't change the fact that McD carried his non-Makar team to game 7 in the finals, while Mackinnon fizzled out against the Stars.

A better player would have beat the Stars, just like McDavid did.

Keep reaching. I was told many times Bouchard had the best playoffs in the history of the universe. That is better than Makar right? Or do points not matter now to fit whatever narrative you're creating lately?

.

 

[Artemi Panarin]

He would.
But still doesn't change the fact that McD carried his non-Makar team to game 7 in the finals, while Mackinnon fizzled out against the Stars.

A better player would have beat the Stars, just like McDavid did.

Or won a cup, like Mackinnon did.

 

[PuckG]

Only when you win. A loser Conn Smythe is a glorified paper weight. McJesus would agree with that one.

For someone who earlier in the thread self-proclaimed themselves as unbiased and objective, you’re still in here shifting goalposts and parroting a team award in a thread comparing individual talent.

All of your arguments have been poor at best. Especially the “Neither player has done anything in a game 7 so technically they’re equal” one.

 

[Dr Pepper]

I nor the OP brought up Cups. It was everyone else trying to extend the goalposts with everything McDavid has done outside of 2023 to present day. Specifically in a response to someone saying MacKinnon has no accomplishments and I pointed out the most important one.

6 teams and what 120-150 total players. Odds of winning anything (Cups, scoring titles, trophies, etc) goes up significantly compared to today. It was a different era and that is ok, but Leafs havent won shit while the league has been competitive.

You're right, they haven't, but that doesn't mean the Cups they DID win or any team won in the pre-expansion era, is worthy of an asterisk lol.

They still won 'em.

Didn't the Rangers go about 50 years without a Cup, from the early 40s straight through to the 90s? The way you talk about it, a six team league should mean EVERYONE got one, right? Wasn't quite that easy even back in those days. They were earned then, just as they are now.

 

[Coffey]

Keep reaching. I was told many times Bouchard had the best playoffs in the history of the universe. That is better than Makar right? Or do points not matter now to fit whatever narrative you're creating lately?

I'm not reaching buddy. You just have terrible reading comprehension.

You keep posting stats and pictures from pre-Jan 1 2023. Did you not read the first post in the thread?
You are posting Makar, who was superior to Mackinnon in 2022 and won the Conn Smythe, not Mackinnon.

I'm giving you situations that happened post-Jan 1 2023 and you keep ignoring them because you're unable to deal with cognitive dissonance.

Like talking to a f***ing brick wall.

 

[benfranklin]

For someone who earlier in the thread self-proclaimed themselves as unbiased and objective, you’re still in here parroting a team award in a thread comparing individual talent.

All of your arguments have been poor at best. Especially the “Neither player has done anything in a game 7 so technically they’re equal.”

Every award is a team award. Until a player scores all of his goals unassisted, he had help somewhere. The Cup is the biggest bestest most awesome award you can get in our sport. The reigning Hart and Lindsay award winner has a Cup, plain and simple. He won his Cup and started trying for the individual trophies now.

If yo tilt your head at the right angle, you can see Nate's big balls bulging

out of his shorts.

I'm not reaching buddy. You just have terrible reading comprehension.

You keep posting stats and pictures from pre-Jan 1 2023. Did you not read the first post in the thread?
You are posting Makar, who was superior to Mackinnon in 2022 and won the Conn Smythe, not Mackinnon.

I'm giving you situations that happened post-Jan 1 2023 and you keep ignoring them because you're unable to deal with cognitive dissonance.

Like talking to a f***ing brick wall.

The argument was dead in post 1. Nate has better stats since 1.1.23. Done. Over. All Oilers fans have is a losing effort in the playoffs with a trophy CM is pissed about. Every post in this thread will have a big smile from the dawg hoisting his trophies now.

 

[PuckG]

Every award is a team award. Until a player scores all of his goals unassisted, he had help somewhere. The Cup is the biggest bestest most awesome award you can get in our sport. The reigning Hart and Lindsay award winner has a Cup, plain and simple. He won his Cup and started trying for the individual trophies now.

If yo tilt your head at the right angle, you can see Nate's big balls bulgingView attachment 937354 out of his shorts.

Another poor argument. Once again, if you put McDavid on the Avs, then it’s likely he has a Stanley Cup and MacKinnon doesn’t. You shifting goalposts repeatedly changes nothing.

If every award is a team award, why doesn’t MacKinnon have more awards than McDavid while playing on a superior team?

Objective and unbiased, my ass.

 

[Coffey]

The argument was dead in post 1. Nate has better stats since 1.1.23. Done. Over. All Oilers fans have is a losing effort in the playoffs with a trophy CM is pissed about. Every post in this thread will have a big smile from the dawg hoisting his trophies now.View attachment 937357

So he won a cup and just cares about regular season trophies now? Cool cool.
Quit playing in April. Cool cool.

 

[CN8]

I get using the cup as a trump card but if so doing shouldn’t we go with the best player on that cup team?

 

[Coffey]

I get using the cup as a trump card but if so doing shouldn’t we go with the best player on that cup team?

Yea exactly, which was Makar.

 

[PuckG]

I get using the cup as a trump card but if so doing shouldn’t we go with the best player on that cup team?

It’s not a trump card at all when using it in a comparison of individual talent. It’s just a poor argument to begin with.

Some posters would sooner say Corey Perry is better than McDavid because CUpS, but they’re usually deluded to begin with.

 

[benfranklin]

I get using the cup as a trump card but if so doing shouldn’t we go with the best player on that cup team?

Makar is the best player in the world so no argument here.

Makar
McDavid-Mackinnon
Intentional separation
Kucherov
Kaprisov-Eichel-Drasaitl-Panarin-Matthews-Pastrnak-Rantanen-Reinhart-Marner

 

[benfranklin]

Another poor argument. Once again, if you put McDavid on the Avs, then it’s likely he has a Stanley Cup and MacKinnon doesn’t. You shifting goalposts repeatedly changes nothing.

If every award is a team award, why doesn’t MacKinnon have more awards than McDavid while playing on a superior team?

Objective and unbiased, my ass.

Cap is a thing. I already posted about the $6.3 dawg cap hit in 2022 and $12.5 McDavid. Swicth teams and then pick your poison of $6M that the Avs wouldnt have been able to utilize in their 21-22 deadlines/UFA's.

Thats is whatever combination of

Kadri - $4.5
Lehkonen - $1.1
Nchushkin - $2.5
Helm - $1
Sturm - $725k

All but Sturm were massively important in their run.

 

[PuckG]

Cap is a thing. I already posted about the $6.3 dawg cap hit in 2022 and $12.5 McDavid. Swicth teams and then pick your poison of $6M that the Avs wouldnt have been able to utilize in their 21-22 deadlines/UFA's.

Thats is whatever combination of

Kadri - $4.5
Lehkonen - $1.1
Nchushkin - $2.5
Helm - $1
Sturm - $725k

All but Sturm were massively important in their run.

Changing goalposts again. In a comparison of direct talent and who is the better player, why are you considering the cap?

In that case, you’d get more value out of a number of rookies than you would a number of top 20 players.

The fact is, from a talent standpoint, if you remove MacKinnon from the Avs and put McDavid in his place, McDavid has a cup and MacKinnon doesn’t.

Weak argument - again.

Stats have been posted on previous pages showing just how off you are as well and both players impacts on their respective teams. Let me know if I should requote them.

I’ll ask the same question again: If every award is a team award like you said, why doesn’t MacKinnon have more awards than McDavid while playing on a superior team?

 

[benfranklin]

Changing goalposts again. In a comparison of direct talent and who is the better player, why are you considering the cap?

In that case, you’d get more value out of a number of rookies than you would a number of top 20 players.

The fact is, from a talent standpoint, if you remove MacKinnon from the Avs and put McDavid in his place, McDavid has a cup and MacKinnon doesn’t.

Weak argument - again.

Stats have been posted on previous pages showing just how off you are as well. Let me know if I should requote them.

Its ridiculous not to. The team around him wouldnt be there because of the cap, let alone changing history with draft picks.

But ill play your game. Put MacKinnon on the Oilers for all those seasons and

1. Avalanche draft McDavid in 2015 and not Rantanen.
2. McDavid, assuming the same points in 2016 would have got the Avs to the playoffs and likely lost early. In turn they would not have traded Duchene, extended him, and not finished in the running for the lottery pick and thus not drafted Makar.
3. So this would be McDavid, Duchene, and Landeskog likely losing playoff series similar to what Edmonton has done.
4. MacKinnon did not do enough early in his career to change the trajectory of Oilers getting high picks so we can assume they still would have Draisaitl and RNH.
5. Oilers would finally be good enough to make consecutive playoff runs, but the defense and goaltending is still crap so even MacKinnon going off would not win them a Cup.

So in a insane turn of events, nothing has changed, except both are losers in Edmonton.

 

[soothsayer]

Every award is a team award. Until a player scores all of his goals unassisted, he had help somewhere. The Cup is the biggest bestest most awesome award you can get in our sport. The reigning Hart and Lindsay award winner has a Cup, plain and simple. He won his Cup and started trying for the individual trophies now.

If yo tilt your head at the right angle, you can see Nate's big balls bulgingView attachment 937354 out of his shorts.


The argument was dead in post 1. Nate has better stats since 1.1.23. Done. Over. All Oilers fans have is a losing effort in the playoffs with a trophy CM is pissed about. Every post in this thread will have a big smile from the dawg hoisting his trophies now.View attachment 937357

From 2023 to now, the difference is a Rocket, an Art Ross, and a Conn Smyth all in McDavid's favour.