Nathan MacKinnon, on par with the best in business?

[benfranklin]

Uh-huh.

When was that picture of MacKinnon raising the Stanley Cup you keep posting taken?

I nor the OP brought up Cups. It was everyone else trying to extend the goalposts with everything McDavid has done outside of 2023 to present day. Specifically in a response to someone saying MacKinnon has no accomplishments and I pointed out the most important one.

Not really, that's just the way the league was.

If Ottawa or Vancouver want to count their Cup wins from the early 1900s, then sure, asterisk it up. But they don't, for obvious reasons.

Toronto's won 13 Cups. They're all valid, they all count - and they all predate the expansion era. Asterisk not required.

Also, "glorified rec league"? What are you even on about?

6 teams and what 120-150 total players. Odds of winning anything (Cups, scoring titles, trophies, etc) goes up significantly compared to today. It was a different era and that is ok, but Leafs havent won shit while the league has been competitive.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

No but its a point of comparison if player stats are close, which they arent in MacKinnon vs Williams. Pat Maroon has more Cups and hes still a plug.

The entire point of this thread is since 2023, MacKinnon has been the better player. Make your own thread about their entire careers so far and remove the playoffs from being a point of discussion if you want and McDavid will take it in a landslide. Since 2023 MacKinnon has 1 Cup udner his belt and McDavid lost one. Its math at this point. If he won last season, this would all be a compeltely different discussion.

This thread specifically is about 1.1.23 to today and statistically MacKinnon has been better.

Mackinnon won the Cup in 2022, perhaps get your facts straight

 

[benfranklin]

Not even better than Lundell.

View attachment 937302

Its still so cringe to celebrate Cup losses.

 

[Coffey]

Its still so cringe to celebrate Cup losses.

It's still cringe to move the goalposts, Ben.

 

[Romang67]

I nor the OP brought up Cups. It was everyone else trying to extend the goalposts with everything McDavid has done outside of 2023 to present day. Specifically in a response to someone saying MacKinnon has no accomplishments and I pointed out the most important one.

6 teams and what 120-150 total players. Odds of winning anything (Cups, scoring titles, trophies, etc) goes up significantly compared to today. It was a different era and that is ok, but Leafs havent won shit while the league has been competitive.

You claimed that MacKinnon has won a cup in the last 2 years. It's right there in your post. You're using it as a plus for MacKinnon in the time interval laid out in the OP.

 

[benfranklin]

It's still cringe to move the goalposts, Ben.

Talk to your fanbase. Pure stats here. Should have been over and done in one post. When Oilers fans came in bragging about the zillion points he put up losing the Cup, its too easy to laugh at them with MacKinnon's ring.

I believe McDavid will get one, in a Rangers uniform.

 

[Romang67]

Talk to your fanbase. Pure stats here. Should have been over and done in one post. When Oilers fans came in bragging about the zillion points he put up losing the Cup, its too easy to laugh at them with MacKinnon's ring.

I believe McDavid will get one, in a Rangers uniform.

View attachment 937305

Getting awfully close to blatant trolling here. I'd recommend you to don't do that if you want to remain part of the conversation.

 

[benfranklin]

You claimed that MacKinnon has won a cup in the last 2 years. It's right there in your post. You're using it as a plus for MacKinnon in the time interval laid out in the OP.

Here is what it was a response to. That is referencing outside of 2023 correct?

Getting awfully close to blatant trolling here. I'd recommend you to don't do that if you want to remain part of the conversation.

Because I dont think he wll re-sign in Edm? That is simply an opinion. And not many teams can afford him where he will actually consider signing. NYR is one of them.

 

[T REX]

huge Kuch fan here...

it's McDavid by himself then

Kuch, Mack, Drai and maybe matthews

hard to argue otherwise

 

[benfranklin]

huge Kuch fan here...

it's McDavid by himself then

Kuch, Mack, Drai and maybe matthews

hard to argue otherwise

Outside of stats, but ok, sure "hard to argue".

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Because I dont think he wll re-sign in Edm? That is simply an opinion. And not many teams can afford him where he will actually consider signing. NYR is one of them.

I wanna be here next summer when he re-signs just to see your outrage

you don't know Connor well if you think he will bail on the Oilers

 

[Romang67]

Here is what it was a response to. That is referencing outside of 2023 correct?View attachment 937307


Because I dont think he wll re-sign in Edm? That is simply an opinion. And not many teams can afford him where he will actually consider signing. NYR is one of them.

Regardless of what it was in response to, this:

Since 2023 MacKinnon has 1 Cup udner his belt and McDavid lost one. Its math at this point. If he won last season, this would all be a compeltely different discussion.

This thread specifically is about 1.1.23 to today and statistically MacKinnon has been better.

Is not correct. This is not that complicated. You said that MacKinnon has a cup since January 1st 2023, presumably to make his playoff success in the time interval seem better. He does not.

And yes, your unprompted telling Oilers fans that McDavid will go win a Stanley Cup with a different team in a discussion about who has been better is bordering on blatant trolling. Don't do that.

 

[benfranklin]

I wanna be here next summer when he re-signs just to see your outrage

you don't know Connor well if you think he will bail on the Oilers

I dont know Connor at all lol. He could easily re-sign in Edmonton and never win a Cup. Or he leaves to goes to a team managed well.

 

[benfranklin]

Regardless of what it was in response to, this:

Is not correct. This is not that complicated. You said that MacKinnon has a cup since January 1st 2023, presumably to make his playoff success in the time interval seem better. He does not.

And yes, your unprompted telling Oilers fans that McDavid will go win a Stanley Cup with a different team in a discussion about who has been better is bordering on blatant trolling. Don't do that.

"Under his belt" aka already won aka part of his legacy aka Cup champion. No where did I say he or the Avs won a Cup in 2023. It was in reference to their career accomplishments thus far.

Ironically it is actually trolling itself here to say someone is trolling. Makes no sense to me either, but technically it is an HF rule.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

I dont know Connor at all lol. He could easily re-sign in Edmonton and never win a Cup. Or he leaves to goes to a team managed well.

he was 1 period away from winning it all, but he's gonna go somewhere else who's team is further away?

make that make sense

 

[T REX]

Outside of stats, but ok, sure "hard to argue".

You can manipulate the stats all you want.

McDavid is...ALONE at the top of the league. Then there is a tier 2 of superstars.

I'm no McDavid apologist either from my posting history.

 

[Romang67]

"Under his belt" aka already won aka part of his legacy aka Cup champion. No where did I say he or the Avs won a Cup in 2023. It was in reference to their career accomplishments thus far.

Ironically it is actually trolling itself here to say someone is trolling. Makes no sense to me either, but technically it is an HF rule.

So what you're saying is that MacKinnon had won a Stanley Cup in the past, and that's a positive for him since 2023?

No, that would be flaming if someone was doing it without being a moderator. I'm telling you as a moderator to knock that shit off.

 

[Coffey]

Outside of stats, but ok, sure "hard to argue".

Here are the stats.
Top of the league, McDavid 42 playoff points.
Mackinnon... Who the f*** knows, somewhere in the sub-20s.

 

[soothsayer]

Outside of stats, but ok, sure "hard to argue".

Looking at their career stats, are they really "close"? I can't imagine many people in the future will look at their career stats and think the two players were really close.

 

[T REX]

There aren't enough chickpeas in the world...

 

[benfranklin]

he was 1 period away from winning it all, but he's gonna go somewhere else who's team is further away?

make that make sense

But didnt. And yes, that Oilers playoff run had all the right things go their way and they still failed.

A legendary PK and Stuart Skinner looking like an NHL starter. Guess which of those they sustained? Neither. Id easily argue over half of the league is closer to a Cup than Edmonton right now and going to only get worse with Drais's cap hit and if McDavid signs for the inevitable $15M+.

 

[Coffey]

Stuart Skinner looking like an NHL starter.

You should rewatch the Reinhart goal in g7.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Call me when Nate does things only Wayne and Mario have done lol , what are we even talking about here boys.

 

[benfranklin]

You can manipulate the stats all you want.

McDavid is...ALONE at the top of the league. Then there is a tier 2 of superstars.

I'm no McDavid apologist either from my posting history.

Not since 2023...which the whole premise of this thread.

Here are the stats.
Top of the league, McDavid 42 playoff points.
Mackinnon... Who the f*** knows, somewhere in the sub-20s.

Who would you rather have?

1.68 ppg taking 25 games to lose the Cup
Who the f cares ppg taking 20 games to win the Cup

Every fan and their mother takes the Cup every time.

Looking at their career stats, are they really "close"? I can't imagine many people in the future will look at their career stats and think the two players were really close.

O I missed the part we were looking at career stats and not the premise of the thread, current best player in the world.

 

[Coffey]

Every fan and their mother takes the Cup every time.

Mackinnon never won a cup in 2023 to present.