Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Continued

[Gabriel426]

Except I think Rantanen is headed to UFA. Contract negotiations have been pretty ugly. He’s got his cup, he wants to be paid and viewed at as being on the same level as Nate MacKinnon and I don’t think Colorado is gonna budge.

He is gone unless Avs win the Cup.

I just don’t see why Avs won’t use his cap hit and invest in a goalie and a mid 6 forward. As long as Mack and Makar are healthy, they don’t need another game breaker or marquee player to help them win.

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

He is gone unless Avs win the Cup.

I just don’t see why Avs won’t use his cap hit and invest in a goalie and a mid 6 forward. As long as Mack and Makar are healthy, they don’t need another game breaker or marquee player to help them win.

Why are they trying to improve their team? They must not know what they're doing.

Only T.O. can offer him 8 years, keep that in mind

He should sign a 3 year deal to maximize his earnings like Austonflation.

 

[arso40]

He is gone unless Avs win the Cup.

I just don’t see why Avs won’t use his cap hit and invest in a goalie and a mid 6 forward. As long as Mack and Makar are healthy, they don’t need another game breaker or marquee player to help them win.

They definitely need rantanen theyre thin up front without him

 

[capfit9]

Why are they trying to improve their team? They must not know what they're doing.



He should sign a 3 year deal to maximize his earnings like Austonflation.

If his playoffs are underwhelming not sure he’d want a short term deal

 

[leafs in five]

You know any elite prospects looking to be drafted in 4yrs? After we pay Marner his 14million a year and the D core are limping about, we will be in tank mode. Need to start panning the rebuild now. Knies is going to want 9millions

maybe take a break and check back in in 3-4 years time?

 

[leafs in five]

"greedy demon" is a new one

 

[ToneDog]

Mirtle and Bunkis discussed on Bunkis thursday podcast. Both agree they should wait. Mirtle thinks leafs are fine making him one of the top paid players, Marner wants more than 34 and it will go into June.

So the 13.8m Kyper floated out there is probably the number. I'd tell them to GTFO but it is the Leafs.

 

[Divine]

I was actually at a meeting with Reinhart's sister in law today. She told me he knew he was leaving money on the table when he signed but didn't consider other teams for a second. Said he's too happy there to move.

Toronto pretends they're a premium market in the NHL and then acts like they're the Winnipeg Jets.

Tampa/Florida/New York have no problem walking away from players. Tampa just walked away from their captain who was begging them to stay. Florida traded away Huberdeau after 115 points - second in the league that season. New York is already willing to trade their captain and never has any problem going to FA with money.

The Leafs however are terrified of gaining cap space for some reason. If you believe you're a premium market, you shouldn't be scared of players walking because you can't replace them. If you keep overpaying players to stay, then you're not a premium market. Heck, Winnipeg gets better contracts than us.

There's absolutely zero reason to overpay Marner & Tavares and expect different results. What's the big fear with breaking up the core that won one round anyway? Are we scared we'll never reach the heights this core took us too? Let Marner walk if he wants to be greedy. I doubt any other team is willing to pay him 14M+ either... but if they are, the best of luck to them. We can pick up 3 solid depth players to replace him with that cap space... and maybe actually get a third line centre. The only playoff series we won was when we had RoR playing 3rd line centre.

 

[leafs in five]

Why are they trying to improve their team? They must not know what they're doing.

if the idle speculation on HFLeafboards about what the Avs will do with the money they refuse to pay Rantanen proves anything, it's that the Avs front office actually cares about improving their team.

 

[leafs in five]

The Leafs however are terrified of gaining cap space for some reason.

12.5m+ in cap space got the Bruins Elias Lindholm and Zadorov for the next 4 years (6 for Lindholm). you can make your case that a pretty decent 2C and 4-5 dman are worth that over a PPG first line winger without saying things like this

 

[Divine]

12.5m+ in cap space got the Bruins Elias Lindholm and Zadorov for the next 4 years (6 for Lindholm). you can make your case that a pretty decent 2C and 4-5 dman are worth that over a PPG first line winger without saying things like this

And 11.6M in cap space got the Rangers Panarin who is better than Marner.

Not trusting your management to make signings is a different discussion. But like I said earlier, we don't need Marner to lose in the first round. We can do it without him. We're a playoff team without Marner.

At least without him we have the possibility of being better than a 1st round exit team every year.

 

[leafs in five]

And 11.6M in cap space got the Rangers Panarin who is better than Marner.

Not trusting your management to make signings is a different discussion. But like I said earlier, we don't need Marner to lose in the first round. We can do it without him. We're a playoff team without Marner.

At least without him we have the possibility of being better than a 1st round exit team every year.

yeah that is definitely how possibilities work

 

[Divine]

yeah that is definitely how possibilities work

Unreal the love fest with Marner here.

Boston didn't have Marner and they had no problem beating us 3 times with Marner. We can argue we're better on paper every year and how all of our players deserve to get paid more than all of theirs. Again, we'll have 3 players making more than their top player just signed as a UFA.... but that's okay we're the better team that keeps losing to them.

At some point you have to look at the results.

Marner + Nylander + Matthews have not worked. Two of them are signed for multiple years after this one. If you're going to try something different, which you should, now is the chance.

 

[leafs in five]

Unreal the love fest with Marner here.

Boston didn't have Marner and they had no problem beating us 3 times with Marner. We can argue we're better on paper every year and how all of our players deserve to get paid more than all of theirs. Again, we'll have 3 players making more than their top player just signed as a UFA.... but that's okay we're the better team that keeps losing to them.

At some point you have to look at the results.

Marner + Nylander + Matthews have not worked. Two of them are signed for multiple years after this one. If you're going to try something different, which you should, now is the chance.

I think we can win with Marner, I understand people who think we can't, and "trying something different" is an argument I understand. I just disagree with it as a guiding principle, and especially disagree with the logic that losing with Marner to a team without Marner proves that you can go further without Marner. anyway, HNIC vs Tampa tomorrow

 

[All Mod Cons]

Have we paid back all the money his camp thinks he missed out on yet? Or does that amount need to be tacked onto this deal?

 

[leafs in five]

Have we paid back all the money his camp thinks he missed out on yet? Or does that amount need to be tacked onto this deal?

good question. imo it needs to be tacked onto this deal

 

[thewave]

Have we paid back all the money his camp thinks he missed out on yet? Or does that amount need to be tacked onto this deal?

Now we have to pay damages for the Babsocks and other mean tweets etc he has had to endure. The suffering.

It just won't end. This group has decided it wants paid and winning is an afterthought. Perhaps when they get in their 30s they will get it. I don't blame the players for wanting to max their career earnings but, it will come with consequences if they don't win. PR and things like that won't look good.

JT and MM are the two most affected by this. Nylander but to a lesser extent. Matthews is the top scorer so he is fine.

 

[thewave]

good question. imo it needs to be tacked onto this deal

Mitch doesn't have a good rep after shitting the bed in elimination games. He is the far more talented forward Jake Gardner and people noticed. He has been called out by half the fanbase.

He is working his ass off to change it right now. Doing great too, but if those POs come around and he flops again with a 14m contract oh boy. That risk is real.

14m even 12.5m Marner and a playoff flop is going to be boo outta town potentially. I hope he delivers because I want to win like most here.

 

[leafs in five]

yes I agree that it's a risk to re-sign him for whatever giant number he gets. In that respect I think that re-signing MM is not an example of the team being totally risk-averse.

 

[thewave]

yes I agree that it's a risk to re-sign him for whatever giant number he gets. In that respect I think that re-signing MM is not an example of the team being totally risk-averse.

For the big 4 the best thing they could have done for their image considering the lack of playoff success is..

Matthews taking like 12.5m x 4

Nylander saying he was underpaid last time around and taking 10.5m or even 10.9m to match Mitch.

JT should admit he was overpaid or hint at it in a subtle way. Wanting to complete the job and get a cup here and take a 5x5m

Mitch should just take a contract at 11.5m but that won't happen now. Matching Nylander so we can win would save his face big time though. If he matches as a % with Nylander would probably save his face a bit too.

Winning a cup erases all issues. Can we afford the depth to do it? I hope so, the 3 year Cup window is looking very real

 

[JT AM da real deal]

1- Pastrnak goal is 100% on rielly and Samsonov

2- Pastrnak goal is not what hurt the leafs... Lindholm goal hurt toronto much more. An other time leafs failed to keep a lead late in a game under keefe. You took lead with 11 minutes and 2 min later you giving up game tying goal, it was the series killer who kept Boston alive, not the pastrnak goal

gm 3 giving up game winning 30 sec after tied it.

gm 1 vs florida: Was workibg hard and came back from 0-2 and gave up game winning goal 3 min later

gm 2 took a 2 goal lead and lost it

2023 gm 3 and 5 vs tampa gave up a goal 1 min later than oppening the score

2022 gm 7 tie the game and gave back the lead 3 min later

happening just too much to have playoff succes

Playoff hockey is always won by D and G .. we have not had it yet .. i think our D and G is much better this year .. Tanev McCabe OEL and Benoit should move da needle .. not sure yet about Hakanpaa .. but we all know Rielly can't get it done defensively when it counts .. Berube must coach around him at da appropriate times when game is on da line ie he needs to find da wood

 

[Dekes For Days]

Tampa/Florida/New York have no problem walking away from players. Tampa just walked away from their captain who was begging them to stay. Florida traded away Huberdeau after 115 points - second in the league that season. New York is already willing to trade their captain and never has any problem going to FA with money.

Tampa walked away from signing a 34 year old Stamkos who had fallen off a cliff, to sign a better, younger elite player.
Florida traded away Huberdeau after a wildly inflated point total he'd never repeat, to add a better, younger elite player.
New York is ready to trade their captain, because he isn't very good.
None of these situations apply to Marner. None of these teams did what you're suggesting we do.