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Merry Christmas, is dubas shopping for a top four D-man? Is Jakob Chychrun a Leaf trade target?

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Is Jakob Chychrun the answer to our defensive needs?

  • Total voters
    180
Wouldn't Marner or Nylander have to be involved due to cap reasons.

Unless you get rid of Engvall , Kerfoot , Dermott in the package but that's laughable Even if you add a 1st , 2'd , and robertson I still Think they get a better offer.

Would have to be Nylander +
But Nylander's been elite this year for his price tag .

I'd love Chychrun on the Leafs I just don't see how it gets done unless , We can Dump 3 Roster spots and give away pretty much all our prospects. Robertson , Liljegern , 1st , Dermott , Kerfoot? Idk man I just don't see how it could happen
 
MagicalRazor said:
Wouldn't Marner or Nylander have to be involved due to cap reasons.

Unless you get rid of Engvall , Kerfoot , Dermott in the package but that's laughable Even if you add a 1st , 2'd , and robertson I still Think they get a better offer.

Would have to be Nylander +
But Nylander's been elite this year for his price tag .

I'd love Chychrun on the Leafs I just don't see how it gets done unless , We can Dump 3 Roster spots and give away pretty much all our prospects. Robertson , Liljegern , 1st , Dermott , Kerfoot? Idk man I just don't see how it could happen
Click to expand...

In - Chychrun at 4.6
Out - Holl at 2
Sandin 900k or whatever he makes
Mikheyev at 1.65

That's pretty close. Not saying they would all be going to Arizona. Maybe something around Sandin, a 1st and Robertson/Amirov or Knies for Chychrun. Move Holl for a pick. Move Mikheyev for a pick. We've done well without him all season, hes a very minimal upgrade on Engvall, he doesn't want to play bottom 6 and he probably won't resign.

So we replace Sandin with Chychrun (upgrade), Holl with Dermott (upgrade in my mind) and Mikheyev really hasn't been here much at all this year anyway so no big loss there. Losing Sandin would suck but I don't see anything more than a #4 PP specialist in him. Chychrun could be an eventual Rielly replacement. Losing a late 1st isn't huge but the draft is a crapshoot anyway. Robertson, Amirov and Knies are still prospects and may never amount to anything but decent depth.
 
MagicalRazor said:
Wouldn't Marner or Nylander have to be involved due to cap reasons.

Unless you get rid of Engvall , Kerfoot , Dermott in the package but that's laughable Even if you add a 1st , 2'd , and robertson I still Think they get a better offer.

Would have to be Nylander +
But Nylander's been elite this year for his price tag .

I'd love Chychrun on the Leafs I just don't see how it gets done unless , We can Dump 3 Roster spots and give away pretty much all our prospects. Robertson , Liljegern , 1st , Dermott , Kerfoot? Idk man I just don't see how it could happen
Click to expand...

I'm not 100% sure on this, to get under the cap I think you could do something like trade Holl +,+,+ for Jacob and a player on the Yotes who is on IR and not expected back anytime soon, like Jaskin (3.2 mil, 1 year contract), who has a season ending injury, I think the IR Cap relief would give us room.
 
Griffin76 said:
In - Chychrun at 4.6
Out - Holl at 2
Sandin 900k or whatever he makes
Mikheyev at 1.65

That's pretty close. Not saying they would all be going to Arizona. Maybe something around Sandin, a 1st and Robertson/Amirov or Knies for Chychrun. Move Holl for a pick. Move Mikheyev for a pick. We've done well without him all season, hes a very minimal upgrade on Engvall, he doesn't want to play bottom 6 and he probably won't resign.

So we replace Sandin with Chychrun (upgrade), Holl with Dermott (upgrade in my mind) and Mikheyev really hasn't been here much at all this year anyway so no big loss there. Losing Sandin would suck but I don't see anything more than a #4 PP specialist in him. Chychrun could be an eventual Rielly replacement. Losing a late 1st isn't huge but the draft is a crapshoot anyway. Robertson, Amirov and Knies are still prospects and may never amount to anything but decent depth.
Click to expand...

I think your on to something there, I see Jacob as more of a Muzzin replacement because of Muzz's age, than a Morgan replacement but besides that I agree with you on all points.
 
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Reactions: Griffin76
I did the trade as follows.... It's a heck of a splash, but I think something that could work for both sides. It actually creates cap space for us as well. The only challenge being, would Arizona, a cash poor team, withhold for that long, and is there enough compensation there for it?

  1. Crouse, Lawson
  2. Chychrun, Jakob ($2,300,000 retained)
ARI

  1. Dermott, Travis
  2. Holl, Justin
  3. Ritchie, Nick
  4. Amirov, Rodion
  5. 2022 1st round pick (TOR)
  6. 2023 2nd round pick (TOR)
 
Fogelhund said:
I did the trade as follows.... It's a heck of a splash, but I think something that could work for both sides. It actually creates cap space for us as well. The only challenge being, would Arizona, a cash poor team, withhold for that long, and is there enough compensation there for it?

  1. Crouse, Lawson
  2. Chychrun, Jakob ($2,300,000 retained)
ARI

  1. Dermott, Travis
  2. Holl, Justin
  3. Ritchie, Nick
  4. Amirov, Rodion
  5. 2022 1st round pick (TOR)
  6. 2023 2nd round pick (TOR)
Click to expand...

I'm all for this. I'm thinking they're going to want Sandin instead of Dermott, especially if they're retaining.
 
MagicalRazor said:
Wouldn't Marner or Nylander have to be involved due to cap reasons.

Unless you get rid of Engvall , Kerfoot , Dermott in the package but that's laughable Even if you add a 1st , 2'd , and robertson I still Think they get a better offer.

Would have to be Nylander +
But Nylander's been elite this year for his price tag .

I'd love Chychrun on the Leafs I just don't see how it gets done unless , We can Dump 3 Roster spots and give away pretty much all our prospects. Robertson , Liljegern , 1st , Dermott , Kerfoot? Idk man I just don't see how it could happen
Click to expand...

No Arizona can't pay them, they can barely pay rent how do you expect them to pay Marner or Nylander
 
If you plan on giving up a significant part of what's left of the Leafs prospect pool/future what's going to be the sales pitch to convince Matthews (and Nylander and Brodie, then Marner) to re-sign in a few years?

Probably an easier pitch if they've won a Cup or two by then, but if Dubas goes big on a player that doesn't help push them over the top (or, more appropriately, gives them a series win or two) then not only will he be fired but his replacement will have the same job every other GM that's taken over this team: Clean up the mess.

Just thinking long game here and every year Dubas convinces himself this is the year ... and proceeds to make impactful moves that have zero net effect, the worse the future looks.
 
kevsh said:
If you plan on giving up a significant part of what's left of the Leafs prospect pool/future what's going to be the sales pitch to convince Matthews (and Nylander and Brodie, then Marner) to re-sign in a few years?

Probably an easier pitch if they've won a Cup or two by then, but if Dubas goes big on a player that doesn't help push them over the top (or, more appropriately, gives them a series win or two) then not only will he be fired but his replacement will have the same job every other GM that's taken over this team: Clean up the mess.

Just thinking long game here and every year Dubas convinces himself this is the year ... and proceeds to make impactful moves that have zero net effect, the worse the future looks.
Click to expand...

I'd agree with you, when it comes to spending assets on a rental. When it comes to spending assets on longer term upgrades for the team, that's something else. The prime piece here is a 23 D man, so it's not as if they make this trade, it isn't someone who will be around for years to come.
 
Griffin76 said:
In - Chychrun at 4.6
Out - Holl at 2
Sandin 900k or whatever he makes
Mikheyev at 1.65

That's pretty close. Not saying they would all be going to Arizona. Maybe something around Sandin, a 1st and Robertson/Amirov or Knies for Chychrun. Move Holl for a pick. Move Mikheyev for a pick. We've done well without him all season, hes a very minimal upgrade on Engvall, he doesn't want to play bottom 6 and he probably won't resign.

So we replace Sandin with Chychrun (upgrade), Holl with Dermott (upgrade in my mind) and Mikheyev really hasn't been here much at all this year anyway so no big loss there. Losing Sandin would suck but I don't see anything more than a #4 PP specialist in him. Chychrun could be an eventual Rielly replacement. Losing a late 1st isn't huge but the draft is a crapshoot anyway. Robertson, Amirov and Knies are still prospects and may never amount to anything but decent depth.
Click to expand...
This would leave us with a 19 player roster and no cap space.
 
Logically a Chychrun move in would see both Muzzin and Sandin moved out. Chychrun takes Muzzin's minutes today, and blocks Sandin's path forward on the team. Spend from the redundancy that's being created.
 
Don't know enough about Chychrun to answer this but we need a D with a big clapper from the back end to help our PP out a bit.

Does he have a booming shot every now and then?
 
kevsh said:
If you plan on giving up a significant part of what's left of the Leafs prospect pool/future what's going to be the sales pitch to convince Matthews (and Nylander and Brodie, then Marner) to re-sign in a few years?

Probably an easier pitch if they've won a Cup or two by then, but if Dubas goes big on a player that doesn't help push them over the top (or, more appropriately, gives them a series win or two) then not only will he be fired but his replacement will have the same job every other GM that's taken over this team: Clean up the mess.

Just thinking long game here and every year Dubas convinces himself this is the year ... and proceeds to make impactful moves that have zero net effect, the worse the future looks.
Click to expand...

I'm thinking the sales pitch is pretty simple. For the next ~10 years they build around

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Bunting, Amirov, Knies, Rielly, Chychrun, Liljegren, Niemela.

Amirov and Knies may eventually become cap casualties or decent depth.

Tavares, Brodie, Muzzin....will be offered Spezza/Simmonds type deals (maybe a little higher in Tavares' case) if they want to remain with the team and have a chance at a cup.
 
Griffin76 said:
I'm thinking the sales pitch is pretty simple. For the next ~10 years they build around

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Bunting, Amirov, Knies, Rielly, Chychrun, Liljegren, Niemela.

Amirov and Knies may eventually become cap casualties or decent depth.

Tavares, Brodie, Muzzin....will be offered Spezza/Simmonds type deals (maybe a little higher in Tavares' case) if they want to remain with the team and have a chance at a cup.
Click to expand...

Brodie will not be taking an 82% pay cut
 
4thline said:
Logically a Chychrun move in would see both Muzzin and Sandin moved out. Chychrun takes Muzzin's minutes today, and blocks Sandin's path forward on the team. Spend from the redundancy that's being created.
Click to expand...

I doubt Muzzin agrees to go to Arizona
 
kevsh said:
If you plan on giving up a significant part of what's left of the Leafs prospect pool/future what's going to be the sales pitch to convince Matthews (and Nylander and Brodie, then Marner) to re-sign in a few years?

Probably an easier pitch if they've won a Cup or two by then, but if Dubas goes big on a player that doesn't help push them over the top (or, more appropriately, gives them a series win or two) then not only will he be fired but his replacement will have the same job every other GM that's taken over this team: Clean up the mess.

Just thinking long game here and every year Dubas convinces himself this is the year ... and proceeds to make impactful moves that have zero net effect, the worse the future looks.
Click to expand...


There is only one possible answer... pools and pools of money .... money is always the answer... those that say money wont bring you happiness ... have never had FU money.

 
LEAFANFORLIFE23 said:
I doubt Muzzin agrees to go to Arizona
Click to expand...

Likely not. But his departure would almost certainly be a piece of the Chychrun puzzle. It's a very complicated move to bring a marginal on-ice upgrade, some cap space, and long term upside instead of downside.

I'd be thinking like the Turris/Duchene move (hopefully to better result)

Leafs send Muzzin+Sandin+X
Leafs receive Chychrun

Team Y sends 1st + Y
Team Y receives Muzzin

Coyotes send Chychrun
Coyotes receive 1st+Sandin+X+Y

Is it worth it? I don't know. But it alleviates our current cap crunch, frees up 1m the next two seasons, adds a year of cost certainty, removes the risk of Muzzin declining, adds some upside as Chychrun comes into his prime.
 
TOGuy14 said:
Don't know enough about Chychrun to answer this but we need a D with a big clapper from the back end to help our PP out a bit.

Does he have a booming shot every now and then?
Click to expand...


SCOUTING REPORT
Has excellent size for the National Hockey League, plus plenty of all-around ability. Can log huge minutes, play a physical game and produce points fairly regularly thanks to a good point shot. Can be used in any game situation. Is somewhat inconsistent in terms of his physicality. Must also continue to hone his defensive game in order to become a premier shutdown defenseman in the NHL. Must also prove he can be a consistent point producer.
Long Range Potential: Talented, big-minute defenseman with good upside.
 
Fogelhund said:
I'd agree with you, when it comes to spending assets on a rental. When it comes to spending assets on longer term upgrades for the team, that's something else. The prime piece here is a 23 D man, so it's not as if they make this trade, it isn't someone who will be around for years to come.
Click to expand...

I'm disappointed that Dubas has a, in some of his recent trades, worry about today attitude. I like the trades that give you control for a couple of years. For me if you trade for a guy for a cup run , your odds of having that trade pay off, in your favor are remote. Long term they wont pay off at all and short term you a have 1 in 31 chance of it paying off. Which is why, at a minimum, I prefer if you trade for a player you have them on your team for at least the season you are playing plus the following season. I despise "own" rentals, giving away an asset for nothing irk's me to no end.
 
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